RunRyder RC
 9  Topic Subscribe
WATCH
 2 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2     NEXT    >> ] 2008 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopterEngines Plugs Mufflers Fuel › Engines made specialy for helicopters
08-10-2012 08:55 PM  5 years agoPost 1
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hello,

What's special about engines that are specifically designed for helicoptes opposed to those made for airplanes ?

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:11 PM  5 years agoPost 2
Rafael23cc

rrKey Veteran

Junction City, KS

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I'm not an engine expert, but you can start with a shorter crank on the heli engines. Some heli engines have heli specific carb for better performance on the heli "power band"

Rafael

Keep your feet on the ground, but your eyes on the sky.
Team Heliproz.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:19 PM  5 years agoPost 3
Tag1260

rrApprentice

Ohio USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Your port timing may be a little different to change the power band.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:20 PM  5 years agoPost 4
jlb

rrApprentice

Mid Michigan

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Heli engines have a larger head for better cooling. Shaped to fit inside of a typical cooling shroud on most helis while providing maximum cooling efficiency.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:23 PM  5 years agoPost 5
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I'm looking for a fuel efficient 4 stroke gasoline engine to use on a helicopter.
Any suggestions ?

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:36 PM  5 years agoPost 6
knightofcarnage

rrElite Veteran

chicago

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Zenoah G20E is your best bet. Most heil use this engine. For example

http://www.rcheliresource.com/produ...-expert-engine/

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-10-2012 11:57 PM  5 years agoPost 7
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Zenoah doesn't make 4 strokers...

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 01:54 AM  5 years agoPost 8
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

4 stroke gasoline engine
Gasoline, 4 stroke, as in Briggs and Stratton? Or do you mean nitro 4-stroke?

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 02:04 AM  5 years agoPost 9
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Gasoline is gasoline...The liquid unleaded stuff that your car drinks

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 02:19 AM  5 years agoPost 10
HotsHabit

rrVeteran

Idaho

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

There are 2 stroke gasoline motors and 4 stroke gasoline motors. I highly doubt you want to bolt a 4 stroke gasoline motor to a RC Heli.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 03:58 AM  5 years agoPost 11
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I just wanted to make sure you were really talking about a 4-stroke gasoline engine. There are people who use "gas" rather freely.

Hots pretty much went where I was about to go... ...you really don't want to bolt a 4-stroke gasoline engine to a heli unless you intend to use it as a boat anchor.

I'm not even sure I've ever seen or heard of someone putting a 4-stroke gasoline engine in an RC heli.

4-stroke nitro engines have been tried, mostly unsuccessfully. Some have done so with reasonable results, but even heli manufacturers who tried the idea gave up quickly.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 04:14 AM  5 years agoPost 12
Gearhead

rrMaster

Vt

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

""What's special about engines that are specifically designed for helicoptes opposed to those made for airplanes""

Glow 2st) about 5000 RPMs

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 05:10 AM  5 years agoPost 13
knightofcarnage

rrElite Veteran

chicago

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Zenoah doesn't make 4 strokers..
I personally never seen anyone use a 4 stroke in a heli even Yamaha RMAX drone is a 2 stroke.
""What's special about engines that are specifically designed for helicoptes opposed to those made for airplanes""
Power to weight ratio.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 11:10 AM  5 years agoPost 14
unclejane

rrElite Veteran

santa fe, NM, USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

It wasn't too long ago (15 to 20 years) that heli engines were mostly just conversions of airplane engines. The .60's of the times were the same internally except for the crankshaft and that was about it.

The trend lately on airplane motors, tho, is towards lower rpm operation and more torque (to swing larger props) and heli motors remain screamers like their airplane descendents of yore. So they're diverging now.

The basic differences:
- different carbys. They suck less than the airplane versions which still suck really bad, and on the OS motors, they approach actually being marginally usable. The HZ-R regulated carbs on the OS heli motors for example actually sort of work most of the time.
- ported for higher rpm operation to achieve higher power output.
- heat sink heads.

