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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › Where is the AMA?
07-22-2018 10:26 PM  27 days agoPost 1
TMoore

rrMaster

Cookeville, TN

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Watch at YouTube

Delayed Response Operator Not Engaged
AMA SECTION 336 = Good
Drones = EVIL

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07-22-2018 10:28 PM  27 days agoPost 2
chopper37

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NJ and Long Island

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took our dues and ran!!

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07-23-2018 03:45 AM  27 days agoPost 3
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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And that’s why I didn’t bother renewing... cause it makes no difference if you give the AMA money. The big players in the industry that will have a vested interest in drone tech will run all over tiny worthless associations like the AMA to their benefit and to the detriment of our hobby.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-23-2018 04:01 AM  27 days agoPost 4
Jerry K

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Houston Area

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Was the AMA invited to this fiasco? I am guessing you don't just show up and sit at the table and scribble out your own name tag. I am guessing the 'Chair' didn't want the AMA there! He had an agenda! OBVIOUSLY.

BTW I was impressed with Bruce's RANT, and agree with most if not all of it.

Wasn't XJet one of the originators of 2.4 or was that someone else I am remembering?

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07-23-2018 05:58 PM  26 days agoPost 5
cudaboy_71

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sacramento, ca, u.s.

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Jerry K
Wasn't XJet one of the originators of 2.4 or was that someone else I am remembering?
Could be. I don't recognize the name. But, Paul Beard is considered the 'father of spread spectrum'. He's a member here and flew out at the Bayside field when it was still open. Dunno what he's up to now.

if it ain't broke, break it.

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07-23-2018 07:00 PM  26 days agoPost 6
Darkbird

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Jackson Michigan

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There is a response from AMA somewhere on their website, the gist of it is that they weren't invited but were able to attend, which doesn't seem to have gotten them anything. I'll have to go see if I can find where that was quoted from.

Edit: Still can't find it direct, but here it is copy/pasted from another site.
“This round table was regarding Counter UAS measures and not intended to be focused on recreational flying; therefore, legislators did not call upon AMA to testify as subject matter experts. Never-the-less, the AMA Government Affairs team did attend this Counter UAS meeting, and many legislators and industry experts stated hobbyists are not the problem. While excerpts of this meeting seemed detrimental to model aviation, it is important to note that many legislators were supportive of our hobby. We remain active in House discussions, but our focus has shifted to the Senate because the House already adopted our language on Section 336 weeks prior to this round table. In fact, while the House Aviation Subcommittee was assembled, other members of our team were meeting with the Department of Defense and key members of the Senate to preserve our hobby. The most current information is available on our website at modelaircraft.org/gov and we encourage you to reach out with any questions.”

"Whadda ya mean "There's a loose nut behind the transmitter!"?"

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07-23-2018 07:28 PM  26 days agoPost 7
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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Darkbird
it is important to note that many legislators were supportive of our hobby.
Yeah Ive heard that load of tripe numerous times before... its a BS statement.

The AMA should've been there because we are affected be it directly or indirectly should these countermeasures be made law. They already have a no RC fly rule 5 miles from any airport or fullsize aircraft landing site... which puts 90% of us in the cross hairs of any law enforcement agent to get on his monthly cycle and run all over us.

The AMA puts more effort in collecting their dues than representation and protection of our rights...

Im going pirate... I no longer have a need for the AMA and have been just fine without them for the last 6 months, cant even use their worthless magazine to wipe my a$$ with.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-23-2018 07:42 PM  26 days agoPost 8
banshee rider

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Phoenix AZ.

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AMA’s response:

“This round table was regarding Counter UAS measures and not intended to be focused on recreational flying; therefore, legislators did not call upon AMA to testify as subject matter experts. Never-the-less, the AMA Government

Affairs team "did attend" this Counter UAS meeting,
and many legislators and
industry experts stated hobbyists are not the problem. While excerpts of this meeting seemed detrimental to model aviation, it is important to note that many legislators were supportive of our hobby. We remain active in House discussions, but our focus has shifted to the Senate because the House already adopted our language on Section 336 weeks prior to this round table. In fact, while the House Aviation Subcommittee was assembled, other members of our team were meeting with the Department of Defense and key members of the Senate to preserve our hobby. The most current information is available on our website at modelaircraft.org/gov and we encourage you to reach out with any questions.”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Seems as though a lot of people here are getting there pantys all wadded up about nothing again

AMA was present at the meeting doing there job

ageing is manditory maturity is optional

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07-23-2018 08:48 PM  26 days agoPost 9
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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banshee rider
AMA was present at the meeting doing there job
how so? IF they were there, and thats a big ol "IF"... obviously they had no input, and were not even asked to be there, and gave no insight into countermeasure systems and activities as described in the video.... So you obviously didnt watch the video... they are there to get rid of sec 336, the female legislator said it clear as day starting at 3:45 into the video... by saying that "...section 336 ... is the fundamental barrier to effective implementation of these policy changes..."
those groups there are trying to get this rule struck out so they can do what they want... WHO? they are the AAA a cabal of manufactures in the drone tech for commercial/military use... this includes the other lady representing the National Drone alliance, they want highways in the skys and cant proceed if we pose a risk (see/listen to what she says from 6:30 to 7:45
So...
The only ones they talked to were those with a financial interest in the matter... AMA was there to receive said wadding for panties IMHO and stick their bottom lips out.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-23-2018 09:50 PM  26 days agoPost 10
Heli_Splatter

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USA

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Section 336 regarding recreational drone use is now Section 343
The following link has the text of the document being considered:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th...use-bill/4/text

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07-23-2018 09:52 PM  26 days agoPost 11
ticedoff8

rrKey Veteran

Morgan Hill, CA. USA

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Don't throw AMA under the bus.
Only organizations with ties to Russia (like the NRA) get special treatment.

