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HomeAircraftHelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › dfc or non dfc? higher or lower head?
11-01-2013 03:33 AM  5 years agoPost 1
honda411

rrKey Veteran

Surprise, AZ USA

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So i got a trex 700n off trade from a friend locally so i can stay in tune with the hobby.

Anyways. It has the original fbl head on it. I see tim jones using what looks like the standard fbl head from align.
Which is better? DFC or non DFC, and lower head or higher head?

I am shopping around and wondering whats best. The fbl head i have now has the main shaft collar, but i prefer a fbl head where the arm are fixed on the head block.

HeliDirect Field Rep, Synergy N7 w/ OS 105, Torq Servos, Cyclone/ Rail blades

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11-01-2013 03:52 AM  5 years agoPost 2
McKrackin

rrProfessor

Lucasville,Ohio

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Non DFC for lower head speeds and 2000 RPM is perfect for a 700N

I literally never use the word literally right.

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11-01-2013 04:30 AM  5 years agoPost 3
ICUR1-2

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Ottawa, Ontario

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I'm not a big fan of Aligns DFC but the stick bangers swear by it
TracX might be worth looking into

spending time, paying attention

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11-01-2013 02:48 PM  5 years agoPost 4
Santiago P

rrProfessor

South West, Ohio

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My advice is to stay away from any 2 blade dfc head.
but the stick bangers swear by it
The reason for that is that they like the quicker responce due to:

1. The lower head
2. Super stiff dampening

Neither is the result of eliminating the swash follower.

That being the case, any proper head with a swash follower will give you the same effect.

Trade off with a dfc:

1. Control links put in cycling bending
2. (possible) Critical to maintain dampers as hard, and tight as possible; any give allows the dfc links to bend beyond the allowable.
3. Vibration. 2 bladed heads need dampening to absorbe the constant variations in the rotor head. If the spindle is kept too firm, all these cyclic vibes are transmitted down the shaft and to the airframe.
4. Not stable at "some" lower RPMs. (blade size and weight dependent)
5. Swash timing issues IF play or give on the dfc links is developed.

Note that #2 will vary with the type of flying, quality of components and maintenance given to a model.

Do yourself a favor and think, if dfc is so great, why the likes of Nick Maxwell, Kyle Dahl, won't touch it with a 10ft pole. Another great pilot, Kyle Stacy (who has the option) flies the conventioanl head. Why most companies TT, JR, GAUI, Synergy, MA, Next-D, Blade, AleeS, Mikado, Century, TSA, and SAB to name a few, will not, or no longer used them if is such a hot concept?

Even Compass, who brought and delivered the concept of dfc better than anyone else (w flexibe links) is now offering a conventional head.

Will the dfc not work, or wreck your heli? Not if you stay on top of its maintenance, those control links are very critical.
In the end is your decision.

S

Team Minicopter - PeakAircraft.com
bavarianDEMON- Team Kontronik - Scorpion Motors-

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11-01-2013 02:57 PM  5 years agoPost 5
honda411

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Surprise, AZ USA

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wow that was an awesome write up. I think your right. I had most of my decision made up on the conventional head design.
Now if i went with just the kde head block that would be okay right? I want the follower arms to be mounted on the head block so i know they are perfectly parallel to the blade grips.

http://www.helidirect.com/kde-direc...ies-p-21546.hdx

HeliDirect Field Rep, Synergy N7 w/ OS 105, Torq Servos, Cyclone/ Rail blades

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11-01-2013 05:20 PM  5 years agoPost 6
Mahu

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Panhandle , FL

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To DFC or Not to DFC
That is the question...

I have several Helis and I have both the DFC head and standard FBL heads. I find myself replacing servo gears on the DFC birds much more on a minor crash than on the helis with the regular FBL heads. The trade off is performance. If you are not a 3D stick banger then you would most likely not be able to tell the difference. Maintenence is something you MUST do on any heli, DFC or not. Granted the regular FBL head will not go through the dampners like the DFC head will but if you want to fly like Nick then a DFC head will help get you there.

Just my 2 pennies

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11-01-2013 07:41 PM  5 years agoPost 7
Santiago P

rrProfessor

South West, Ohio

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honda,
Yes, the KDE head block is an excellent upgrade, it clamps to the mainshaft much better.

Mahu,
thanks for highlighting the importance on the tight dampeners on dfc setups.

