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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › ....This is how someone gets killed....
08-12-2012 01:57 AM  5 years agoPost 121
Solmanbandit

rrElite Veteran

Tucson , AZ

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Not trying to split hairs, my point is that if they are off behind me or no where in my flying area, then it shouldn't be an issue. As you said, if they are laying in the middle of the field, then it is an unsafe condition and no flying should be done. It boils down to common sense.

Trex 700E / Trex 500 ESP - Ikon/ HD 500 - Ikon 2/ Goblin 500 Ikon 2

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08-12-2012 02:03 AM  5 years agoPost 122
McKrackin

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Lucasville,Ohio

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It boils down to common sense.
Whose?

Common sense is so rare,it's like a super power

But anyway,that is a good place to leave it.

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08-12-2012 02:23 AM  5 years agoPost 123
ShuRugal

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Killeen, TX

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AMA 700159

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08-12-2012 02:52 AM  5 years agoPost 124
icanfly

rrElite Veteran

ontario

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I have a personal interest in this topic, I would be concerned about a person deliberately putting their self in harms way like stepping in too close to the action.

Like golf balls which I played with at a public park, no one in sight, one ball went into a backyard beside the park. I was worried about a window of a car or house being broken.

Funny, as I waited for a duud and his boy to move on at one park, he picked up one of my balls. Stray balls could have gone toward a highway or a school but that's it. Still some risk.

I plan to fly in a public park not when anyone is around but observe anyone coming within harms distance and bring my heli in or up high to wait till they go away. If they don't I'll have to reel in and move to a different part of the field or go elsewhere. There are no other options. I assume a risk and so does the stranger. We share the public space, my heli (450 trex) is not a lethal projectile but can do some harm, so can an automobile. You know not to play on the highway so don't get in the way like an idiot with a death wish and no one will run you over. some people do what they can to avoid you, some just run you over justifying the act in the name of extinguishing another imbecile from the world.

The pendulum of reason swings both ways however. The incidence of injury by rc toy in a public place is extremely low.

Jason Krause, I like it, obstacle course flying, I got a backyard full of them.

Hey it's saturday, there's a bit of time

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08-12-2012 03:14 AM  5 years agoPost 125
McKrackin

rrProfessor

Lucasville,Ohio

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I assume a risk and so does the stranger. We share the public space, my heli (450 trex) is not a lethal projectile but can do some harm, so can an automobile. You know not to play on the highway
Unless there are signs posted about low flying aircraft in the park,the stranger will assume no such thing.

You know not to play in the highway and you also know not to drive your car in the park....Same thing.

A nearly two pound heli at 50 mph is indeed a lethal projectile.

It does come down to common sense but a heli in the park is NOT something people should have to worry about.
You have to ensure they never have to think about it.
YOU assume all responsibility for flying there.

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08-12-2012 03:31 AM  5 years agoPost 126
Noobyflyer

rrVeteran

Clearwater, FL

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YOU assume responsibility in everything you do. Life is full of risks. It's just a matter of mitigating potential negative outcome and subsequent liability.

Speed limits are posted. People speed. Don't drink and drive. Lots of DUI's. Many stupid people with little common sense and most of them drive.

It's only a problem when someone takes time to post a thread like this and people in the hobby stomp on their own nuts.

Thanks for the alarming attention on the subject. The regulators have seen it by now.

Nice job!

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08-12-2012 03:33 AM  5 years agoPost 127
McKrackin

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Lucasville,Ohio

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Speed limits are posted. People speed. Don't drink and drive. Lots of DUI's. Many stupid people with little common sense and most of them drive.
Other people do stupider things so it's all good.
Nice outlook.

There are many stupid people with helis too btw....

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08-12-2012 03:36 AM  5 years agoPost 128
icanfly

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ontario

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two responses after mine well said, especially Noobyflyer's

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08-12-2012 03:39 AM  5 years agoPost 129
Solmanbandit

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Tucson , AZ

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You have to ensure they never have to think about it.
Even in a park, there are always dangers. To assume that you are perfectly safe in a park is a false sense of security. Heck, you may even have to watch out for evil hamsters.