Welcome to Trump-World:
75% focus on business, 25% focus on Russia and 0 left for citizens.

Believe 1/2 of what you see and none of what you hear.
Fake News will be the downfall of our Republic!

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07-23-2018 10:18 PM  26 days agoPost 12
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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thats purely a political statement and should be removed... there is a place for such talk... and its not here.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-23-2018 10:32 PM  26 days agoPost 13
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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thx Heli-splatter...

so they renamed it and basically added provisions for the FAA to say "where" we can fly...???
SEC. 343. SPECIAL RULES FOR MODEL AIRCRAFT.
(a) In General.—Notwithstanding any other provision of law relating to the incorporation of unmanned aircraft systems into Federal Aviation Administration plans and policies, including this subtitle, the Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration may not promulgate any rule or regulation regarding a model aircraft or an aircraft being developed as a model aircraft, except for—

(1) rules regarding the registration of certain model aircraft pursuant to section 44103; and

(2) rules regarding unmanned aircraft that by design provide advanced flight capabilities enabling active, sustained, and controlled navigation of the aircraft beyond the visual line of sight of the operator, if—

(A) the aircraft is flown strictly for hobby or recreational use;

(B) the model aircraft operator is a current member of a community-based organization and whose aircraft is operated in accordance with the organization’s safety rules;

(C) the aircraft is limited to not more than 55 pounds unless otherwise certified through a design, construction, inspection, flight test, and operational safety program administered by a community-based organization;

(D) the aircraft is operated in a manner that does not interfere with and gives way to any manned aircraft;

(E) the aircraft is not operated over or within the property of a fixed site facility that operates amusement rides available for use by the general public or the property extending 500 lateral feet beyond the perimeter of such facility unless the operation is authorized by the owner of the amusement facility; and

(F) when flown within 5 miles of an airport, the operator of the aircraft provides the airport operator and the airport air traffic control tower (when an air traffic facility is located at the airport) with prior notice of the operation (model aircraft operators flying from a permanent location within 5 miles of an airport should establish a mutually agreed upon operating procedure with the airport operator and the airport air traffic control tower (when an air traffic facility is located at the airport)).

(b) Automated Instant Authorization.—When the FAA has developed and implemented an automated airspace authorization system for the airspace in which the operator wants to operate, the model aircraft operator shall use this system for authorization to controlled airspace unless flown—

(1) at a permanent location agreed to by the Administrator; and

(2) in accordance with a mutually agreed upon operating procedure established with the airport operator and the airport air traffic control tower (when an air traffic facility is located at the airport).

(d) Commercial Operation For Instructional Or Educational Purposes.—A flight of an unmanned aircraft shall be treated as a flight of a model aircraft for purposes of subsection (a) (regardless of any compensation, reimbursement, or other consideration exchanged or incidental economic benefit gained in the course of planning, operating, or supervising the flight), if the flight is—

(1) conducted for instructional or educational purposes; and

(2) operated or supervised by a member of a community-based organization recognized pursuant to subsection (e).

(e) Statutory Construction.—Nothing in this section may be construed to limit the authority of the Administrator to pursue enforcement action against persons operating model aircraft who endanger the safety of the national airspace system.

(f) Community-Based Organization Defined.—In this section, the term “community-based organization” means a nationwide membership-based association entity that—

(1) is described in section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986;

(2) is exempt from tax under section 501(a) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986;

(3) the mission of which is demonstrably the furtherance of model aviation;

(4) provides a comprehensive set of safety guidelines for all aspects of model aviation addressing the assembly and operation of model aircraft and that emphasize safe aeromodeling operations within the national airspace system and the protection and safety of individuals and property on the ground, and may provide a comprehensive set of safety rules and programming for the operation of unmanned aircraft that have the advanced flight capabilities enabling active, sustained, and controlled navigation of the aircraft beyond visual line of sight of the operator;

(5) provides programming and support for any local charter organizations, affiliates, or clubs; and

(6) provides assistance and support in the development and operation of locally designated model aircraft flying sites.

(g) Recognition Of Community-Based Organizations.—In collaboration with aeromodelling stakeholders, the Administrator shall publish an advisory circular within 180 days of enactment that identifies the criteria and process required for recognition of nationwide community-based organizations. This recognition shall be in the form of a memorandum of agreement between the FAA and each community-based organization and does not require regulatory action to implement.

