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HomeAircraftHelicopterBeginners Corner › inverted
06-12-2013 02:38 AM  5 years agoPost 1
Scott1115

rrElite Veteran

Greenwich, CT

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For the love of g-d, I cannot get inverted!

I can hover nose in and that is it. I try tail in, left right, etc...and cannot, no matter how much I try, I cannot get it. Stick movements (aileron and elevator) are wrong. Orientations are confused, etc...

I have Phoenix, but not sure what I can do other than keep trying. Any advice would be helpful.

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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06-12-2013 02:46 AM  5 years agoPost 2
Nycatt

rrElite Veteran

New York

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Scott, this must be done in real life. While nose in inverted, walk and turn 45 degrees to the side of the heli while continuing to give it correction. You'll be looking at the side but your inputs will be nose in.




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06-12-2013 02:47 AM  5 years agoPost 3
Jerry K

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Houston Area

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Edited

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06-12-2013 02:56 AM  5 years agoPost 4
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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@JerryK - upright all orientations down pat - zero issues. Slow piros either direction are a-okay. I was referring to my inverted hovering. The only orientation I can barely 'get' is nose in.

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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06-12-2013 03:02 AM  5 years agoPost 5
rudyy

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E. Amherst, NY

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Just keep practising and it will eventually become your second nature.

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06-12-2013 05:34 AM  5 years agoPost 6
DougPenhall

rrApprentice

San Jose, CA - USA

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Scott, fly inverted side to side keeping the nose in the same direction. Gradually increase the side to side distance until you reach about 45 degrees. once you can do that, start over but this time stop at each side and hover there a bit before hovering back to the other side. Once you can hover on both sides at 45 degrees, start again but this time turn your body so it is following the heli.

After you have 45 degrees on both sides with you body turning, stay turned to one side and keep flying back and forth. You'll be turning your head to keep looking at the heli. After you can do that with your body 45 degrees one way, follow the heli with your body again, then do 45 degrees the other way. Next at that 45 degree angle fly the heli aroud in front of you, then fly forward and back. Eventually you'll be flying sideways inverted. Then practice the other side until you can fly sideway inverted on both sides.

Next hover inverted in front of you and just rotate the heli slowly in one direction then the other in place gradually rotating further and further until you reach 90 degrees.

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06-12-2013 10:25 AM  5 years agoPost 7
wrongler

rrProfessor

Brewerton, New York

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If you can do a loop you can fly inverted! At the top of the loop you are inverted, just stay that way until you get uncomfortable, then just continue the loop. Practice makes perfect!

Bill Whittaker

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06-12-2013 10:56 AM  5 years agoPost 8
AWittleWabbit

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O.C., CA

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I learned tail in inverted on the sim first. No one bothered telling me inverted nose in was easier till I was doing tail in inverted at the field.

What helped me was remembering the rudder stick "pushes" the tail in the direction you push it. Pushing the cyclic stick up pushes the nose in the air. Roll stays the same.

If you are a heretic and fly planks, flying a 3d foamy around inverted helps a lot too. Especially if you use the rudder to turn and the ailerons only to keep it level.

Lastly, try a short session daily on the sim. I do 5~10 mins or till I get frustrated, whatever comes first.

Heli-itis sufferer.

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06-12-2013 12:06 PM  5 years agoPost 9
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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Thanks for the responses.

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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06-12-2013 08:39 PM  5 years agoPost 10
Ladymagic

rrKey Veteran

South Korea

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Based on your first post, it sounds like you just need inverted stick time. If you have all your upright down like you say then it shouldn't take you much time at all.

I think you should spend a few minutes watching your swash plate as you cycle your cyclic. Pay attention to the direction it tilts. The heli will always tilt in the direction that the swash tilts. Then, turn the model upside down and watch how the swash tilts again. Make a consious effort to understand and anticipate which direction it will tilt when given a basic input.

Other than that, you just need inverted stick time (on your sim). Try and be patient and focus only on one orientation at a time. Turn off any "cheater" settings you may have so you get the most realistic response of your heli. Once you are proficient with a particular orientation, rotate your tail a quarter turn for as long as you can before you start to feel like you are losing control of the heli. When that happens, return to your defualt oreintation.

