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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsOther › Flybarless bearings
04-24-2016 03:29 AM  4 years ago
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X-Cell Man

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Haubstadt, IN - USA

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Flybarless bearings
Hi all!

I have a question on a flybarless rotor head. I just bought a brand new head. This is a pre assemble head. One of the blade grip you can hardly more/rotate. and the other blade grip feels like bearing notchy. The place I bought this head said its fine. when you spool up the G forces will fix it. plus its only moving 1/4 inch.
I have been flying RC Helicopter since 1978. Has this changed? I have been told by many of the top flyers that notchy bearing and non smooth moving blade grips will cause blades coming out and not staying in track.
I did take the rotor head apart round a very notchy bearing and on the other side found 3 locking washers in between bearing and thrust bearings. Not sure why they use them for spacers. Then they go and said it would work just fine, I shouldn't have taken it apart and I have to send it back in to redone.
So am I wrong? Why would I send it back? I just need them to replace the bad bearing(s) and why can't I rebuild the head?

Thank you

Dan
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04-24-2016 03:47 AM  4 years ago
don s

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Chesapeake, VA

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Lock washers? Really?

FB or FBL, the head should be smooth, not notchy.
E820, Raptor G4N, X50F/E, E620, Forza 450, and some planks.
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04-24-2016 05:22 AM  4 years ago
artimus

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Buckley WA

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A new head should be smoothly moving with no notchy spots.
What head is it? Who makes it?
Fly Hard......Team Viagra
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04-24-2016 10:11 PM  4 years ago
X-Cell Man

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Haubstadt, IN - USA

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It on a Flybarless head. Which really doesn't matter if its flybar or flybarless head. The more "G" force is only going to make it that much more.
He Text me as this:
Dan, those washers are used as spacers. Each rotor head is Specifically assembled and tested. The bearings are spaced and pressed and Loctite last applied to keep that specific spacing. The head works properly during centrifugal force during rotation. You ( as of me) should have not taken it apart.
( I sent) Seriously ... The one blade grip was tight ( you had to hold the hub and force the blade grip to rotate)Even if you pulled on the grip.
( He says) They only move one quarter inch and rotate at a 6 G's. Human force cannot equal that. That head will have to be redone.
That was the last I have heard from them. I paid over $300.00 for this head. Am I wrong how this should feel? I sat down with Wayne Mann and David Harkey years ago and talked and showed me. He just got done replacing the bearings. Now this guy is telling me that head was okay. Man I can't believe that.. Plus putting a strain on the controls ( the servos. I had troubles with there swashplate too. They again couldn't believe it. They sent me a new one and that was smooth and wasn't hard to rotate the inner part of swashplate.
So what do I do?
Dan
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04-25-2016 12:31 AM  4 years ago
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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If they won't do anything, pull the head completely down and confirm no loctite ended up where it should not have. The OD's of radial bearings should not need to be loctited in to blade grips anyway if tolerances are correct, and loctite damn sure should not be used to keep bearings in their proper positition. Dry fit everything and see if it'll build up smoothly. My main worry is that there is a machining error that is outside of your ability to correct with a mfg. that will not back their product.

Ben Minor
Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA
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04-25-2016 12:57 AM  4 years ago
dkshema

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Cedar Rapids, IA

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What head is this? If you can't maintain it down the road without having to return it to be properly assembled again, why bother with it?-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz
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04-25-2016 01:21 AM  4 years ago
rcflyerheli

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Granbury, TX USA

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I'm with Ben and Dave on this one. There should never be grips that are notchy, let alone hard to move. Yes, shimming to get proper stack up with no play, but no notchiness. Using lock washers as shims is absurd.

When you reassemble (if you can), it is imperative that anything you do to one side, you do the exact same thing to the opposite side. There will always need to be a spacer between the radial bearing and the thrust bearing. It will need to either one that fits the spindle shaft and has a smaller OD than the radial bearing, or it will be one that has the same OD as the radial bearing with a very large ID. I have never seen any other kind of setup. The inner race and the outer race of the radial bearing will both hit the face of the thrust bearing if the spacer is omitted and that will lead to rough grip movement.

I also would like to know what head this is, if you don't mind saying.

Good luck with your issues.
Logo 700, Specter 700, Goblin 700, Trex 700DFC, Gaui X7, Logo 690SX, Logo 600SX; Trex 470 Trex 500
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05-05-2016 12:03 PM  4 years ago
X-Cell Man

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Haubstadt, IN - USA

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Hello,

I'm still waiting for them to get back to me. This is the 2nd email I have sent. If I do not get a response after Friday then gloves come off and will let you know who.

I did find one bearing bad but that's not the whole problem. The Safety washer fits very tight on shaft and in the blade grip/ blade mount. All of the Safety washers I have seen ( MA's heads)are a little smaller then the thrust bearing. Also the main bearings in the blade mount will have to be replace if I try to remove them. They are in there very very tight. More then just Loctite in.
So this tells me the milling is off. Yes I know you don't want the bearing to just fall in but tap in with a bearing tool( hollow stock the same OD as the bearing.

How long do I have with PayPal to get a claim ?

Thanks
Dan
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05-05-2016 06:08 PM  4 years ago
helitom

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Pine Grove, Calif, USA

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Do the PayPal claim now. You can always cancel the claim if the manufacterer makes it right.The older I get, the fewer things seem worth waiting in line for.
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05-06-2016 04:34 AM  4 years ago
rcflyerheli

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Granbury, TX USA

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A lot of times, the radial bearings are put in with "interference fits". What that means is that the OD of the radial bearing is .001 to .002 larger than is the ID of the grip.

Since the grip and the bearings are different materials, they expand differently when they are heated. By heating the grips, the aluminum will expand faster than will the bearing and will loosen up the bearing. That is also what you will need to do to them if they loctited the radial bearing into the grip.

One thing I have found. Since the grips don't rotate 360 degrees, I have never figured why people want to loctite them in. On a high speed situation like tail shaft bearings or main shaft bearings, yes I can see doing everything possible to keep from spinning the outer race when the inner race spins, but grip bearings don't have that issue.
Logo 700, Specter 700, Goblin 700, Trex 700DFC, Gaui X7, Logo 690SX, Logo 600SX; Trex 470 Trex 500
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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsOther › Flybarless bearings
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