(h) Effective Date.—Except for rules to implement remote identification for unmanned aircraft that by design provide advanced flight capabilities enabling active, sustained, and controlled navigation of the aircraft beyond the visual line of sight of the operator and for rules regarding the registration of certain model aircraft pursuant to section 44103, this section shall become effective when the rule, referred to in section 532 of the FAA Reauthorization Act of 2018, regarding revisions to part 107 of title 14, Code of Federal Regulations, becomes final.
this is like getting rid of guns by outlawing the sale of ammunition...

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-23-2018 11:16 PM  26 days agoPost 14
TMoore

rrMaster

Cookeville, TN

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7.2 mile BLOS test on the island of Maui.

Watch at YouTube

Delayed Response Operator Not Engaged
AMA SECTION 336 = Good
Drones = EVIL

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07-24-2018 12:30 AM  26 days agoPost 15
Heli_Splatter

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Troubling Language
I find the wording of 343 a(2)(A-F) troubling. I see this to be missing a limiting phrase such as "unless".

The way I read it is that; no rule can be created except for registration and controlling FPV flight. There should be the word "unless" added before the if--

I think it was meant to say (2) rules regarding unmanned aircraft that by design provide advanced flight capabilities enabling active, sustained, and controlled navigation of the aircraft beyond the visual line of sight of the operator, unless if—

I think that the way it is written, the language gives them a wide open door to regulate FPV. I don't think that was what was intended. What do you think?

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07-24-2018 01:13 AM  26 days agoPost 16
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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Given the very nature of the people that were at the hearing Im positive the wording was designed to limit what and where the recreational UAS pilot can do under the guise of protecting future commercially operated systems and their designated "sky ways". The people at the table represented the vested interest of primarily commercial use of drones... and not one of them is on the side of the individual hobbyist by what they said... The wording after re-reading it pretty much opens the door to further regulation by the FAA that will likely lead to us only being able to fly at expressly designated ares and within the restrictions set forth at each location. The time limits they set forth also limit any legal action that may brought forward by anyone, unless they have the funds to pull such strings... No more park flying, flying on your own property and certainly no flying anywhere commercial operation of drones my be happening. The guy getting his personal pan pizza by air is now more valuable than you are with your Trex500...

The AMA has been relegated to nothing more than a toothless interest club with a diminishing future directly tied to legislation of UAS in favor of big business.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-24-2018 01:56 AM  26 days agoPost 17
Quicktoy

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Venice, FL USA

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I pay my dues so I’m insured to fly a 700 sized helicopter that could kill a half a dozen people designed and built in China running on almost 50 volts at a registered AMA field in case some one gets hurt. $100 a year for that kind of insurance is peanuts. It’s nothing. So whats everyone complaining about again?

Srimok, Goblin 770, Avant Aurora, Trex 700 Suzi Hans, 700 LE, 700 FBL, Trex 450 Dominator X2, HC500, and a crap ton of parts with no time to fly! :)

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07-24-2018 02:37 AM  26 days agoPost 18
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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Quicktoy
I’m insured to fly a 700 sized helicopter that could kill a half a dozen people designed and built in China running on almost 50 volts at a registered AMA field in case some one gets hurt. $100 a year for that kind of insurance is peanuts.
that only comes AFTER all other insurance policies have paid their parts... like homeowners insurance and property insurance...

The Fuss is about you being able to fly what you want wherever you choose to as long as your adhering to basic AMA rules... the new proposed regulation will put commercial needs ahead of those in recreational use. That means you will not longer have any say so nor will your club should they designate your flying site as a route used by commercial drones.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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07-24-2018 12:49 PM  25 days agoPost 19
Quicktoy

rrApprentice

Venice, FL USA

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I was a commercial pilot 20 years ago. Haven’t flown since the day I graduated from embry riddle. That being said, you may not have known it but there are airways up there that have been up there for a long time that you don’t know about. It’s just progress. When they invented cars there weren’t roads. If you drive your car somewhere then you can’t really complain. That road you’re driving on was taken(purchased in some cases) from multiple peoples’ land. Without creating those roads guess where we’d be today? 100 years behind North Korea.
Like I said. I’m grateful the AMA insures me for a mere $100 a year. If my RC field loses airspace over it then it does. I find a new field.

Srimok, Goblin 770, Avant Aurora, Trex 700 Suzi Hans, 700 LE, 700 FBL, Trex 450 Dominator X2, HC500, and a crap ton of parts with no time to fly! :)

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07-24-2018 01:18 PM  25 days agoPost 20
vfinohio

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Columbus. Ohio - U.S.A.

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I think it's worth noting that in that clip, what other organization or group was mentioned as representing the hobby or hobbyist? Can you give me a name so we can join that group? I always find it ironic that people who complain that the AMA doesn't represent them refuse to be a part of the AMA. It's like complaining about election results but not voting. The AMA is not perfect but that video shows that they are talking to people in government. The fact of the matter is that our hobby is threatened by forces bigger then us with a lot more money. If you are going to complain about what you perceive the AMA isn't doing, can you also offer some ideas on what they can do better (given the resources they have) or tell us what you are doing to help the situation? I mean no offense with the last question, I really would like to know.

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