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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersEngines › CDI zenoah 20cc, stator gator and GV1
05-13-2018 05:53 PM  3 years ago
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Rojoalfa

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Punta de Mata, Monagas-Venezuela

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CDI zenoah 20cc, stator gator and GV1
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My radikal G20 FC with zenoah 20cc refused to fly...

Motor in idle OK but rpm not increase.

Carburator... Check
Spark plug... Check
Throttle curve... Check
Stator gator... Check... Clean connections.
GV-1... Reading rpm out of control... From 500 to 1500...very unstable.
Motor is very stable, so reading rpm not consistent with motor behavior.

By the time I increase throttle, motor don't develop High rpm...less than hover rpm... 1550 rpm.

Just one time, motor gets explosion to Carburator...by the time I was starting up.

Stator gator has nothing to do in this problem... It is reading from sensor.

CDI... Sensor...

Any ideas.

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-13-2018 06:47 PM  3 years ago
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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Not mentioned is that it was all working before with no issues and now this?

I would just bypass GV1 and stator gator to assure its definitely not the engine despite running smooth at idle.

Carb to engine isolator metal or original plastic?

FWIW...I dont use a stator gator on mine.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
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05-13-2018 08:13 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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By pass gv1 and startor gator.
Motor in idle ok... Very stable.
It seems to me, at the first time, transition problem.

My radikal has 150 flights... Then , it was difficult to get started. I change spark plug... Nothing... Clean carb several times...nothing... Very bad transition between LO and HI.

Today, after cleaning carb with xilene, finally motor gets started but... According to reading on gv1 with stator gator, rpm is out of control.
Something Is not well here...

So, transition problem? Or cdi gets saturated and fail...

I need to do some other test before buy something.

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-13-2018 11:49 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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Pistol Pete Carb to engine isolator metal or original plastic?
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Plastic from stock.

I did spray with WD40 near isolator to see if motor accelerate... No response.

That means no leaking packer over there. No air coming from outside.

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-14-2018 02:03 AM  3 years ago
rbort

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Franklin, MA - USA

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its simple
Your ignition module is bad. Won't work under load. Try changing that if you have a spare and once the motor is working try to narrow down the issue.

Might be even as simple as the plug cap is not on all the way. Its in the ignition, that's where you need to look.

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 27 3DMax, 4516 flts
Spectra-G Hanson 27 3DMax, 3510 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 2095 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 1040 flts
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05-14-2018 02:10 AM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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I think stator gator is dead meat.

If hall sensor is bad, there is no way to motor to be quite stable.

/

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-14-2018 07:55 PM  3 years ago
JuanRodriguez

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The Villages, Florida

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Rojoalfa I think stator gator is dead meat.

If hall sensor is bad, there is no way to motor to be quite stable.
Not clear if you bypassed the stator gator and tried your tests without it .....
Been there, done that and old enough to know better.....
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05-15-2018 10:02 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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JuanRodriguez Not clear if you bypassed the stator gator and tried your tests without it .....
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I disconnect SG from gv1.
Motor was very stable in idle.

I close HI needle and check rpm with throttle full...
Motor keeps running but behavior in high speed change... So, hi needle probably working OK... Transition is doing OK I mean.

That is why I think Cdi is not working for some reason.

Is There a way Cdi get saturated when rpm is increasing?

I run Cdi with a 6 amp BEC also...

I am going to check this BEC.

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-17-2018 01:49 AM  3 years ago
oldfart

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Vancouver, Canada

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What battery are you using to power the CDI?Phil
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05-17-2018 10:54 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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oldfart What battery are you using to power the CDI?
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I'm using a 2s LiFe 3800 mah from hyperion.

That battery is for both electronics and CDI.

It allowed four full flights between charges.

Bec seem to be OK... Not getting hot... Normal...

I don't get it. Cdi is working OK at idle, then fail at hi rpm and then back to normal in idle.

Electronic don't work that way.. Isn't it?

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-18-2018 05:37 PM  3 years ago
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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Zenoah CDI or RcExl?
If zenoah, do yourself a favor and dump it.
RcExcel CDI dont need a BEC.
Consider also ditching the stator gator.

Unclear if you didnt have any issues before or is this a new heli for you?
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
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05-19-2018 02:40 AM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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My century radikal g 20cc has 159 flights . Very nice and cheaper helicopter to Fly.