The key to learning new oreintations is "stepping" the learning curve and always have your starting orientation (the orientation you are most proficient/comfortable with). Never try to do too much at once. It'll just confuse your reaction times. It takes a alot of patience and focus and the right mindset. Normally, I would evaluate your proficiency with a series of orientation voice commands during an online sim session to determine if your are really ready, but since you stated that you are most proficient with a nose-in inverted hover I would tell you to make that your default/bail-out orientation. Then do the quarter side-ons, Then do your tail-in ,then full side-ons(side-ons or the most difficult)from nose-in,then full side-ons from tail-in.

Remember that the transition to/from each orientation is just as important as the orietation itself. (Those quarter side-ons are your corner stone for transitions). Your goal is to steadily transition without upsetting your hovering position. I can go all day on techniques that will get you there fast, but i'm trying to be brief here. If you want a fully detailed template feel free to PM me. But, this technique is proven and I've used it to train several pilots with the same issue that you have. It just takes time, patience and the right attitude. I know you can do it.

Mellisa

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06-12-2013 09:00 PM  5 years agoPost 11
RCHSF

rrKey Veteran

NC

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I was having trouble flying inverted. I could hover nose-in fine. This guy I meet online in realflight from Australia was siming with me, and helped me for like 3 weeks every other day. He taught me to go from hovering nose-in to flying counter clockwise circuits, and clockwise in FF, then backwards both ways. Now I can do it on sim great. Along with some other stuff. Also working on the piroflip to. Practice on one thing at a time. Once your invented hold it, and start flying forwards by giveing a little back ele then use some aileron, and rudder keep practicing till you can make a circuit. Then once down pat try other way.

I'm still working on inverted stuff myself. But slowly working past hovering inverted.
All it takes is sim practice. Lots of it to.

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06-12-2013 10:53 PM  5 years agoPost 12
Scott1115

rrElite Veteran

Greenwich, CT

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Okay...

If I am flying (inverted nose first) from left to right and I want to turn left (CCW) I should give left aileron, right rudder, forward elevator and back on the collective?

If I am flying (inverted nose first) from right to left and I want to turn right (CW) I should give right aileron, left rudder, forward elevator and back on the collective?

I seem to get mixed up moving one direction then the other. I will get this if it kills me!

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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06-12-2013 11:33 PM  5 years agoPost 13
AWittleWabbit

rrElite Veteran

O.C., CA

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Case 1 correct. But don't over do the the forward elevator or it will kill your forward momentum. Same for case 2.

Try and remember the aile and rudder sticks will move in the opposite direction.

I'm actually much more comfortable going backwards inverted. So when I fly forwards inverted,I remember the aileron is not reversed, then I just give opposite rudder.

Heli-itis sufferer.

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06-13-2013 01:02 AM  5 years agoPost 14
rudyy

rrElite Veteran

E. Amherst, NY

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Okay...
If I am flying (inverted nose first) from left to right and I want to turn left (CCW) I should give left aileron, right rudder, forward elevator and back on the collective?
If I am flying (inverted nose first) from right to left and I want to turn right (CW) I should give right aileron, left rudder, forward elevator and back on the collective?
I seem to get mixed up moving one direction then the other. I will get this if it kills me!
You may find this helpful to remember.

For CW, both sticks separate apart
For CCW, both sticks come together.

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06-13-2013 03:00 AM  5 years agoPost 15
icanfly

rrElite Veteran

ontario

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nose in inverted can be easier if you find nose out normal easy. Flip the bird and middle finger, oopsee, I mean, roll the bird over forward or backward nose out to tail out inverted, this is now when your stick movements work from side to side in unison but in the opposite direction than right side up, think "sticks together". Play on the sim with the speed turned to 50 percent, then crank it, then back off to 60, then 70, then 80, then tha world.

small movements on the sticks, small movements.

good luck, crashing in the sim is pennies.

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06-13-2013 04:21 AM  5 years agoPost 16
DougPenhall

rrApprentice

San Jose, CA - USA

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Scott, lift the remote over your head with the controls facing down so it is in the same orientation as the bird, then the cotrols should be easy. Next, do the same thing using your mind but actually hold the remote normal.

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