I still insist dfc is not a requirement for hard 3D smack as I mentioned above.

S

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11-01-2013 08:09 PM  5 years agoPost 8
Luvmyhelis

rrApprentice

Spokane, Washington. USA

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I have and fly with both. Admittedly the Align Dfc is the very worst version ever. Dfc does fly more crisp. But other brands are much better in this venue. Just remember with Dfc you have to keep up the HS or things get dicey. I have even had my balls snap off my swash using this so it is much harder on parts all around. Tolerances here are critical. Any slop at all is bad bad news.

The head using swash followers can also be tuned using much harder damps to achieve close to these same flying results however. I bet 99% of all pilots won't really be able to fly any better with or without the Dfc over the regular fbl head however. I know I can't. I just notice the difference in feel between both. I traded back and forth all summer on my gobs. And now fly one with, and the other with the Hps. My Aligns use the 6HV head and the regular fbl head with followers. Their DFC truly sucks.

Old cranky heli builder

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11-01-2013 09:30 PM  5 years agoPost 9
ICUR1-2

rrElite Veteran

Ottawa, Ontario

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Using the right parts you can get your head lower to be more like the DFC.
DFC is not tunable at all compared to a traditional FBL head which is a must for me.
I believe Align is killing themselves with their dfc crap. they will eventually get the hint

spending time, paying attention

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11-01-2013 10:46 PM  5 years agoPost 10
Luvmyhelis

rrApprentice

Spokane, Washington. USA

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Lol, they never have before! I still consider Align much like an old Harley. Basically it is an entire load of hooey needing virtually every upgrade the aftermarket can offer. Great for guys that love to tinker like I used to. Everyone knows they basically ripped off the design and did it poorly with the head. I lost count of the help me posts with DFC equipped helis having problems with this brand. It seems to take them years to respond to anything.

Old cranky heli builder

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11-02-2013 02:25 AM  5 years agoPost 11
Trickycopter

rrApprentice

Tulsa, Oklahoma

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I don't like having all the stress on the one little bolt that holds the dfc link to the blade grip looks like a potential for disaster

Synergy E7 AMA member Team Old Farts citizen 401 www.trickycopterrc.blogspot.com

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11-02-2013 03:52 AM  5 years agoPost 12
GeorgeM21

rrNovice

Prairieville Louisiana US

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Well said all changed my mind on align dfc thank you I think I'll go with x7

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11-02-2013 03:12 PM  5 years agoPost 13
honda411

rrKey Veteran

Surprise, AZ USA

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Thanks for the replies guys! Much appreciated!
I will stay with the standard head design. Well, the KDE head block design but higher head setup. I had a dfc head on my trex 700n a while back and loved it with no issues. But i will be pushing this heli harder than the last.

George: You will love the X7. I still wish i never sold mine! Big mistake!

HeliDirect Field Rep, Synergy N7 w/ OS 105, Torq Servos, Cyclone/ Rail blades

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11-02-2013 11:26 PM  5 years agoPost 14
wifeorheli

rrElite Veteran

reno, nevada usa

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I love dfc wouldn't change a thing. Feels great to me response is amazing. But need to replace the 2 links like every 20 flights for me they get sloppy quick.

Novarossi Motors U.S.A
www.PLanethobby.com
Team GrandRc.com
Team Byron Fuels
ZRC U.S.A. "PushGlo, SwitchGlo"

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11-03-2013 12:19 AM  5 years agoPost 15
ICUR1-2

rrElite Veteran

Ottawa, Ontario

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Between DFC and non DFC there is no difference in feel unless you turn off your FBL unit

spending time, paying attention

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11-03-2013 02:59 AM  5 years agoPost 16
Trickycopter

rrApprentice

Tulsa, Oklahoma

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I sold my 700e and bought the whiplash 90e got a 700ex on the way I like miniature aircraft Made in USA updated my signature too

Synergy E7 AMA member Team Old Farts citizen 401 www.trickycopterrc.blogspot.com

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11-03-2013 03:13 AM  5 years agoPost 17
turboomni

rrProfessor

East of the Equator

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I sold my 700e and bought the whiplash 90e got a 700ex on the way I like miniature aircraft Made in USA updated my signature too
Whiplash 700ex AMA member http://www.trickycopterrc.blogspot.com
NICE!!!

Setup is everything, All my heli's can fly far better than I can pilot them

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