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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › 1S parallel charging questions
01-22-2016 08:06 AM  31 months agoPost 1
salrica

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Raleigh,NC

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Brain fart,
I have a few 1s batteries and want to charge them in parallel.
From what I been reading I need to set the charger to 3.7v 1s and if I have 6 packs rated at 600mah I need to set the charger at 40a?
Also, if I have 3 batteries rated at 450mah and 3 others at 600mah, would it be OK to parallel charge them all together or they need to be the same mah?

Thanks in advance.

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01-22-2016 12:18 PM  31 months agoPost 2
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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No, DO NOT charge those 1s packs at 40a! That will most def result in a fire. Those packs should only be charged at a rate of .6 amps each at most, which is a 1c charge rate.

600mah @ 0.6 amp = 1c
600mah @ 1.2 amp = 2c
600mah @ 1.8 amp = 3c

5000mah @ 5.0 amps = 1c
5000mah @ 10.0 amps = 2c

See how that works? Check with the battery manufacturer to see what they're rated at for charging. Most can't be charged at more than 3c charge rates and I doubt those 1s packs can be charged higher than 1c charge rate.

As for parallel charging, you can hook up as many packs as you'd like as long as they're of the same chemistry (I.e. Voltage, capacity, etc.)

So, if you want to charge 3x 1s 600mah packs, you'd hook them up and set the charger for 1s and a 1.8amp charge rate (1c). Does this make sense? You can do packs of different sizes but I don't recommend it. Just do the set of 3 600mah packs together and the other 3 450mah ones together.

3x 1s 600mah packs @ 1.8 amps
3x 1s 450mah packs @ 1.35 amps

Hope this helps...

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 12:25 PM  31 months agoPost 3
artimus

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Buckley WA

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+1.....What he said

Fly Hard......Team Viagra

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01-22-2016 01:37 PM  31 months agoPost 4
ICUR1-2

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Ottawa, Ontario

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Safety
it also depends on your charger. I can set my charger to 4C but if the lipo won't take the amperage the charger automatically drops to a safe charging rate.
3x 1s 600mah packs @ 1.8 amps
3x 1s 450mah packs @ 1.3 amps
those are your baseline for 1C charge rate. you then multiply those numbers by the C rating you want to charge at.

spending time, paying attention

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01-22-2016 02:38 PM  31 months agoPost 5
cudaboy_71

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sacramento, ca, u.s.

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it also depends on your charger. I can set my charger to 4C but if the lipo won't take the amperage the charger automatically drops to a safe charging rate.
not really. That happens with every charger designed to charge lithium cells. That's the difference between the CV and the CC charging stages. Every charger has to be smart enough to change the current going in to the pack by design, or it's not a lithium charger.

Regardless, you still have to understand C ratings and how they apply to setting up your charger correctly.

Everything blackhawk said is spot on.

And, to repeat for posterity, don't mix battery cell counts and capacities on the same parallel charging session. Personally, I don't even like to mix brands or discharge c ratings, even if the voltage and capacities are the same.

good luck.

if it ain't broke, break it.

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01-22-2016 02:48 PM  31 months agoPost 6
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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It's always better to be safe than sorry! I don't charge packs in parallel of different brands, capacity and or discharge rates either. It's not worth the safety risk or the health of the packs themselves...

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 03:21 PM  31 months agoPost 7
ICUR1-2

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Ottawa, Ontario

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not really. That happens with every charger designed to charge lithium cells. That's the difference between the CV and the CC charging stages. Every charger has to be smart enough to change the current going in to the pack by design, or it's not a lithium charger.
Not all chargers are equal
It's always better to be safe than sorry! I don't charge packs in parallel of different brands, capacity and or discharge rates either.
+1

spending time, paying attention

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01-22-2016 03:58 PM  31 months agoPost 8
salrica

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Raleigh,NC

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Blackhawk,
Will follow your advice.

I have this parallel charge cables.

The first one, from left to right, I connect that one to charger,no problem, the other 2 has one extra charge lead?

Also, I don't have 6 or five batteries of the same mah to charge all at once, would be OK if I only charge 3 batteries on each squid?

My family thanks you all for the help.

Second pic, Is that the setting for 1s 600mah?, or should it be .60A?if I decide to charge just one pack, then I multiple for X battery that I want to parallel charge.

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01-22-2016 04:24 PM  31 months agoPost 9
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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It should be at .60amp. You multiply the (.6amp) by the number of packs you're charging. This can be anywhere from just 1 of all 6. It doesn't matter if you only have 3 packs hooked up to the cable. It only sees what's connected.

So, for instance...