Otherwise, they're not too incredibly different, i.e. vastly different bore/stroke ratios etc.

The mufflers/pipes, OTOH, have changed significantly and are very different from the typical airplane mufflers. We're in hog heaven for heli mufflers nowadays, which are specifically designed for heli use.

That's where the main changes have been (the exhaust is at least 50% of the overall engine with 2-strokes)....

LS

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 11:17 AM  5 years agoPost 15
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

The (only) reason I'm looking into 4 stroke gasoline for helicopters is fuel efficiency.

I'm looking to get the highest possible endurance out of my machine.
Not too many 4 stroke gasoline options though.

I've looked into these as possible candidates:

1. Saito
2. Rotomotor
3. Modified Hondas

These manufacturers build 4 stroke gasoline powerplants - but there're all designed for airplanes!

I was asking if it's possible to use an airplane engine on a heli without any modifications...

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 01:34 PM  5 years agoPost 16
unclejane

rrElite Veteran

santa fe, NM, USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

You're going to have to roll your own somewhere, but it'll mostly be the installation - mounting, cooling and drive train. The engine itself, assuming you can find one, may be able to do it, but you'll be doing some major customization/tinkering with getting it installed in the heli.

For what it's worth, this is typically why auto engine conversions fail in full-scale aircraft (besides insurance) - it's usually not the engine itself, but something impractical about the installation. Costs too much to make it worth it or there's some technical problem with making it crank a prop at 80-100% throttle for 2000+ hours.

You're going to run into a similar situation here. You won't really be able to convert an airplane engine without doing some kind of modifications to the engine, heli or both.

In the end maximum endurance is probably going to be with one of the regular 2-stroke gassers, like the Zenoa, etc. and a heli already designed to take those engines. Those things will fly forever on a small tank of gas....

LS

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 02:07 PM  5 years agoPost 17
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Search using...
AF-GSR-4

~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 06:34 PM  5 years agoPost 18
TruckRacer

rrNovice

Des Moines, Iowa

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

X-cell tried the YS 4 stroke for several years with marginal results. We had two of them that regularly flew at our field. They had a very good power to weight ratio with overall performance better than the OS or YS 61 engines that were common at the time. They required a larger, lower RPM clutch much like a gasser and of course different gearing. A neat thing about them was their being quiet with a fairly small heli specialized muffler.

The major problem I saw at the time was a lack of governors that are so common today. One engine overspeed and the valve train was in need of a rebuild. I can't see any reason that one of the YS 4 strokes couldn't be used in one of today's more modern machines.

Now I know this wasn't a 4 stroke ... gasser, but it is a 4 stroke just the same and shows that these engines have be used with success. As for 4 stroke gassers, I know of none on the market that will work even reasonably well in a heli .... heck, the Saito doesn't even work well in most airplane applications.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 06:44 PM  5 years agoPost 19
shaiko

rrNovice

Chicago, IL - US

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

unclejane,

You're saying that I'll get the same endurance from a zenoah than I would from a 4 stroker?

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
08-11-2012 07:02 PM  5 years agoPost 20
Machinehead01

rrVeteran

Lower Michigan

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Honda GX30
Would be a suitable 4 stroke engine with plenty of torque, so gear ratio can be upped. Wouldn't try it for 3d though as RPM recovery would be slower and you can add about 1/3 more of the engines weight for the extra mechanics,crank case and oil. Another choice that might be considered is the Stihl 4x2, 4 stroke engine, but fuel is mixed like a 2 stroke. Oil ratio in the fuel is very low, hardy smokes at all, but has a higher rpm limit around 11000 if I remember right.

Tom

"You judge according to the flesh; I am not judging anyone."

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 2 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2     NEXT    >> ] 2008 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopterEngines Plugs Mufflers Fuel › Engines made specialy for helicopters
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 9  Topic Subscribe

Tuesday, June 19 - 6:06 am - Copyright © 2000-2018 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online