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HomeTurbineAircraftHelicopterTurbine Helicopters › Help !! Twin turbine heli control using 18mz
05-25-2018 09:36 PM  24 days agoPost 1
darren heaver

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rochester, kent, england.

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Hi, I'm in the process of starting a new project which will be powered by a pair of wren 50i heli turbines. I am struggling to find a way of controlling the engines independantly at start sequence so you can start 1 then once at idle start the second engine. I'm using a 18mz trans but can't find a solution as multi engines is not an option if heli is selected. Was wondering if someone has any ideas ???

" one day I will learn to fly till then I will just hover"

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05-25-2018 09:59 PM  24 days agoPost 2
dgoss999

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UK - Lancashire

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Darren,

This could possibly work.. (or maybe worth a try..)

Bind and run 2 Receivers in the Model.. Put the 2nd Turbine throttle only on Rx2.. Start the 1st Turbine and get to idle with Rx2 powered off. Power on the 2nd Rx while Idling the 1st Turbine (thottle in the run/idle).. At this point, the 2nd Rx will power up and present a run/idle throttle position to 2nd turbine (which is just now waiting for the start sequence). Push the throttle to max and down, the 1st turbine WILL accelerate, but the 2nd turbine will see this as a start request. Once both turbines are started, they should both follow the same throttle curve, however pulling the throttle trim to stop will stop both engines..

Potentially DANGEROUS solution... :-) Rx2 could be remotely powered on/off with a switched channel in Rx1, controlling a DC switch (like for a searchlight etc..) Risky but doable. Just NEVER accidentally turn it off else Turbine 2 will flame out!!
DG

"Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see." • Benjamin Franklin

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05-25-2018 10:08 PM  24 days agoPost 3
modtron

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Oxford. UK

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I have no knowledge of Wren ECU’s but I’m guessing as soon as any of the receivers are turned off, then the EVU will shut down ?
There will be a very easy way to do what you need - can you email me a copy of your model file and I’ll return it to you with a way that will do it.

modtron@aol.com

modtron
Oxford UK

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05-25-2018 10:12 PM  24 days agoPost 4
dgoss999

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UK - Lancashire

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I just posted a crap response here. Sorry.... :-(

The ECU will not shut down.. It should go to Failsafe or possibly run the turbine into a shutdown sequence (flameout). But ideally, once both turbine are running, both Rx should stay on Power until the end of flight..

"Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see." • Benjamin Franklin

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05-25-2018 10:24 PM  24 days agoPost 5
modtron

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Oxford. UK

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I can understand it going to failsafe when signal line is interrupted, but cant see that happening when power is turned off ?

modtron
Oxford UK

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05-25-2018 10:31 PM  24 days agoPost 6
dgoss999

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UK - Lancashire

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On second thoughts yes it would just flame out if you just dropped the power to the 2nd Rx.. Once the 2nd Rx is powered up, don't turn it off till the flight is over.. I was considering the remote SW for Rx2 was a useful solution, but maybe too dangerous.. :-(

DG

"Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see." • Benjamin Franklin

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05-25-2018 10:41 PM  24 days agoPost 7
modtron

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Oxford. UK

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Yes, sorry Dave, couldn’t see the front end of the ECU working without any power ?
But the problem is easily sorted.
So again, if the original poster wants to email me his model file - I can return him a working solution.
Just need to see what he has set up already as a guide.

On another note - what size machine are 2 x Wren 50 engines going into ???

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05-25-2018 10:43 PM  24 days agoPost 8
dgoss999

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+1 Curious too. ??

"Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see." • Benjamin Franklin

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05-25-2018 11:48 PM  24 days agoPost 9
darren heaver

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rochester, kent, england.

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Dave you know the model its the large BK117 I have that had the 50cc petrol
engine converted to methanol in it.
I'm at work at the moment and have not got anything with me. It is not about the amount of power that the heli needs its just I think it will be a challenge and sound great .
Nigel when you say model file do you mean from the radio ? If so I have not really got that far as I could not find how to get the twin turbines to work so have not gone much further. The only way that I found that would possibly work is running one off an Aux channel controlled by the throttle stick and different trim but then did not know how that would affect the throttle hold or other functions like throttle cut.

" one day I will learn to fly till then I will just hover"

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05-25-2018 11:51 PM  24 days agoPost 10
darren heaver

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rochester, kent, england.

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I think it is about 1/5 scale bk117 blade disc is about 2.1m ish

" one day I will learn to fly till then I will just hover"

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05-26-2018 07:48 AM  24 days agoPost 11
modtron

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Oxford. UK

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Ok Darren, I’ll sort out a model program with some instructions as to how it works.
If you pm me your email, I’ll send it to you over the weekend.

Please keep in mind that if it ends up over 20kg, then it’s a legal requirement to have it registered with the LMA/CAA and the build/installation inspected.
It will also require a flight testing schedule.

modtron
Oxford UK

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05-26-2018 08:53 AM  24 days agoPost 12
eeeeky

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Roosevelt UT USA

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What i would do, is plug the second ECU into an aux channel, and set a PMIX to run that channel from the throttle stick. This mix can be activated by a switch. You can also make the original throttle channel inactive when the switch is in this mode. Therefore you could start engine #1, flip the switch and start the second engine. Use a 3 position switch, and return throttle control with one of the positions available.

Also, you MUST post pictures of this heli....ASAP. haha

Lets Fly!

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05-26-2018 11:56 AM  24 days agoPost 13
darren heaver

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rochester, kent, england.

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Thanks for the advice eeeeky I have also pm Modtron for his help. I think in starting to get my head around the prog/mix slightly never used them before as all my other heli are normal in comparison. What’s the saying ? You never stop learning

" one day I will learn to fly till then I will just hover"

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05-26-2018 05:59 PM  24 days agoPost 14
MattJen

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UK

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Good luck Darren,
nice machine 1/4 scale, hope you achieve it. It can be done as there is a video of someone, I think it was Martin Solner, running twin turbines in a 1/3 scale Ecureuil

AKAIK I think it was 2 Jakodofskys.

EDIT - Found VIDEO.

Watch at YouTube

All The Best

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05-26-2018 08:55 PM  23 days agoPost 15
darren heaver

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rochester, kent, england.

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Hi Matt !! Modtron has been a big help and sent me a model file to download onto my 18mz that should do exactly what I was looking for. It’s just getting your head around the prog/mixes. Cheers for the pics
It only the last few months that I have really got back to my old self and started to feel ok again. It’s been a hard few yrs but hopefully more in control now

" one day I will learn to fly till then I will just hover"

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05-28-2018 11:07 AM  22 days agoPost 16
MattJen

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UK

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Hi Darren,
Great news mate,i to have found Modtron very helpful and knowledgeable on all turbine brands and radio setups your in safe hands, glad you getting back to the old self, look forward to seeing that BK117 rise from the ashes...
Hopefully catch up sometime as I am having a lot of fun with an ECO 7 jetranger on 35meg, my zealous has just sat for the last 18months in shed, so I am keen to get that out sometime..

All The Best

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