My other gasser helicopter run with magneto ... Very simple design.

My first spark plug run that 159 flights.
Problem beging when that spark plug died.

After replace spark plug, motor did not run at HI rpm ...
Run very well in idle.

Stator gator failed... Ok... So, it is dead meat.

Carburator have more than 5 times cleaning procedures.
We check transition LO to HI rpm... Carb seems to be Good.

Cdi... My suspect...
I decided to install a BEC looking for isolate the electronic from electromagnetic issues. That was because I used one battery to energize the whole system.

Other way to test this Zenoah cdi before I get a hammer and finish that suffer?

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-19-2018 07:27 AM  3 years ago
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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Rojoalfa My first spark plug run that 159 flights.
Problem beging when that spark plug died.
Spark plug brand and gap?
Gap 21 to 25 range...start with lower number.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
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05-20-2018 05:29 AM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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Spark plug from stock... Champion Y82 with 0.025" Gap.

Spark plug without resistor.
Good spark plug.
I removed metal cap without problems several flights before ...
Very difficult to removed on my helicopter.

Zenoah 20cc is hard to start... Good idle , Good performance.

In my case, carburator plugged with something and bad transition or cdi failure... Or something else?

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-26-2018 07:21 PM  3 years ago
Pistol Pete

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Short of replacing CDI...a few more notes:
Rojoalfa Problem beging when that spark plug died.
How did you determing plug needed replacing?

What color did it have...gray, tan-brown, black?

While you did spray WD40 to check for insulator leakage, best to run finger around edges and check for wet fuel, indicative of an air leak. Other option is to remove, place hot side (engine side) on a mirror and shine a small light inside its center and look for reflecting light outside its perimeter. You can also use 400 grit sandpaper and use a flat surface to assure it's true and flat or consider getting an aluminum one.

While the original manual...
http://www.zenoah.co.jp/int/downloa...ry=G200&types=O
...doesn't have a spark plug gap suggestion, I go with the low end at .021in as higher gaps requires higher voltage and can misfire at high speeds.

Manual below has gap suggestion...

http://www.toni-clark.com/ftp/ZG20_en.pdf

Final note...the carb throtle shaft does wear out due to vibrations and also create an air leak. Check by moving side to side when compared to choke shaft which doesnt see as much vibration wear since it is not connected to a servo.

There are better performing carb than the 811 it came with such as the 643. Something else to consider vs a rekit...ON SALE!

http://www.davesmotors.com/wt-643-carburetor.html

Dont you just love gassers?

Hope you find your issue.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
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05-27-2018 03:59 PM  3 years ago
rbort

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Franklin, MA - USA

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2 weeks gone by and not sure why you're not trying a new CDI as of yet. I'm pretty confident that's the problem (something related to that) You will need a good CDI and then you can narrow it down from there.

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 27 3DMax, 4516 flts
Spectra-G Hanson 27 3DMax, 3510 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 2095 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 1040 flts
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05-27-2018 07:19 PM  3 years ago
JuanRodriguez

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The Villages, Florida

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rbort 2 weeks gone by and not sure why you're not trying a new CDI as of yet
Can you say stubborn ??
Been there, done that and old enough to know better.....
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05-30-2018 01:06 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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Punta de Mata, Monagas-Venezuela

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OH no!!!...

It is not easy for me to get new replacements... That is why I insist in procedures to check my equipment... Prior to get parts...

/
Saludos cordiales,
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05-30-2018 03:36 PM  3 years ago
rbort

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Franklin, MA - USA

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I totally understand
Is it possible you can find somebody in your area that has the same engine and you can borrow their CDI just to try it on your engine?

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 27 3DMax, 4516 flts
Spectra-G Hanson 27 3DMax, 3510 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 2095 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 1040 flts
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06-19-2018 02:06 PM  3 years ago
Rojoalfa

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Punta de Mata, Monagas-Venezuela

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When you are in a hurry... Something happen...

The starter coupling fail in my radikal G20 cc...

Spare coupling that I have are 6mm shaft... For raptor 50...

Well, at this time, I am doing a welding solutions... Using the 5mm part of the old coupling with the new one...

/
Saludos cordiales,
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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersEngines › CDI zenoah 20cc, stator gator and GV1
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