Watch at YouTube

Trex 700E / Trex 500 ESP - Ikon/ HD 500 - Ikon 2/ Goblin 500 Ikon 2

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08-12-2012 03:45 AM  5 years agoPost 130
McKrackin

rrProfessor

Lucasville,Ohio

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Impossible....Why add to the dangers?

A low flying aircraft is NOT what people should have to avoid in a park.

I hope your lawyer helps explain it better someday.

Peace out

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08-12-2012 03:47 AM  5 years agoPost 131
Solmanbandit

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Tucson , AZ

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Cmon, can't you see how silly this post has become? Quit being so serious and see the humor in it. I tried to find rabid chipmunks, but didn't find any good ones.

Trex 700E / Trex 500 ESP - Ikon/ HD 500 - Ikon 2/ Goblin 500 Ikon 2

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08-12-2012 03:50 AM  5 years agoPost 132
Solmanbandit

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Tucson , AZ

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Here is something to think about. How often do you hear of injuries happening from RC's in a park? Since I have started in this hobby, the one in Tampa is the only one that I have heard about. Sorry, but it isn't an epidemic and nor should it ever be. I am also sure that a comment will be that one is too many as well.
A low flying aircraft is NOT what people should have to avoid in a park.
BTW, I am also sure that people in apartments/house should have to worry about low flying aircraft, but that has happened. The last incidents that I can remember was in San Diego when the F-18 crashed into homes or the F-18 into apts in Virginia. So what do we do about them?

Trex 700E / Trex 500 ESP - Ikon/ HD 500 - Ikon 2/ Goblin 500 Ikon 2

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08-12-2012 04:20 AM  5 years agoPost 133
Rotormaster

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Australia

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If we had used the McKrackin doctrine back in the day, model helicopters
wouldn't exist today because they are inherently unsafe.
I know I am late for the party, and no offence to you, but that is really a disturbingly poor argument. Anybody who's actually followed the thread can see this, which leads me to believe that perhaps you haven't?

The contention that you have seemingly failed to interpret requires 1 simple condition: that the machine is not to be operated in a public area. Since it is possible that rc helicopters could have been designed and tested solely over private property, it is logically inconceivable to say that rc helicopters today would not exist upon the requirement of the given condition.

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08-12-2012 04:20 AM  5 years agoPost 134
HeliOCD

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San Diego, CA

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A thread like what?
It's only a problem when someone takes time to post a thread like this
I post this to point out the fact that both the guys in the video are dangerous to them self's and possibly others. Standing so close, more machine then he could safely handle, etc.. The fact that it turned into a fly, no fly in park debate was not what I was pointing out. Although I do agree with McKracken on most things he said. It is not a wise idea to fly in any public place, where an out of control heli could injure someone or worse. And yes a 450 could easily be lethal. Carry on.....

Its all earth!

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08-12-2012 04:28 AM  5 years agoPost 135
Rotormaster

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Australia

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So, I am curious... Are there any people that still think flying in a park is perfectly responsible?

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08-12-2012 04:47 AM  5 years agoPost 136
HeliOCD

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San Diego, CA

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One funny thing I have noticed
Watching many crash videos on Youtube. You will see the pilot run up to his heli and try in vain to heal the injured bird by straightening the blades or propping it up, thinking it may just heal itself. Hey I have done it too, I think we all have.. Ya never want to believe your heli is really that bad, and just maybe it can fly again with a bit of laying on of hands...

Its all earth!

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08-12-2012 04:48 AM  5 years agoPost 137
rexxigpilot

rrProfessor

Florida

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Flying in a public park, provided it is not illegal, is absolutely responsible IF the person flying takes personal responsibility to assure the safety of other people and animals and to protect the property of others. What's your problem with allowing someone to determine what constitutes personal responsibility?

