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HomeMy Site✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Questions about a Good Generator?
04-02-2013 02:12 AM  6 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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I just dusted it all off for the first time in perhaps as many years, to take the pics.
Thanks for the nudge.
This stuff would make even the Honda grunt.

Team POP Secret
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04-02-2013 02:13 AM  6 years ago
kris L

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NY

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1.6 kVA = 1600 W for a resistive load. I'm pretty sure both manufacturers are basing their ratings the same...resistive.
They are both rated the same.
Bob- As I can't prove otherwise,I will agree with you.

Kris
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04-02-2013 02:16 AM  6 years ago
kris L

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NY

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This stuff would make even the Honda grunt.

Then get the Yamaha.

Kris
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04-02-2013 02:20 AM  6 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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Oil getting into the cylinder..Could of been a bolt that wasn't tight,bad seal or bad gasket but was for sure getting oil in the cylinder..

EDITED:: Oops,didn't read all of Stang's post...
Any of those would have also caused same also. But what I posted is direct from the guy who bought it and thats what dealer told him. They said main problem was faulty valve seal which fouled the cylinder with excessive carbon build up and they also changed piston ring while they were in there due to this build up.
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04-02-2013 02:24 AM  6 years ago
kris L

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NY

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I copied and pasted the article from Camping life. - Kris

Portable Power
June 2, 2011
Filed under Feature Stories, Generators & Power

Thanks to the modern portable generator, you don¡¯t have to feel like you just started up a lawnmower when you¡¯re in the campground. Today¡¯s Compact Generators are incredibly smooth, quiet and fuel-efficient ¡ª and have some amazing capabilities. Honda brought portable generator technology into the 21st century with features like the fuel-sipping Eco-Throttle and inverter technology, which produced ¡°clean¡± power for running computers and other sensitive equipment. But since the introduction of Honda¡¯s popular EU Series inverter generators several years ago, competitors have emerged ¡ª not the least of which are Yamaha and Generac.

All three manufacturers offer 2,000-watt portable generators. Each boast of lightweight fuel efficiency, quiet operation and ¡°clean¡± power generation. We decided to see how Honda¡¯s popular EU2000i, Yamaha¡¯s EF2000iS and Generac¡¯s iX2000 compare to give you an idea of which generator may be right for you.

Parameters for weight, ease of use, sound level, fuel consumption and price were established. Each of the Packable Generators was filled to the manufacturers¡¯ recommended top-off point with oil and fuel. We then used each generator to power a common 650-watt coffeemaker for 90 minutes. We chose this appliance for two reasons: 650 watts represents about one-third of each unit¡¯s maximum output, which we felt was a reasonable average for a day¡¯s use (running television, DVD player, short bursts of microwave use, etc.) and would give us a good idea of sound level and fuel consumption for a typical day. And coffeemakers cycle on and off, which mimics typical use as different loads are turned on and off.

We knew that this load alone would be considered too cushy for most of you, so after the coffeemaker test, we connected a 1,500-watt electric heater to each generator for one hour to create a steady load near the unit¡¯s maximum output.

We measured the sound level of each unit using a digital decibel meter in both economy and normal settings, and under the static load created by the 1,500-watt heater to determine how loud these generators are when they¡¯re really working. The goal here was not to duplicate the manufacturer¡¯s decibel findings, but to compare how loud each unit was under the same conditions. To do this, we marked a spot on the garage floor (door open, of course) and placed the test subject on that mark, with the exhaust facing toward the open garage door. We then stood five feet behind and to the left of the generator on another marked spot to establish some consistency.

When each test run was complete, we used a measuring vessel marked in milliliters to refill the unit to the manufacturer¡¯s recommended top-off point, which gave us a good idea of fuel consumption. Why not use a burette marked in CCs to measure fuel consumption? For one thing, it would be easy to inadvertently vary the top-off point (before or after testing) by several CCs, and at least a few CCs were lost fueling each unit. And does anyone really care if one unit is a few CCs more efficient in fuel consumption than another? In any case, we decided that, if the fuel consumption was that close, we would obtain a CC burette and run the test again.