3x 1s 600mah packs
Set charger to (.6amp X 3 packs) which is 1.8amps.

This stays with the general "baseline" of a 1c charge rate. The same can be applied to larger packs too. I typically charge 6x 6s 5000mah packs at the same time at 30amps. That's a charge rate of 5amps each (1c). Make sense?

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 04:31 PM  31 months agoPost 10
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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I can't really tell for sure from the pic but it looks like you can combine the cables on the right to the one on the left to hook up even more packs as that doesn't go directly to the charger... When parallel charging, you can hook up as many packs as you'd like as long as your charger will support it.

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 05:10 PM  31 months agoPost 11
salrica

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Raleigh,NC

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Much appreciated

I guess one end goes to jst, the other end on the left goes to a different charger output? Either if you have jst or the other connector?
And the one on the right is for a 2C pack, one to bananna plug and the other to the balancer output?

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01-22-2016 05:53 PM  31 months agoPost 12
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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No problem pal! As for the cables, I'm not sure. I've never seen them like that. Did those come with a package deal or something? Just take note, all packs being charged need to be connected to a power cable AND a balance lead as well...

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 06:20 PM  31 months agoPost 13
Heli Fanatix

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Fountain Valley, CA

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Salrice,

Your charge cable on left is for 1S
- use either white or red plug going to your charger

Your charge cable on right is for 2S
- banana plug for power leads
- top connector with 3 female pin goes into charger balance port

1S
- only positive & neg power leads
- there is no balance leads

2S
- balance lead has 3 wires

3S
- balance lead has 4 wires

4S
- balance lead has 5 wires

5S
- balance lead has 6 wires

6S
- balance lead has 7 wires

7S
- balance lead has 8 wires

I agree with ICUR1-2,

Not all chargers are equal. I personally have PL8v2 and 4010 and prefer the PL8v2 (only downside is no servo tester and cool screen unless you add the optional screen for bump charging)

Yes, not all chargers are equal. My PL8 v2 would charge faster than my 4010. On the PL8 v2, even if I input 1C ... It will not charge the full 5A right away if it's for a 6S 5000mah pack. The PL8 v2 charges at a variable rate till all cells equalizes and it goes up to its calculated 1C Rate. If there is an issue, it goes to safety camjsrge of less than .3A or so. Makes it safe and does the calculating for you. Hopefully this explanation will give you insights to what options are out there, this is in reference to my PL8vs:

- It will ask how many packs
- Type of charging: accurate, fast or high power
- At what rate you want to charge: 25mah ~ 10A / 1C / 2C 3C

The charger will detect your pack's content, capacity and cell count.
So if you:
- requested a set amperage, charger will charger what you set per pack
- requested 1C, it will vary the charge rate and up to it's capacity for 1C charging
- requested 2C or 3C, same as 1C but double or triple the rate

Please note I use a FMA Parallel Board for the PL8 v2. You are you able to mix any capacity as long as it's the same cell count.

In your case, you can use your parallel cable for 1S. since your type of charge will require you to input the total amperage, you will have to do the calculations as describe by previous members.

Keep in mind that as your packs deteriorate, I would suggest charging @ 20% ~ 50% of the capacity

in your situation, if you find your 1S 600mah not reaching 4.20 at the end of your charge cycle and is all over the place: 4.18 - 4.16 - 4.22 - 4.19 etc
try charging it @ 150 mah each / total of 900mah for all 6 of your 450mah & 600mah packs
it might take longer but the packs will come out balanced @ 4.20v
That is the secret of parallel charging.

You can try this method with bigger packs. I have packs i've flown for over 900 cycles, they are good but hard to get them balanced when parallel charging. so on my PL8v2, I would charge my:

6S 3700mah 65C
6S 4100mah 45C
6S 5000mah 45C
6S 5000mah 60C
6S 5000mah 65C

* various brands
* I charge in open area inside of concrete blocks.
* obviously be in the same room to monitor the charge cycle, don't go for a walk especially when you know you have problem packs.

Charge @ 500mah (total of 3A)
Take about 5 hrs to charge
I fly at noon, so if i charge @ 7am, ready to go @ 12pm
everything is balanced

... not the same result for my 4010

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01-22-2016 06:54 PM  31 months agoPost 14
salrica

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Raleigh,NC

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Blackhawk6, bought those cables from progressive rc.
The helis came with their own USB charger, didn't feel confident on using the stock charger and bought those cables.
And as heli fanatix is saying I got different readings when using stock charger.

@ Helifanatix,
Great info about that charger, seems to be an excellent charger.
My voltz is been working great, old but haven't had any problem, knock on wood, but I may look to upgrade as the fleet grows.
I was ready to ask about the packs not reaching full charge, 4.17 at the most but you already explained that.

