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Other › Tired of Align's new approach.
10-08-2013 10:37 AM  4 years agoPost 1
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Since I believe the first 450 Pro, Align have gone for screaming HS's and slowed down the tail to compensate. Which is great from a performance and spectators point of view when watching a demo flight, however not so great for the pilot having to land 3.5 mins into the flight!

All they have to do is include 2 different tail gear ratio's and 2 different pinions (they would also need to make the gear mesh adjustable on those models that aren't at the moment), not too difficult and I for one would be happy to pay slightly more for these gearing options included in the kit or maybe as an option to buy later.

For the mass majority of us the smaller pinion and higher tail ratio would be perfect so that would be the best option to be included in the kits and the bigger pinion and lower tail gear ratio could be offered as an option for Tareq Kammerer doing a demo flight!

What do you guys think?

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 10:53 AM  4 years agoPost 2
Wave

rrKey Veteran

Illinois

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A 450 should be turning a 4- 4.5K headspeed.

What do you think ?

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10-08-2013 11:16 AM  4 years agoPost 3
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Don't you mean a 250?

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 12:09 PM  4 years agoPost 4
Toadster25

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Iowa

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Sounds like a good idea to me. I'm not sure but would the 3S version of the 450 l dominator run a little lower head speed? I'm guessing its probably about the same just a higher kv motor. I really like the looks of new 450 but I think for my flying style I might just stick with my old 450SE since I've got it flying at a head speed I'm comfortable with but the tail is a little weak on it.

I would like to have it both ways. Most flying at a lower head speed and flip a switch and turn it up once in a while when I want to fly hard.

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10-08-2013 12:26 PM  4 years agoPost 5
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Yes the 3s 450l runs a lower hs and as a result should easily do 4-4.5 mins 3d.

I guess ideally you want a really heavy duty tail shaft, hub and blade grips to handle a fast tail also at high hs.

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 02:09 PM  4 years agoPost 6
3dgimble

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Rochester

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Align have gone for screaming HS's and slowed down the tail to compensate. Which is great from a performance and spectators point of view when watching a demo flight, however not so great for the pilot having to land 3.5 mins into the flight!

All they have to do is include 2 different tail gear ratio's and 2 different pinions
I totally agree, and they did it with every fking model in the line up, WTF do I need 2700HS on a 600 or Kyle Dahl 4k hs on 450 for on the weekends when I am not a at a Funfly?
Yeah they should include two ratios with the helis, one called DFHS and the other NPHS(normal people head speed).

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10-08-2013 02:32 PM  4 years agoPost 7
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Lol and DFHS would be??

I saw a recent video of Jamie Robertson flying the new 800 Pro DFC and it must have been at 2000 rpm! I don't even need to run that on my 600! The video quality was quite poor on my S3 but I couldn't really see what the heli was doing it was going so far and fast, wasn't like that when he flew Mikado!

He is still an awesome pilot and probably my favourite actually. I blame Kenny Ko! Since he came on the scene doing all Aligns promotional demo videos everythings gone crazy! Bring back Jason Krause!

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 03:00 PM  4 years agoPost 8
Dino Spadaccini

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Lol and DFHS would be??
I saw a recent video of Jamie Robertson flying the new 800 Pro DFC and it must have been at 2000 rpm! I don't even need to run that on my 600! The video quality was quite poor on my S3 but I couldn't really see what the heli was doing it was going so far and fast, wasn't like that when he flew Mikado!
He is still an awesome pilot and probably my favourite actually. I blame Kenny Ko! Since he came on the scene doing all Aligns promotional demo videos everythings gone crazy! Bring back Jason Krause!
Richardmid 1 your statement about jamie flight with the 800 hs it was at 1950 which is max with that motor and gearing and you can go as low as 1300 i had been told a scale guys has one at 1100 with 800mm blades i have seen and played with 1500 myself on mine his video was to show how well the 800 flys for that size. Do your research on what other have been doing with the 800 and the 450L before you make a blanket statement

Watch at YouTube

RIP Roman JR
Capt USA Align Factory Team Align - Conquer Your heart
Team Futaba

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10-08-2013 03:13 PM  4 years agoPost 9
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Ok so the only thing untrue about my statement was saying 2000 rpm instead of 1950. Sorry.