Generac iX2000

The Generac was the only unit in this test that came with its own oil and a handy funnel, which we used to fill the other test units with oil. The Generac was also the only unit in this test that required priming. Before starting, the cap must be switched to the ¡°off¡± position and the integrated plunger pumped a few times. When we started the Generac, it was noticeably louder than the Honda and Yamaha; and pulling the cord yielded a mechanical noise. Once it started, it vibrated considerably more than the others.

The Generac was heavier, louder and thirstier than the two others we tested. It can¡¯t be operated in parallel like the others, and it¡¯s only 49-state certified, so California residents won¡¯t be able to purchase it. However, it¡¯s also nearly half the price. Bottom line: If you¡¯re on a budget, you don¡¯t ever need to double up your generators, and if you don¡¯t live in California, this might be an option to consider.

Honda EU2000i

Honda was first to bring inverter technology to super-quiet, fuel-efficient portable generators, and campers haven¡¯t been able to get enough of them since. We found the Honda EU2000i had a narrow fuel opening, which could make fueling a time-consuming process. Rush the job, and fuel can sputter out of the top and down the side of the unit. Our California model also had a tethered cap, and the tether was too short, so half the time the cap was in the way.

The Honda is easy to access for service, with only one screw holding the engine cover on. And, Honda cleverly made it a large screw head, which you can tighten or loosen with a coin or key if you don¡¯t have tools handy. It also requires the fewest steps to start, which may not sound like a big deal until you¡¯re trying to remember how to get it going outside in the cold wind. And, of course, the Honda is wonderfully quiet and runs smooth as silk.

Its control panel is well-organized and offers two 120-volt AC outlets, a parallel power outlet and 12-volt DC outlet.

Yamaha EF2000iS

The Yamaha was an attractive unit with a bright chrome ring around the starter. If the competition had been for best-dressed generator, the Yamaha would have won hands down ¡ª but this unit also worked as good as it looked. The Yamaha had a wide fuel neck, making refueling easy, and it had a built-in fuel gauge (the only one in this test so equipped). The curb weight was the same as the Honda. And it was slightly quieter at idle, just as smooth and more fuel-efficient than the Honda.

Yamaha was the only generator in our test with a fuel petcock, which meant we could turn off fuel flow to the carburetor. This is a clever feature that allows you to store the generator for extended periods without fear of gumming the carburetor with old fuel. After removing fuel from the fuel tank, the petcock is switched to ¡°off¡± and the engine is run until it is out of fuel.

Other Yamaha features we appreciated included a gear-driven camshaft, as opposed to the rubber belt of the Honda, and a 500-hour emission compliance lifetime, which is twice that of the Honda¡¯s.

The only improvement we would make is to the engine cover. It uses two small screws that require a screwdriver to remove. We would prefer larger, easier to remove fasteners like the Honda cover has.

The Generac is a bargain for those who need one, and the Honda is a great generator and worthy of anyone¡¯s investment, but in our opinion, the Yamaha offers a little more for your money when it comes to buying portable power.

To see how two of these generators worked together, check out ¡°Parallel Operation.¡±

What is an Inverter Generator?
An inverter generator works by generating ¡°raw¡± (unconditioned) AC power, which it converts into DC power, then ¡°inverts¡± back to AC power. In the process, the unit¡¯s inverter cleans and stabilizes the power, creating stable, consistent current that is suitable for use in sensitive electronics such as computers. A standard (non-inverter) generator is subject to fluctuations in voltage that, while not harmful to things like lights and radios, can wreak havoc on high-tech devices.

