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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Got Static? Say No More, Me Fixum Problum and How
05-07-2013 02:56 PM  6 years ago
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icanfly

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ontario

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Got Static? Say No More, Me Fixum Problum and How
Sick to death of my heli madness static issues not yet resolved when 450 Al started to get wonky last fall and has not settled yet, I've invented a solution to static discharge without grounding strap and regular applications of silicone grease spray, and cheap as buying a sheet of bristol board or paper. Make sure it's a little stiff and rolls nice while reflexing a lot.

And how you may ask? Well, since wmiller pounced his logo700 into the ground and my al450 has still not become glitch free, instead of suggesting "THE FIX" I just performed it on a spare tube and we are in business.

What to do? the 450 can be done with a single 8.5x11 inch sheet of paper. you'll need a dowel slightly smaller to fit into the tube but not smaller by more than a mm or two.

You cut the paper half way from center to tips diagonally, parallel with the diagonal center line, that same way they measure your comp screen. If you have some paper or light card sock for larger helis that spans the same length as your tube, skip the prior step.

Cut a section of light card stock or paper the length of your boom that will roll around the boom radius several times for light paper, once if its a good stiff card stock.

Roll the paper on the boom first to pre form it. Then roll it on the dowel, tight enough so that it will feed into your boom tube.

Feed the rolled paper tube and dowel into the boom. Let the paper expand outward to mate with the boom inside wall.

Pull the dowel out.

Not done yet.

You have a choice to leave the paper tube inside the boom at this stage or slowly feed part out one half one way and the other half the other end, then pushing it back in all the way to where it will stay on the heli. You don't want the tube to expand or your going to do the whole process again.

Either ca the paper in spots (as you pull it out slightly), definitely the ends where the paper could catch (almost impossible) or move on to the next step.

When the tube is in it's final position you can spray your silicone inside the tube. It will douse the paper INSULATOR and last a freaking lot longer than 3 flights, I like it.

The rubber band lives on in the world of fbless electronics, yea.

why why why?

You see, they use paper to insulate lots of heavy duty transformers that step down 200,000 volts,

whywhywhy?

Make sense da?
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05-07-2013 04:22 PM  6 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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Gainesville, Fl, USA

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I though Wmillers heli was a Compass 7HV???
Also pics would be awesome....never heard of doing it this way......Ron
Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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05-07-2013 04:40 PM  6 years ago
JKos

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Redondo Beach, CA

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No, it doesn't make much sense. Static electricity is caused (allowed to happen) by insulators. Your adding an insulator to the inside of a conductive metal tube.

- John
RR rules!
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05-07-2013 04:51 PM  6 years ago
icanfly

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Yes Compass, my mistake. Nasty splat never mind the model. My 450's been eatin dirt the past dozen tests recently so I'm going to try things. Could this be "IT"?

JKOS, though it's true layers allow electricity to flow between them, the sleeve is an insulator to prevent the belt RUBBING the boom walls which is what creates the static charge, RUBBING. Like a balloon on a smooth surface, and that's rubber removing electricity from it's partner due to friction, (atomic things and all)

No RUB, (no three men in a tub, LOL) no electricity. black as day.

Got pics, will upload soon.
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05-07-2013 04:52 PM  6 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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The belt rubbing is not causing the static build up, the mere fact it is running through the boom is creating the static charge.Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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05-07-2013 04:55 PM  6 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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Van De Graaff Generator
Good read here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_de_Graaff_generator
Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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05-07-2013 07:54 PM  6 years ago
icanfly

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so, there are two varieties of electrons in altered but unified dynamics, one in motion while the other,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
static.

due to the molecules between, do you suggest electrons are being whipped out of thin air?

If so then? Maybe the paper will slow them down? Kinda like a diaper, I kid.

It's only a machine with inherent strengths and weaknesses, it's time to play if you wish. My toy isn't happy lately, there-fore,,, its resting.
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05-07-2013 08:12 PM  6 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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Ground it, then it will be happy.Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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05-07-2013 10:26 PM  6 years ago
RCHSF

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NC

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Here's how I'm grounding the belt on my 450 to the motor mount. I hope this will keep the static down. As recommended by a nice guy on RR Forum. I also put a thin coat of epoxy over the ground wire to keep the tail slider from banging against it. Also to make sure no strain is put on it. I also have my gyro stop just before it anyway. All's left is to run a wire from any bolt hole on the tail case to the motor mount. The other end of the ground wire from the bearing, is under a small washer. I also sanded the tail boom on the tail case end so the whole boom is also grounded. And I tested everything with my multimeter on continuity test to confirm it was grounded for sure. As I will do from tail to motor mount latter.
I also sanded the inside of the bearing houseing to make sure the wire and bearing makes contact. But I did put a tiny ammount of threadlock on the outer bearing edge before I pressed it in to lock it in place.

Watch at YouTube

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05-08-2013 03:25 AM  6 years ago
icanfly

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if we're on the same page, the static comes from the tail.

here's the sleeve thing.

