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07-06-2014 03:08 AM  6 years ago
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RM3

rrElite Veteran

Killeen, Texas - USA

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fed up with the Radikal
Ok, heres my rant...
went flying today, not perfect weather but oh well. took three helis with me, an Old Trex600e FB head, 6S...and two Radikal G20s, one modded with FBL and the other bone stock.

Start off with the Trex...as usual, no problems, flies strait, has never broken anything in midflight, tracks great, have never needed a single repair since 2009, NOT ONCE!

Up goes the G20 with the modded engine, tail starts kicking, then I hear a rattling, crap starts falling off the heli IN MID FLIGHT!, bring her back in...the stinger inside the V2 muffler has broken off! This is the second one in a year. Everytime I get it flying just right crap just starts breaking on it. last weekend the engine was giving me crap, then the tail would wag...then the fuel plug started leaking, then when home noticed the bottom frame was cracked near the rear landing skids on both sides no less...its done!

So up goes the FB stock G20...flies heavy, but it seems to fly ok, then fly around, do some mild sport stuff, then I notice that one of the paddles is fluttering...land, straiten it out, go fly. minutes later the head is out of track...land, re track the blades...fly some more. Then I notice the vent tube danggling off the butt end of the heli, land, fix, fly again...Now the damn thing has a drift problem...holy $hit! whats next?

so put them away, a Modded G20 that spends more time on the bench and a stock G20 that refuses to just fly strait.

Put a fresh Lipo in my 600e, fly, perfect tracking, no issues...land, put another lipo in, fly some more mild 3d, not a single complaint from the heli...the damn thing just works everytime.

I'm sick of working on these sorry a$$ gassers from Century, fed up with the crap quality, fed up with the endless search for vibrations, and fed up with trying to make them into something they are not.

My patience with these Century gassers is about at an end. If it were not for the $700 in electronics in them, I would up the HS to 3,000rpms and do a tail slide from a 1/4 mile up back down onto solid concrete
showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...
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07-06-2014 03:56 AM  6 years ago
seflyer

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Northern California, Palo Cedro

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mine was the same way, finally did itself in after 18 flights, inflight part failure resulting in total demise and loss of everything. total POS, never deal with them again.My heli is right side up -- the world is upside down
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07-06-2014 05:24 PM  6 years ago
tonyd12

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hamlin,PA

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radicxal 20
Same here put new tail, new ignition, 2 clutches, broken side frames ,etc. Real POS. Now let wars, reps. begin
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07-06-2014 06:41 PM  6 years ago
Pascal-KC

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Kansas City, KS, USA

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I do not blame you. I went through a similar (yet brief) experience before reselling and buying a whiplash gasser.Team Mikado, Team Revolectrix, KBDD Team Pilot
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07-07-2014 02:30 AM  6 years ago
gyan

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Surrey, BC Canada or Blaine Wa.

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I'm wondering if the issues aren't Zenoah G20EI related...vibrations, this is a relatively new engine type isn't it? I'd like to find out how to balance mine myself cause my G20 vibrates too much as well, but I don't think it's an airframe issue.
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07-07-2014 02:45 AM  6 years ago
Gearhead

rrMaster

Vt

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funny how some people have problems while others do notJim
Buzz Buzz Buzz
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07-07-2014 05:36 AM  6 years ago
strat1960s

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San Antonio Texas

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I'm not picking sides, one way or the other. I do not do much more than hover. The only issues I've had with my G20 has been due to my lack of knowing how to tune the motor. That's not to say that down the road if/when I progress to beyond forward flight and into 3d I may find some problems.

Are G30s having problems?

Ted
I always have fun. Some times are more fun than others.
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07-07-2014 03:20 PM  6 years ago
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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I'm begining to suspect that the reason "some" have problems and others don't has to do with how the model is being pushed. I have seen only a handfull of G20s...and those that seem to do ok (but still have some vib induced symptoms) are models that are left in thier stock configuration with just a stock engine and are not flown hard and stay away from pull starts (pull start stresses the frame alot).

Once a more powerful engine is installed, the models lightly designed frame can't deal with it.

the rest of the issues seem to stem from a stacked component driveline that will not stay aligned nor is it properly supported and a sloppy fly barred head.

To me the radikal g20 is just not meant to be a performance bird, push it into 3D with a stronger than stock engine and stuff starts to break, fall off, crack and electronics begin to fail.

Century needs to retire it or come out with a "v2" designed from the ground up for 3D and engines in the 3+ HP range.

They really need to address the driveline alignment/support and vibration mitigation.

As for G30s, I have only seen Two...and they were being flown in sport mode only, one had a balanced 231 the other I think was stock. But given that the G30 shares alot of the basic frame design I suspect that the G30 does suffer to some extent, but maybe not nearly as much as the G20.

I will not buy another one...ever
showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...
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07-07-2014 06:19 PM  6 years ago
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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I'm wondering if the issues aren't Zenoah G20EI related...vibrations, this is a relatively new engine type isn't it?
the Zenoah has been out since about 2008, so its not a new engine, it has proven itself as a potent and very reliable gasoline engine for airplanes as that is what it was originally designed for. In stock form the engine does generate vibrations when pushed over its "airplane" RPM band which is between 7,000 to 10,000 rpms...push it over that range and vibs start to become very obvious.

balancing it will only get you so far, and the internal imbalance of a single piston engine can really can never be eliminated...the engine still generates significant torque pulses no matter what.
showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...
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07-08-2014 04:31 AM  6 years ago
Billme

rrElite Veteran

MS

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If the tail is not smooth like a electric, or darting, then its a drive train problem if you know your servo is ok..

If I cannot focus on a bolt head on the tail somewhere, I know I have chatter.. Its such high frequency, it may look kinda smooth, but not...I think this was destroying tails on some...This at least to me why some had problems and some did not...
Its not just Century, I just went through a trex conversion where align had the same problem...

What I found with mine was the auto clutch..Its a german bearing, but whats going on is the outer race of the bearing glued to the aluminum hub....In some cases it may be pressed in to tight..It is very critical on the dimension when using the sprage..
I went through 3 of them .....The last one lasted from 2010 til this year...
I had talked with the head engineer for Vario and was curious to why Vario uses the Steel hub.. It is mainly because to keep the tolerances in check between hot and cold weather..

So with this said, this also explains where my issues showed up, the aluminum hub would expand, even though the steel race is less prone, it would be easy to have problems because of the pulse of the engine...
If the right glue, or bearing seat was used, then it will do better under these conditions using aluminum..

To much is still blamed on engines...Even on a new engine, the tail should be smooth, if its tuned close enough.. If you are having problems after a half gallon of fuel, you need to be checking the drive system...
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07-08-2014 07:38 PM  6 years ago
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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I agree that the engine is blamed alot. but I also belive that in the case of gassers, particularly those that are powered by PUH format engines they tend suffer more due to sharp torque pulses. This is why RC format engines are sometimes preferred as the heavy flywheel tends to smooth out the power delivery of the engine...but at the expense of additional weight the rotor has to lift.

The "hard" direct drive system from engine to rotors has absolutely no dampening ability in all gassers that I have personnaly seen. the torque pulse essentially goes thru to the main rotor via the gear train and the frame suffers the counter torque "pulse" as a result.

If they came up with a OWB hub that had some sort of torque dampener incorporated onto it, the pulses from the engine could be smoothed out befoe they made it to the rotors thus allowing for much much smoother flight akin to that of an electric, which would reduce vibration induced wear of the entire heli.

with everything "hard" mounted and direct driveline to the bird the engin is free to vibrate the heli to pieces.
showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...
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