GENERAC
Engine: 127cc OHV
Fuel Capacity: 1.0 gal
Dimensions (L x W x H): 22¡å x 12¡å x 18¡å
Curb weight: 56 lbs.
Starting procedure: Open fuel valve, close cap vent, prime fuel system with integral plunger, open fuel tank vent, engage choke, pull starter cord
Sound levels (Db): Economy mode, 78.6; normal mode, 80.5; 1,500-watt load, 82.3.
Fuel consumption: 1,200 ml
MSRP: $681
Warranty (residential): Two years
The good: Nearly half the price of its competition; comes with oil and funnel
The bad: Heavy, loud, rough, thirsty, not 50-state legal, can¡¯t be used in parallel

HONDA
Engine: 98.5 cc OHC
Fuel Capacity: 0.95 gal
Dimensions (L x W x H): 20.2¡å x 11.4¡å x 16.7¡å
Curb weight: 50 lbs.
Starting procedure: Turn fuel cap to on; activate choke; turn engine switch to on; pull starter cord
Sound levels (Db): Economy mode, 70.3; normal mode, 78.3; 1,500-watt load, 78.5.
Fuel consumption: 950 ml
MSRP: $1150
Warranty: Three years
The good: Quiet and reliable, features innovations such as Eco-Throttle, inverter technology and parallel operation, easy to service
The bad: Difficult to fuel, sometimes stubborn to start

YAMAHA
Engine: 79cc OHV
Fuel Capacity: 1.11 gal
Dimensions (L x W x H): 13.3¡å x 11.0¡å x 17.9¡å
Curb weight: 50 lbs.
Starting procedure: Turn fuel cap to on; activate choke; turn engine switch to on; pull starter cord
Sound levels (Db): Economy mode, 70.3; normal mode, 78.3; 1,500-watt load, 78.5.
Fuel consumption: 950 ml
Price: $1,099
Warranty: Three years
The good: Great looking, easy to start, quiet, integral fuel gauge
The bad: Engine cover requires screwdriver to remove

SOURCES:
Generac
888/436-3722; generac.com

American Honda, Power Equipment Division
770/497-6400; hondapowerequipment.com

Yamaha Motor Corporation, USA
800/962-7926; yamaha-motor.com
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04-02-2013 02:35 AM  6 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Honestly, I'd rather you prove otherwise.
I'm interested in the Yamaha but I just haven't seen how it does on heavy inductive loads. Even the < $500 units can run coffee pots, 1500W heaters and other resistive loads without issue. It's starting air conditioning and large power tools that the Honda has impressed me with.
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04-02-2013 02:41 AM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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I copied and pasted the article from Camping life.
Very in-depth review, thanks for sharing. I guess I missed the part about the camshaft melting in their review.
  
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04-02-2013 02:44 AM  6 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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Honestly, I'd rather you prove otherwise.
I'm interested in the Yamaha but I just haven't seen how it does on heavy inductive loads. Even the < $500 units can run coffee pots, 1500W heaters and other resistive loads without issue. It's starting air conditioning and large power tools that the Honda has impressed me with.
As stated earlier mine was running a standard size fridge and a good sized freezer at same time as well as lights and computer etc at wifes friends house during hurricane. I have run electric leaf blower and a few other power tools no problem. So far havent found anything it cant do.
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04-02-2013 02:52 AM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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Honestly, I'd rather you prove otherwise.
I'm interested in the Yamaha but I just haven't seen how it does on heavy inductive loads. Even the < $500 units can run coffee pots, 1500W heaters and other resistive loads without issue. It's starting air conditioning and large power tools that the Honda has impressed me with.
Are you an ARRL member? Did you read the review?

According to ARRL review they ran the Honda for 30 minutes with a 2000W load w/o any issue. Performing the same identical load test on the Yamaha and in 20 seconds the overload circuitry kicked in and it shut off.
  
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04-02-2013 02:55 AM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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Here's an overview of the June 2012 issue of QST magazine I previously mentioned.

Watch at YouTube

  
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04-02-2013 02:58 AM  6 years ago
kris L

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NY

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I'm interested in the Yamaha.
Come to the darkside Bob.
I just haven't seen how it does on heavy inductive loads.
Bob- I own Yamahas 2400 so I can't test a 2000 out for you and the 2400 is not an even match for the Honda 2000. If I had a 2000 I would try it on things you request.

