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01-11-2013 10:47 PM  7 years ago
outhouse

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auburn ca

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Buy the 700!!!

You send me a xmas card next year you will be so happy with it.

having 2 600's and a 700, one of my 600's hasnt flown in a year.

The 700 is the only way to go.

the stability and size and power and visibility all make it my go to heli.

450, 500, 600E, 600n, the 700 is the dope.
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01-11-2013 11:07 PM  7 years ago
Santiago P

rrProfessor

Dayton

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thanks chuck

Old man advice: bigger is better, cus I cant see the little ones as well.
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01-11-2013 11:20 PM  7 years ago
Chuck Bole

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Tulsa Ok. U.S.A.

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Both of you hit the nail on the head..
700's are cooler and eaiser to see..

chuck
Team Synergy Field Representative / Rail Blades / Scorpion Power Systems / HeliLids
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01-11-2013 11:45 PM  7 years ago
Tbird

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Indiana

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+1 get an e6/e7
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01-12-2013 12:04 AM  7 years ago
Dan Minick

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Columbus, WI

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+1 on the Synergy!
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01-12-2013 12:32 AM  7 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Here's some simple data for comparison....just some info to chew on.
As you can see, the 600 has higher power to weight ratio and lower disk loading than the 700. So, on average, it would have higher collective response. Not a ton different...they're in the same ballpark really. The cyclic response is affected by gyroscopic forces which is the main reason the 700 is more stable (ie...less agile). However, with decent FBL equipment and setup, stability can be pretty much equaled with the 600 these days.
Knowing that the 700 has to use more power has a lot to do with why it is more "cool"...if not all to do with it. "I paid more and therefore it is better" also plays an important role.

Hey, anybody have info on the E6/E7? Might be interesting to see how it compares. I'd need:
# cells, mah, flight duration, disk dia, and AUW for typical setup.

Logo 400
6 s # cells
3000 mah Pack mah
1.14 m Disk Dia
1.02 m^2 Disk Area
80% pack usage
2400 mah Charge mah
2.00 kg AUW
5 min Duration
80% eff


22.8 v voltage
55 w-hr Energy output
657 watts Watts Ave Bat Consumption
525 watts Watts Ave at motor shaft


0.7 hp Power Ave at motor shaft
0.35 hp/kg Ave power to weight
1.96 kg/m^2 Disk Loading

Logo 600
10 s # cells
4000 mah Pack mah
1.45 m Disk Dia
1.65 m^2 Disk Area
80% pack usage
3200 mah Charge mah
3.40 kg AUW
5 min Duration
80% eff


38 v voltage
122 w-hr Energy output
1459 watts Watts Ave Bat Consumption
1167 watts Watts Ave at motor shaft


1.6 hp Power Ave at motor shaft
0.46 hp/kg Ave power to weight
2.06 kg/m^2 Disk Loading

Logo 700
12 s # cells
5000 mah Pack mah
1.61 m Disk Dia
2.04 m^2 Disk Area
80% pack usage
4000 mah Charge mah
5.50 kg AUW
5 min Duration
80% eff


45.6 v voltage
182 w-hr Energy output
2189 watts Watts Ave Bat Consumption
1751 watts Watts Ave at motor shaft


2.3 hp Power Ave at motor shaft
0.43 hp/kg Ave power to weight
2.70 kg/m^2 Disk Loading
Team POP Secret
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01-12-2013 01:23 AM  7 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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Gainesville, Fl, USA

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All of those numbers can be drastically different depending on setup.Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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01-12-2013 02:41 AM  7 years ago
Ace Dude

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USA

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The rotor disk on the 600 is just a little smaller 1450mm versus 1610mm or 10% difference.
That actually represents an increase in total disk area of over 23% not including spindle width.
  
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01-12-2013 02:49 AM  7 years ago
heli-cuzz

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Pittston, Pa. USA

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600 and 700 are both awesome to fly.
Choose your poison!!!

Fury 55 NIB Furion6 CGY750 fbl helicopter-Frenzy CGY750 fbl nitro-Frenzy fbl NOBAR90
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01-12-2013 04:02 AM  7 years ago
JitsuGuy

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Tulsa, Oklahoma

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Wow, lots of info still... But it seems the 700 makes more sense considering the cost is not that much different but the stability, "presenece" and power factors are worth it.

Thanks!
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01-12-2013 05:36 AM  7 years ago
Santiago P

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Dayton

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Bob

You should have picked a more representative 700 example.
The E7 with 5000 packs is over a pound lighter than a the Logo700, and my Diabolo is even a tad lighter than that (albeit boutique).

thats over 10% lighter.