Very thankful for you all explanation.

Better ask before doing something stupid then calling the fire department!

Is this the charger?
http://www.progressiverc.com/fma-powerlab-8.html

Would this work also?
http://www.progressiverc.com/fma-powerlab-6.html

I have 6 6s packs for X5 and for gobi 500, I don't think that I will go any higher than that.

For either of those 2 chargers, do I need a power supply?
I don't see ac/DC adaptor
Never mind I just saw it on progressive, yes it needs a power supply.

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01-22-2016 07:06 PM  31 months agoPost 15
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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Invest in a good charger and they'll do a lot of the work for you. The less expensive chargers won't get you the results. They work but if you're going to stay in the hobby and progress, it's money well spent. There's a lot of great chargers out there for about $2-300. I use the Icharger 308 duo which is great for charging multiple packs of all kinds at the same time cause it's a dual channel / port. The Powerlab on the other hand is only a single channel which makes for charging your radio, rx and flight packs really time consuming.

I've had both and the Ichargers are AMAZING!

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 07:11 PM  31 months agoPost 16
Blackhawk6

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Trenton, Mi

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http://www.progressiverc.com/icharger-308duo.html

And yes, you'll need a good power supply. There's a lot to choose from. A great one is Meanwell. ProgressiveRC has them. Get a 24v 1000w one and you'll be set for life. You'll never have to upgrade the charger system. It's an investment.

Team XpertUSA

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01-22-2016 10:38 PM  31 months agoPost 17
Heli Fanatix

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Fountain Valley, CA

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This is my recommendation:

PL8 v2 with FMA's parallel board (built in thermal self setting fuses). No regrets what so ever and will charge anything on the market. Only thing that would be better is getting dual PL8 v2... But you can always get a PL8 v2 for now and another one in the future (if needed). PL8 v2 has tabs that you can connect another unit together to tie in as a single unit.

You can always keep your current charger for smaller packs:
- RX packs
- TX packs
- micro heli's
- smaller heli's

Progressive has awesome service, quick warranty turnaround and has everything for your charging needs.

Ideally for a powerful charging setup, you want to stick strictly to DC only version. Thus a separate power supply is required. If you want my suggestion on a Power Supply, PM me and I can send you a link sir.

Use what you got for now .... Collect your coins for a good charging setup. But at least you have an idea of what type of charger to purchase in the future.

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01-22-2016 11:00 PM  31 months agoPost 18
Heli_Splatter

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USA

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I am getting away from using parallel boards. I have just had too many problems with unbalanced packs using the Para boards.

I use iCharger 306 and 310. I have also noticed that high charge rates do not allow for proper balancing, so I have slowed mine down a bit. 1C is generally good.

I have a pocket battery tester by Hitec that balances packs when they get out of wack.. it takes a while, but it never fails.

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01-22-2016 11:18 PM  31 months agoPost 19
Heli Fanatix

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Fountain Valley, CA

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Use my method for parallel charging (as mention earlier on this post). As long as packs are in decent shape and within .3 volts of each other, it will work.

To be fair, even if you don't get 4.20v on each cell:
- It's only a some seconds off flight times
- doesn't cause ESC to voltage cut off
- will work just fine

It is what you believe in:

- slow charge up to 6 packs for convenience
Or
- charge one / two pack at a time

Balancing a pack independtly but than it gets unbalanced after a flight or charging is a sign the pack is deteriorating.

If I couldn't get my packs to balance 4.20v, I definitely would not suggest it and be charging 1 pack per channel on my 4010. That is why I got the 4010, fortunately .. Parallel charging on my PL8 v2 @ a slow rate had worked out well for me. Let's me keep my packs in service for 914 flights and going.

If slowing down to 1C yield better results, than would it be safe to conclude if you cut charge rate in half further, than it would be advantageous on your behalf?

Parallel charging a 6S pack to another 6S pack is no different than individual cells within a 6S pack. I know it's in series but you have to understand on the concept. We are still charging multiple cells ... It's about your equipment and technique

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01-23-2016 12:47 PM  31 months agoPost 20
Heli_Splatter

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USA

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I am suggesting that you monitor your packs going onto the charger and coming off the charger. If you start seeing cell to cell voltage differences, you need to balance the pack. It might be ok then.

You do NOT want cells charging above 4.2volts. That can be a dangerous situation. Fires start that way.

My conclusion is that using parallel boards, increases your risk of unbalanced cells and damaging good packs when charging together with unbalanced batteries. I am not saying; don't do it. I would say that it is not for beginners.

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