Just attaching a wire on the boom at the tail block and running it to the motor mount is not enough?
.
.
.
.

Heli was caught resting today,

.
.
.

I'll examine that vandergraf device again to see what might be amiss in the equasion.
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05-08-2013 04:08 AM  6 years ago
RCHSF

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NC

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icanfly

Just attaching a wire on the boom at the tail block and running it to the motor mount is not enough?
No the copper wire needs direct connection to the tail shaft bearing, that the tail shaft spins inside of. That involves sanding the inside of the bearing recess, so the iodized coating is off so the bearing and copper wire makes full contact with the aluminum tail case. Then sand the iodized off the tail boom where it fits into the tail case. So it will be grounded also. Then jump a wire from any of the tail case bolts, up to the motor mount. Then check continuity between the tail shaft itself, that the belt rides on and motor mount.

See the iodized coating inside the case halves where the bearing sits in the little cup is pretty much insolated from the bearing, so that coating needs to come off. Then bore a tiny hole through the case side for the wire to enter to the outter edge of the bearing. That will insure the tail shaft is grounded.

I used 1000 grit wet/dry 3M paper to sand real smooth and slick. But before you press the bearing in all the way put a tiny ammount of thread lock on the bearings outter edge to keep it from spinning inside the case, that way it wont waller out the bearing cup/recess. You want the inner race of the bearing to spin with the shaft, but not the outter part.
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05-08-2013 10:22 AM  6 years ago
RogerRabbit62

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Thuerigen germany

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There is a lot of easy Solutions to that Problem which all have been tested Long time ago on the 35 / 72 MHz time.

1) use a copper mesh like used in grounding and attach it that way, that it touches the belt (sporadically is enough) and the Frame.

2) put a thin electric wire between all carbon plates

3) ground the - of the rx-batterie

No more Problems und you never have to care again.

Alternative is just to have a small bearing press against the belt and ground the bearing holder.

Easiest is not SILICONE SPRAY (pretty useless in this application that is why you have to use it so often) but either

- graphite spray
- antistatic spray.
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05-08-2013 10:35 AM  6 years ago
adamsz06

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Geilenkirchen Germany

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How about lining the inside of the boom with a dryer sheet lol. "Bounce" might be appropriate for this application R.I.P. Roman
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05-08-2013 11:06 AM  6 years ago
icanfly

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ontario

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The motor mount sides were filed off a bit so there's continuity between all the carbon frames. There's a wire from the mm to the tail boom, but it appears like I've overlooked the tail parts.

The source of static is the belt then?

I may be living with a magnetic earth or ionized air based anomaly. There was an day recently when I noticed a section of rocks on a retaining wall in the back yard were not wet from rain even though it was raining outside. The area runs diagonally and is where my heli experienced the most electronic difficulties last year up to now. I may be living on a fault line in the earths crust.

And you know, after reading wikipedia Van Der Graaff machine article, it makes sense that the charge on my belt begins to discharge around the minute mark every time.

And it is the IONS in the air that are the source of static while friction of the belt on the wheels are to blame for the accumulation of electrons. The belt rubs on the wheels, not the walls of the boom.

It's tedious work grounding the pulley shafts with wire.
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05-08-2013 11:37 AM  6 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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You can't rely on the carbon for continuity, you need to run a direct wire to be absolutely sureTeam MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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05-08-2013 11:49 AM  6 years ago
RCHSF

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NC

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Yeah the belt is the problem, in rotating in a circular fashion back and forth through the inside of the boom. It builds up static on everything around it, maybe it self also.

Like I said you need a ground wire direct contact with the tail shaft bearing.
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05-08-2013 11:50 AM  6 years ago
icanfly

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thanks RCHSF, that'll be the next thing to do.
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05-08-2013 01:03 PM  6 years ago
icanfly

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given all the info, and after buying some copper wick recently, it was in my opinion that the simplest thing to do was similar to what slot cars use to pass electricity from the track rails to the car.

So now we have a rubber band instead of track rail with a charge, and we need a pick up to transfer electrons to be useful, but in the case of a heli stop it from zapping things nearby through the build up of electrical ions. It is interesting to note that in the Van Der Graaf machine, the build of charged particles are positive electrons.

Take a look

All tolled my 7.4v system works now without getting freaky. The CC bec is great because I can test everything, then plug the motor in at the last second before putting it up. Not a worry about accidental start ups of any kind.

Additionally, the 7.4v motor speed has saved a few blades, gears, and some nasty crashes due to higher rpm with 11.1v and high blade velocity.

Thanks for the help on this, sure needed a different perspective to see the belt itself was the problem.
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05-08-2013 03:09 PM  6 years ago
Mark C

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Houston, TX - USA

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the build of charged particles are positive electrons
Nowhere in this entire universe that we know of. Unless you consider antielectrons or "positrons" "

A positive charge is the lack of electrons within the frame of reference.
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05-08-2013 03:42 PM  6 years ago
RCHSF

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NC

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Here is a tid bit more detail.

Watch at YouTube

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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Got Static? Say No More, Me Fixum Problum and How
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