RunRyder RC
WATCH
 1 page 1373 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopter
e-
Miniature Aircraft Whiplash & Furion 6
› Is Kontronik Heli Jive 120 adequate for the Whippy 700? - SPRAG Issue???
07-14-2013 09:58 PM  5 years agoPost 1
Rockohaulic

rrElite Veteran

Canyon Country, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Or should I say, is it only just barely adequate???

Looks like I possibly had an ESC thermal shutdown on the Whippy today.

I have the Kontronik Heli Jive (with heat sink) and a Scorpion 4525-520kv motor.

So I didn't have a forced auto like with the Align motor, but the rpm suddenly died late into flights #2 and 3 and I had to limp home.

I read the temps. Motor was OK at 120 to 130 deg. ESC was at 155 near the capacitors. Is that hot enough to cause a thermal shutdown?

Basically I was 4 or 5 minutes into the flight, when suddenly power went way down. Did not shut down completely, but I had to limp it home like it was in "normal" mode.

Does that sound like a thermal shutdown?

Shouldn't this ridiculously expensive ESC be able to keep up with this motor in this bird???

Right now I am not too impressed with the Kontronik ESC....

Saturday morning I flew my helicopter in my pajamas
How it got in my pajamas I'll never know

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-14-2013 11:11 PM  5 years agoPost 2
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Program the ESC in KSA mode.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-15-2013 05:43 PM  5 years agoPost 3
Rockohaulic

rrElite Veteran

Canyon Country, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I shouldn't need KSA mode for a Scorpion motor. Right???

KSA is for an Align motor.

Saturday morning I flew my helicopter in my pajamas
How it got in my pajamas I'll never know

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-15-2013 05:46 PM  5 years agoPost 4
Rockohaulic

rrElite Veteran

Canyon Country, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

SPRAG Issue

I read on another forum that there is sometimes a sprag issue where the sprag lets go and it seems like you are losing power.

Have any of you experienced this issue? This heli and sprag are quite new. Do they let go when this new?

I just replaced the motor recently, and with the sprag off I relubed it with triflow. So it should be freshly lubed.

What do you guys lube the sprag with?

Are there any other signs that the sprag is acting up???

Thanks guys.

Saturday morning I flew my helicopter in my pajamas
How it got in my pajamas I'll never know

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-15-2013 08:32 PM  5 years agoPost 5
Kelly Fairbanks

rrApprentice

Twin Falls Idaho

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

First of all what pinion are you running ? What head speed ?

Team Synergy Team Scorpion

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
07-15-2013 08:45 PM  5 years agoPost 6
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

You NEED KSA mode for the Jive with the Scorpion 4525 motors to prevent commutation failures that can destroy the Jive. This is because of the very low IR of the large motor windings.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-29-2013 12:39 AM  5 years agoPost 7
Rockohaulic

rrElite Veteran

Canyon Country, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

My ESC Issue looks more like the Sprag letting go issue...

So I had the power loss issue again yesterday, which sent my bird over the cliff. Got lucky and very minimum damage. I was not as concerned about the crash as I was very frustrated at what caused it. I thought I had resolved any "ESC issues."

At first we thought it was the ESC issue. But after careful consideration, all the evidence points to the fact that it is the Sprag letting go issue.

Two things bothered me yesterday when we concluded it was an ESC issue:

1. The light on the Heli Jive was solid red. I purposefully left the battery plugged in so we could get a self diagnosis from the ESC when we got it to the bench. We were expecting the led to be flashing of course. But the light was solid red. As far as the ESC was concerned, it was happy.

2. The maneuver I did was a hard take off to inverted, then a moderate climb while piroing. All of that worked fine. Then once up high, I unload the bird and let it tail slide back. It was when I went from negative collective to positive that I noticed that I did not have any power.

One guy with the Sprag issue mentioned that his sprag let go when he unloaded from Idle up 2 to Idle up 1. Another guy mentioned that his let go when he was doing pitch pumps!

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

CONCLUSION
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the ESC is not the issue. It is the Sprag failing and letting go, making the bird seem like it lost power.

Anyway, I am pursuing this issue to find out if I can repeat it on the bench.

Stay tuned.....

Saturday morning I flew my helicopter in my pajamas
How it got in my pajamas I'll never know

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
07-29-2013 08:26 PM  5 years agoPost 8
no1gsxrman

rrNovice

Baltimore, Md

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Sprag
It is the sprag slipping. I had the same issue. The esc senses the big difference in rpm and goes into safe mode to keep from burning up. I swapped the esc out for another brand and it didn't shut down but it was more of a hiccup. I am waiting for the new sprag setup to run it.

Put the woman and children to bed it's time to go fly!

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
12-09-2013 03:25 AM  4 years agoPost 9
rocco.sj

rrVeteran

California,

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Question...can I buy the new sealed sprag and run it on my old version whiplash E700?

JR Americas
Evo Power Battery
Radio Frequency RC

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
12-09-2013 03:38 AM  4 years agoPost 10
Kelly Fairbanks

rrApprentice

Twin Falls Idaho

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Yes you can, you can change to the helical gears if you want as well but I tested the straight cut gear with the new one way a month or so ago and have not heard yet for sure but should be available now . You will have to mod you're current motor mount to fit the new bearing or buy the new motor mount as well .

Team Synergy Team Scorpion

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
12-09-2013 04:42 AM  4 years agoPost 11
rocco.sj

rrVeteran

California,

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

So its safe to say it would be easier to buy a new motor mount "EX" version and the new one way to eleminate any issues regarding the old sprag slipping?

I just want to be safe on the mechanical and do my last preflight check before I take my whiplask E7 in the air.

The other thing I need now also is good weather Northern California.

JR Americas
Evo Power Battery
Radio Frequency RC

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
12-09-2013 05:36 AM  4 years agoPost 12
Kelly Fairbanks

rrApprentice

Twin Falls Idaho

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Yes that is correct I carved one just to see if it would work and it is possible but a pain in the ars !

Team Synergy Team Scorpion

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 1 page 1373 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopter
e-
Miniature Aircraft Whiplash & Furion 6
› Is Kontronik Heli Jive 120 adequate for the Whippy 700? - SPRAG Issue???
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 4  Topic Subscribe

Wednesday, August 15 - 6:14 am - Copyright © 2000-2018 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online