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08-12-2012 05:02 AM  5 years agoPost 138
HeliOCD

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San Diego, CA

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In my opinion it is not a good idea to fly in a park. Even if it looks like nobody is there, a dog or child could come running out of nowhere. I personally don't like having to worry about that. Instead I would rather give flying my heli all the attention it deserves. You may think you can keep a wide eye on the surroundings while flying but you would be kidding yourself. There are many places besides a park to fly. Chances are you wont have any problem if you do choose the park. I just prefer not to chance it. To think of some young girls face getting sliced to shreads from my doing, would be a real bad thing to say the least. Agree?

....Now this is a park Heli....

....Just dont poke out your eye....

Its all earth!

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08-12-2012 05:15 AM  5 years agoPost 139
TMoore

rrMaster

Cookeville, TN

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I know I am late for the party, and no offence to you, but that is really a disturbingly poor argument. Anybody who's actually followed the thread can see this, which leads me to believe that perhaps you haven't?
The contention that you have seemingly failed to interpret requires 1 simple condition: that the machine is not to be operated in a public area. Since it is possible that rc helicopters could have been designed and tested solely over private property, it is logically inconceivable to say that rc helicopters today would not exist upon the requirement of the given condition.
Excuse me Mate but you are woefully late in this thread and that one quote has been taken way out of context. Quote the rest of it and then comment. McKrackin and a lot of other folks are assuming that the video was shot in a park. Was it? I can't tell, can you? I don't speak the native language of the folks in the video but maybe you do so please englighten us as to what is acutally going on if you can.

Somehow the thread has suffered some drift but when I posted my comment it was still pretty much like HeliOCD had posted, a video that looked on the surface like it was unsafe and that inadequate prep work had not been performed prior to the new pilots actually having a go at the sticks. I'll say it again, the venue not withstanding, the situations are very familiar.

McKrackin by his own admission is a bit of a safety hound and I understand that but he also doesn't understand the AMA regs. AMA has been clear for a long time, if you have permission of the landowner AMA covers you, AMA covers us if we fly in an area like a park as long as it's not prohibited. Case in point is Buder Park in St. Louis and MTRCS in Nashville, both sites are in public parks and both sites are available to fly at as long as you have a permit issued by the County in the case of MTRCS and by the GSLMA in the case of Buder Park. The keys here are permission of the landowner and flying not being prohibited. AMA is required at both fields. MTRCS is a Chartered AMA club, Buder Park is, subject to correction, a shared site with several clubs being in attendance. When I used to fly at Buder, despite the proliferation of signage to the effect that there were flying operations in progress, folks would still walk their dogs right under flight operations from time to time completely oblivious to the danger so it was up to us to be safe and watch out for folks that were "totally oblivious".

To answer your question:
So, I am curious... Are there any people that still think flying in a park is perfectly responsible?
It may not be responsible but it is totally legal here in the US. Flight operations are permitted in public parks if the local governing bodies give the local club or AMA members regardless of club affiliation, permission.

Delayed Response Operator Not Engaged
AMA SECTION 336 = Good
Drones = EVIL

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08-12-2012 05:19 AM  5 years agoPost 140
Rotormaster

rrVeteran

Australia

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Flying in a public park, provided it is not illegal, is absolutely responsible IF
the person flying takes personal responsibility to assure the safety of other
people and animals and to protect the property of others.
But is it not almost impossible to do all this when people can walk up from behind you?

I have flown in parks and I regret doing so. I was in the beginner stage, just hovering around, and this particular park had a corner where I could stand... The only way anybody could approach me was front on. In saying that, I did still fly when there people about 50m away in front of me. My incompetence was not nearly as profound as that of the people in the OP's video, and I was in very good control. However, considering the possibility of mechanical failure, it was a silly thing to do when I look back on it.
What's your problem with allowing someone to determine what constitutes personal responsibility?
Perhaps the fact that there are other parties involved? If you were going skydiving or even un-harnessed rock climbing, I would have no problem with you determining what is, or is not safe or responsible for you. However, when you are using a park as flying space, you are not the only one who is in danger, are you?
[/quote]

Do you not think it is of any concern to others when you are putting others in danger?

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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › ....This is how someone gets killed....
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