You are also committing a big sin in assuming the aerodynamic efficiency is the same for both.
All of those numbers can be drastically different depending on setup
Very true.
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01-12-2013 05:57 AM  7 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Yeah, I figured but JitsuGuy seemed sold on Mikado already so no point throwing that wrench in. I was just giving comparisons of common Logo setups.Team POP Secret
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01-12-2013 02:47 PM  7 years ago
Santiago P

rrProfessor

Dayton

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BTW
You did a very nice job doing the comparison: power avaliable, average power to the shaft, to disk etc.
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01-12-2013 04:13 PM  7 years ago
rexxigpilot

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rexxig2@comcast.net

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JinsuGuy, IMO your initial thought to go with the Logo 600SX is the best choice for you coming from a 450 machine. I have four 700 class helis (2 nitro and 2 electric). Even though I have a Goblin 700, I still enjoy my Logo 600 more than the Goblin. I have my Logo 600 set up on 12S, 4000mAh packs and a relatively low headspeed by today's standard of 2000 and 2100 RPM for Idle Up 1 and Idle Up 2, respectively. I can get very good performance (it is not too heavy, actually kind of floaty compared to my 700 electrics) and still get 6.5 to 7.0 minutes of flight time set up like this. 5 minutes just pisses me off.

If you do go the 700 route, the Goblin is a hyperactive heli that will remind you of your 450 heli, provided you have the headspeed turned up on both. My Goblin headspeeds are 2250 and 2350, ID1 and ID2. The only problem is its flight time is only 3.5 minutes. The Logo 700 can get 5 minutes at 2050 RPM. I think most other 700 electric helis will get about 5 minutes flights using reasonable headspeeds.

The 700s do have a larger presence in the air, but that thrill goes away after 10 flights or so. Coming from a 450 they will both look huge in the air to you.
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01-12-2013 04:42 PM  7 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Wow, we finally agree on something Rex.

Particularly the gap closing in 10 flights or so. That's what I found, after the initial thrill wears off, the difference doesn't seem quite so much.

And, going from a 450 to a 600 or going from a 450 to a 700, the difference there will not be noticeable at all.

Of course, all this depends on the individual. If cost is of no concern, they both will be a great experience comming from a 450.
Team POP Secret
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01-12-2013 06:29 PM  7 years ago
Ronald Thomas

rrMaster

Gainesville, Fl, USA

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The larger presence in the air will immediately return after he flies anything smaller again. A 700 will spoil you with it's size and power, a Logo 600 will spoil you with it's quickness but will not have the feeling of brute force a 700 has.
Either will be a good choice but the 700 will never feel small in the air as your eyes age
Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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01-12-2013 10:06 PM  7 years ago
Jacoub

rrKey Veteran

Kuwait

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For electrics, I have Trex 700E V2, Trex 450 pro, Trex 600esp.

I really liked my 600esp because it needs 6s lipo (one pack), but it was so heavy.

So If I were you, I will buy Trex 550 FBL wow.

And for Nitro or Gas, go big as you can, lol.
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01-12-2013 11:12 PM  7 years ago
Sherman89

rrApprentice

Morriston Fl

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I have both the 600 and 700----the 600 is an older FB (5 years) align 600 CF that has been converted to FBL including the 112 and 12 pinion gear on a 600 MX 1220 motor with a AR7200BX. It has been crashed and smashed so many times (early days of learning) I doubt that there is an original part in it and since I use 6S-5000-5300 paks in the 700 and keep the 600 on 6S but to keep the heat in check I use 550 blades---the 600 blades are on the shelf. I do fly the 600 more simply because I get twice the flights over the 700 but since the 700 is a much smoother flyer it does get its share of flight time. When I am learning new things I use the 600 because it is much cheaper to fix when I mess up which happens from time to time but as time marches on the crashes are much less frequent.
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01-13-2013 02:34 AM  7 years ago
KevinB

rrKey Veteran

Earth

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I am also debating between a logo 600sx or 700. I always thought the 700s had lower disk loading. For longer flights it sounds like the 600 is the better choice? From this I am assuming the 600 autos better too then? Is this backwards to nitro helis? I always felt my fury extreme autoed better than my 50 size helis.

KevinB
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01-13-2013 02:44 AM  7 years ago
BobOD

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New York- USA

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A 700 usually autos better. Lots of inertia and lots of airfoil.Team POP Secret
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