BTW 1950 is not the max you could run on that motor and gearing.

Yes its easy to run a lower HS, but easier on the ESC, no. I sure wouldn't like to be an ESC governing a heli geared like that to 1100-1300! Also the tail performance would be shocking.

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 03:40 PM  4 years agoPost 10
raptor50luvver

rrKey Veteran

Dorset UK

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I agree I am fed up with Align not giving customers what they want,Align make what must be the most useless airframes to be able to fine tune them to your needs,I have gone back to Mikado and SAB for my airframes,no crappy DFC heads with no option but to have one and a wide choice of gear ratios available.

Align are losing the plot IMHO and a lot of these other heli manufacturers are going to whip their arse.
I am just so glad that their are a lot of decent heli manufacturers now so there is a good choice without the need to fly Align junk.

I do like reading the Align forums though,especially the 600Pro one,its great for some amusement.

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10-08-2013 06:15 PM  4 years agoPost 11
AWittleWabbit

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O.C., CA

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Back to Richard's original comment, I think it would great if Align gave options on tail gearing. Lower head speed SlowD flying seems to be getting popular. It's sure fun to watch.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I can't think of anyone in recent memory that gave you tail ratio options. It would be nice though! Align would probably have to color code the gears so someone doesn't run the higher geared tail on a high head speed setup

Heli-itis sufferer.

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10-08-2013 06:30 PM  4 years agoPost 12
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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I believe the goblins have a choice of 2 rear tail pullys. I think the new synergy e7 has different tail ratio options aswell but I could be wrong.

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 06:58 PM  4 years agoPost 13
AWittleWabbit

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O.C., CA

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It would make sense. I'm surprised everyone doesn't.

Heli-itis sufferer.

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10-08-2013 07:31 PM  4 years agoPost 14
Dino Spadaccini

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Watch at YouTube

here is me at 1650 the stock gearing works fine
tail hold great so again your statement is off the mark

the new tail ratio on the 700 is 4.71 so you can run lower head speeds
same for the 800 the new N has 4.99 so running a head speed of 1900 with a 105 or 120 no tail issues again what is the issues also on the 700 and the 800 you can go to the 13/110 instead of the 12/112 so there are
options

i also posted in anther forum the cc log from that flight no issues there

Dino

RIP Roman JR
Capt USA Align Factory Team Align - Conquer Your heart
Team Futaba

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10-08-2013 09:17 PM  4 years agoPost 15
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Ok so you mentioned 1100, 1300 and 1500 but then you show a video of mild 3d at 1650!

That heli should be smackable at that rpm and still have a solid tail!

The nitro HAS to have a faster tail because it runs lower hs than the crazy electrics and people are putting the 700n pro dfc tail gears on the 700e which is more shear luck than management I think!

The 700e pro dfc has 4.37 tail gear ratio as far as I know not 4.71!

The 13/110 gearing would make things worse not better!

All I would like to see is, adjustable motor mounts, 2 pinions and 2 auto rotation and counter gear options in the kit or have the larger pinion and lower tail gear ratio as an upgrade option. Many more kits they would sell!

