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06-04-2015 07:03 AM  4 years ago
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mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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Cycle methods
how do you guys cycle your new lipos? Do you use your charger to do this or charge and fly, then repeat the process over a few times? Reason I ask is a buddy and I had this discussion about the means and methods of doing this. two of my lipos (thunder power) are showing signs of puffing and this has me wondering if I may not be doing this correctly. I charge a new set of lipos at a 1amp rate, then fly them, then repeat this for two more cycles for a total of 3 cycles, after that I then charge my lipos at a 2 or 3c rate from there forward just to cut time. The two lipos I mentioned are relatively new with less than 15 flights on them.
"R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 07:34 AM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

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long beach calif

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I Don't fly longer than 4 minutes with mines that's helped mines from not puffing so fast.Insha Allah made in america
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06-04-2015 12:26 PM  4 years ago
Dan Minick

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Columbus, WI

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I charge them at 1c, then fly them out "gently" to around half capacity for 3-5 cycles. Its not an exact science but I seem to have good luckTeam Synergy, Team FBL Rotors-------if its not broke...it will be!
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06-04-2015 12:40 PM  4 years ago
Heli_Splatter

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USA

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I think that internal heat of the packs is causes the puffing;

1.) leaving packs in hot car. Pilot Error
2.) Over discharging the packs to low voltages. Pilot Error
3.) over rate discharging..too high of a current load. Design Error.
4.) charging before pack cools from flight. pilot error.
5.) charging too high rate... pilot error
6.) Cheap batteries? possible, but taking care of what you have is more important. I don't think a battery is like an engine and does not need to be broken in.
7.) Storing at full charge makes it easier to puff.

To me, heat = puff, so I try to cut the heat down when ever possible.

What does everyone else think.
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06-04-2015 02:42 PM  4 years ago
mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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I dont fly my packs more than 4 minutes , they all come down at 3.87 never lower. But one thinf I will sat is when cycling a new set, I fly them just as long as my broke in packs 4.00 minutes. Maybe as Dyecocker1 mentioned, he cycles his new pack but flys them to half capacity for a few times, this is where I could have ruined a set by not doing so."R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 02:50 PM  4 years ago
mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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Some good points heli splatter. But in my case I have to answer no to all five points. Im going to contact Thunder Power to find out why these two packs have failed so quickly. Thunder Power packs are not cheap at all lol! I have 8 of these packs out of a total of 10 5000mAh 6s packs."R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 03:32 PM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

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long beach calif

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Low c rating and a high amp motor also causes puffing

usually the 20 and 30c packs puff with the high amp motors.
Insha Allah made in america
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06-04-2015 04:49 PM  4 years ago
mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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Wc. These are thunder power magnum series lipos. 70c rated!"R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 05:02 PM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

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long beach calif

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mr dan
Wc. These are thunder power magnum series lipos. 70c rated
kewl then your under warranty send them back for replacement then take it easy
with the next packs.
Insha Allah made in america
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06-04-2015 05:52 PM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

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long beach calif

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also how much pitch are you using ? to much pitch could also cause puffingInsha Allah made in america
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06-04-2015 06:08 PM  4 years ago
dchekas

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Farmington, CT

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I will be very gentle the the packs for the first 2-3 flights. Very mild sport flying, and charging at only 1 C.

After these initial 2-3 flights, I will fly my normal 3D routine with and charge as needed.

Contact TP and speak with either Mark or Kim. They will get your packs squared away if you're having an issue.
Team Align, Team Futaba, Team Byron Fuels, Team Thunder Power
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06-04-2015 07:01 PM  4 years ago
mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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I sent them an email about this. Hopefully they will have an answer."R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 07:17 PM  4 years ago
jason46

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MI

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I'm curious how far you run the packs down? I consider myself abusive towards lipos and I haven't had one puff.
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06-04-2015 07:23 PM  4 years ago
mr dan

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Stockton Calif

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Flight time is set for 4:00 never go beyond that. Packs come in at 3.80 never below 3.75"R.I.P Roman" Citizen 0094 in the Nation
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06-04-2015 07:35 PM  4 years ago
Aaron29

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USA

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You'll get a variety of methods but fact is there's little to be concerned about. I cycle them in the heli. Slightly shorter flights. No 3D first few flights, but that's it.

Got a pack with 236 cycles and still has 2 or less milliohms IR per cell and happy.

The key is what you do with the REST of the battery's life! A meticulous break in won't change much.
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06-04-2015 11:20 PM  4 years ago
cudaboy_71

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sacramento, ca, u.s.

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I've been flying these silly things since '04 or so. That's a lot of lipo technology we've been through. And, a lot of super expensive packs I've personally gone through. Below is less about the specific question of cycling packs--though to be curt: don't do it. It's more of a general guideline for getting the most out of packs.

No, this isn't the be-all end-all method. But, after so many years it's what works reliably for me:

#1 C ratings are BS. They're fabricated. There's no truth to them, and no standard to which they're held. You may personally find that some of the higher rated packs last better than the lower ones which may make them worth more money. But, the numbers themselves are arbitrary. So, using the C rating to calculate a safe discharge rate through your setup is foolish.

#2 you don't cycle lipos. I fell for the 'break in cycles' early on. But, after many packs, I began to see that cell IRs naturally dropped over the first 10-15 cycles naturally--regardless of how they were flown. So, wasting cycles to 'easy flights' or charger cyles is just throwing money away.

#3 If I have the time I always charge at 1C or slower....even 1/2C if I'm just watching TV waiting for packs to cycle. At the field I'll charge 1C...I have enough packs to not need to rush them.

#4 Let your packs cool off before recharging. Not much discussion here. I have enough packs to let them cool off for 30 minutes before putting them on the charger at the field.

#5 use a timer AND a thermometer. tip: if your packs are getting too hot with plenty of mah still in the pack, the rate you are discharging them is too high. you need a higher c rating (yes it's an arbitrary number, but higher is better than lower of the same make/manuf---typically) or more mah pack.

#6 in theory yes you can discharge to the 20% mark. But, the packs last significantly longer if you leave a little more in the tank. Personally I fly to 3.8v/cell. as a bonus, If I get a little agressive or don't hear my timer and accidentally take them to 3.75 once it's not the end of the pack.

take this at face value. none of it is anything but emprical. But, after so many years and so many packs it's the only way I'll treat them, until I hit the lotto and can afford to buy new packs every 3 months.
if it ain't broke, break it.
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06-04-2015 11:43 PM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

rrProfessor

long beach calif

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how much pitch are you using dan ? 13 degree's and bet your flying it hard for 4 minutes ?Insha Allah made in america
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06-05-2015 12:03 AM  4 years ago
flyboy1985

rrApprentice

mohnton pa

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...going pro , one crash at a time
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06-05-2015 12:18 AM  4 years ago
wc_wickedclown (RIP)

rrProfessor

long beach calif

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flyboy1985
...
your right hs and pitch
Insha Allah made in america
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06-05-2015 01:39 AM  4 years ago
Aaron29

rrProfessor

USA

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I like these empirical data things.

I also let mine cool off before charging.
I also don't get below 3.8 resting voltage
I never leave a battery charged. They are flown shortly after charging.
I charge at 1.5-2C.

I have great results so far. A battery just reached 240 cycles today and it's still happy.

So far, so good with this regimen. I've yet to try one more thing I've read... That not fully charging a battery can double its cycle life. Like limiting to 4.10 volts. You shorten flight ten percent but if it doubles cycle life that'd be worth it.

My flight style is mixed big air and 3D. Twelve degrees pitch, eight cyclic. That is also probably pretty important.
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