Kris
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04-02-2013 02:59 AM  6 years ago
max232

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Pensacola

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Sorry about not fully quoting you, but I didn't see another opinion other than you think Hondas are crap in your full quote, my bad.

I have ran mine in this configuration for 3 or 4 days straight w/o shutting them down at all( just fill the large tank when it got low)

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04-02-2013 03:00 AM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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ust dusted it all off for the first time in perhaps as many years, to take the pics.
Thanks for the nudge.
This stuff would make even the Honda grunt.
Nice!

I still have an old Heathkit TNC I built.
  
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04-02-2013 03:05 AM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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Sorry about not fully quoting you, but I didn't see another opinion other than you think Hondas are crap in your full quote, my bad.

I have ran mine in this configuration for 3 or 4 days straight w/o shutting them down at all( just fill the large tank when it got low)
Nice! I'm running one EU2000i with the BERGS extended run tank so I'm good for 63+ hours straight. I certainly won't be changing oil every 10 hours as someone recommended earlier in this thread.
  
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04-02-2013 12:33 PM  6 years ago
hootowl

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Garnet Valley, Pa.

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Looks like this thread has run it's course. I think the conclusion is you can't go wrong with the Honda or the Yamaha. The others are taking chances on satisfaction.Wolves don't lose sleep over the opinions of sheep
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04-02-2013 12:37 PM  6 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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+1! Just like all the other generator threads that eventually reach the same conclusion.  
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04-02-2013 12:41 PM  6 years ago
SSN Pru

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Taxachusetts

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Other Yamaha features we appreciated included a gear-driven camshaft, as opposed to the rubber belt of the Honda, and a 500-hour emission compliance lifetime, which is twice that of the Honda¡¯s.
That's an interesting point in the review. Their engine lifespan is only for emissions purposes. I suppose after the 500 hour mark (magically) the engnies could start making more emissions.

Internet reviews and videos have to be taken with a grain of salt. I have found that FAR MORE people flock to youtube and reviews when something negative happens. Far FEWER make review videos and post reviews when their equipment functions as advertised.
Stupidity can be cured. Ignorance is for life!
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04-02-2013 01:48 PM  6 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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That's an interesting point in the review. Their engine lifespan is only for emissions purposes. I suppose after the 500 hour mark (magically) the engnies could start making more emissions.
I believe it has to do with engine starting to show signs of slight wear which start to affect emissions. Obviously this is not the engines expected "lifetime" as both Honda and Yamaha will go thousands of hours if properly serviced. Its just showing that Honda started to show signs at 250 hours and Yamaha started at 500 hours. The cheap knock offs start at 125 hours. Stands to reason that the all metal Yamaha engine would go longer than Honda before needing an overhaul. But in all fairness there are many reports of Hondas going thousands of hours so how relevant this particular rating is is anyones guess.
Looks like this thread has run it's course. I think the conclusion is you can't go wrong with the Honda or the Yamaha. The others are taking chances on satisfaction.
I agree.
+1! Just like all the other generator threads that eventually reach the same conclusion.
Again I agree
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04-02-2013 02:19 PM  6 years ago
jschenck

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La Vista, NE.

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Stands to reason that the all metal Yamaha engine would go longer than Honda before needing an overhaul. But in all fairness there are many reports of Hondas going thousands of hours so how relevant this particular rating is is anyones guess.
probably has more to do with how often you change the oil and the quality of the oil than any other single factor.

Personally I think I will get the Ryobi - based on HD's warranty. I hope to be able to do a side by side with the Honda that another club member has.
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04-02-2013 04:33 PM  6 years ago
kris L

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NY

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Looks like this thread has run it's course. I think the conclusion is you can't go wrong with the Honda or the Yamaha. The others are taking chances on satisfaction.
Well, I half agree, the thread has run it's course but I think people are going wrong with the Honda.
+1! Just like all the other generator threads that eventually reach the same conclusion.
Yeah, Get the Yamaha!

Kris
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