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-08-2013 09:41 PM  4 years agoPost 16
Dino Spadaccini

rrElite Veteran

USA

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yes 4.37 on the 700E and 800 the N 5.33

as for head speed thats where i like to play with it if you like to see others go to HF and look it up yourself there is more info there on guys exploering

well i can see that you really are not pushing your heli on the 700E or N side colin bell runs that 10/113 490k at a head speed of 2100 go and look at his vids no tail issue there and on the nitro a 1950 none there

as for for more pinions and gearing what are you guys looking for instead of complaining about it put a wish list together and i will had it off the to factory when i am there in two weeks

Dino

RIP Roman JR
Capt USA Align Factory Team Align - Conquer Your heart
Team Futaba

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10-08-2013 11:59 PM  4 years agoPost 17
Dino Spadaccini

rrElite Veteran

USA

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wow things went quite pm me wish list and ill send it off see how easy that was

Dino

RIP Roman JR
Capt USA Align Factory Team Align - Conquer Your heart
Team Futaba

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10-09-2013 05:05 AM  4 years agoPost 18
turboomni

rrProfessor

East of the Equator

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Lower headspeeds are not new of course as that was the max years ago. I agree with Richard completely. The silent majority do not need Tareq performance from their heli's. Many think that is the answer. But I would guess ALIGN sees what is popular on the forums and what videos are popular,,,especially from IRCHA etc
with the crowd wailing ... I ordered a Align 550 dfc because frankly it is expendable. I have 2 Min Air Gassers that I do NOT want to crash. I thought and think the ALIGN would be a way out to have a heli that would be cheap to fix and if necessary upgrade for cheap. I do not want for example a Goblin to pucker me further. It will be my first bigger electric heli besides my OLD trex 450. I have read the 550 dfc tail ratio is not that great for anything but 2400 to 2500. I would like to see more options ,,like main gear/pinion ratios and tail gear ratios to really fine tune your heli to your liking . The problem is they think they {ALIGN} know and do not hear any info from us normal weekend guys.

Setup is everything, All my heli's can fly far better than I can pilot them

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10-09-2013 11:39 AM  4 years agoPost 19
Richardmid1

rrProfessor

Leeds, England

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Its crazy that they do it with the 250 (Upgrade larger pinion and 3 tail blade lengths to choose from!).

Ok we need to come to a compromise first before we put together a wish list.

Ill start with the most difficult one, the new 6s 450l, the motor kv is too high meaning small pinions, dropping to a 10T from 11 is quite a drop so simply adding a 10T pinion won't solve the problem but would be fine for people wanting to govern to say 3000. Personally 3000 is a little low on a 450 for 3D but 3200 should be enough and 3600+ for showing off, demos etc. If the KV was 1600 the kit could ship with a 12T pinion with a 13T pinion as an upgrade. Now if you are a 3600+ guy the stock 4.24 tail ratio is fine, however at 3200 you might experience tail blow outs so the tail ratio would need to be increased to around 4.7.

The story is pretty much the same thoughout the range except a simply pinion size drop would suffice with around a 10% increase in tail ratio.

I personally think the kits should come with the lower HS higher tail ratio option with a higher HS lower tail ratio upgrade option.

Ide be interested to hear other peoples ideas first. Or maybe people have already PM'd Dino?

60% of the time, it works every time!

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10-09-2013 12:49 PM  4 years agoPost 20
Dino Spadaccini

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Trex 700N 8.14:4.95
Trex 700E DFC 9.33:4.73
Trex800E PRO DFC 9.33:473

Autorotation Tail Drive Gear: 104T
Tail Drive Gear: 22T
this is for the E

the N is a 104 with a 21 which is a 4.95 so my statement about was correct about our new tail ratio the web are miss printing why no idea

again running a low head speed on the 700 or 800 is fine with these ratio i have done it many others have also you have two gearing ratio for the 700 and the 800

12/112 and 13/110

this is the stock gearing from the factory I looked at few web sights the spec are wrong do the math and you will see these number are correct

all pm sent to the factory and now its for them to see what they will do

as for none dfc heads you can still buy the V2 you need to part out the items you need

grip arms
center block
main shaft
3mm rods and link from the swash to grips

RIP Roman JR
Capt USA Align Factory Team Align - Conquer Your heart
Team Futaba

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