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HomeAircraftHelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsFutaba CGY › What are typical ele,ale gains?
06-07-2012 06:15 PM  6 years agoPost 1
BrianApp

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Grand Rapids, MI

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I am in the process of tuning a 750 and was wondering what most people are using for the cyclic gains. I had to turn mine down quite a bit from the 100 default to around 40. Before I start moving the sensor around and trying different tape I would like to know what most people use. Maybe 40 is fine. It is just such a large change from the default it has me wondering if I need to look into other problems.

Fury 55, 50 nitro, 1900, 2100 HS. Using the defaults for 600 nitro.

From what I have seen a lot of people are using 80-90. For me there is quite a wobble at that setting.

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06-07-2012 06:33 PM  6 years agoPost 2
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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On 600/700 class models, the system is not going to fly particularly well with gains less than about 75%. With gain at 40%, it isn't going to fly worth a darn.

At what gain percentage and headspeed does yoour wobble appear? What are the swash AFR's and how much collective and cyclic pitch do they yield?

Ben Minor

Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA

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06-07-2012 07:02 PM  6 years agoPost 3
BrianApp

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Grand Rapids, MI

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At about 1900 the wobble is almost gone with a gain of %40.

On the swash I have %60 with 8 degrees for both elevator and aileron. For the pitch I currently have +-10 with %25. I have seen several post talking about lowering the I and D gains to get the main gain at a reasonable percentage. Should I be messing with those first or start working on the sensor location/tape.

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06-07-2012 08:56 PM  6 years agoPost 4
Knud Pedersen

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Denmark - Europe

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Hi
I have one i my Fury 55 using 8717 @6.6V and 7.4V . Using Mavrikk G5 WC 600mm

I havent tuned much on it.

- Flight mode 5.
- AFR´s are:
AIl AFR 65% (gives aound 8-9°)
ELE AFR 65% (gives aound 8-9°)
PIT AFR 62% (gives aound 12-14°)
- Have reduced AIL D gain to 50%
- Have reduced AIL and ELE I gain to 35%
- Using Head Response Ail=3 and Ele= 4, heli uses 400-500 mah per flight and i have not noticed any lag.
I will play some more with the Head Response,cause i think i read that Dr.Den told that the ele response often is higher ail response, or was the other way around ??? )

I have a slight ELE bounce issue by fast ele stops (stick to center), but that will incresing of the Ele Stop Delay fix (i wil try raise it from 120% to 160-180%)

In fligh mode 5 the stock AVCS.Damp 100% on AIL/ELE, i might try to raise it, just to see what happend and because i have read Nick Maxwell uses 108% on his CGY.

My gain are: Rud=58% Ail = 65% Ele = 73%
I use the same gain in all flightmode. I think i will change the so i can have different gain in each flightmode (1650-1900- 2150 rpm)

Also i havnet yet try to run higher gains, after i turned down the D gain and i gain.(will also try to decrase the Ail D gain
And mybe i can increase the ele gain, if i increase the ELE Stop delay....

It flies great But everything can get better

PM send to you BrianApp

ChopperKnud
Team Miniature Aircraft
ThePitchbrothers

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06-08-2012 10:11 AM  6 years agoPost 5
BrianApp

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Grand Rapids, MI

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I am seeing many posts referring to reducing the D and I gain for this wobble using 1.2. Some start with the D at 40 and I at 60 some the other way around.

If lowering the D and I is the way to go what are good values to start with and what symptoms indicate increasing (or decreasing) the I gain and D gain?

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06-08-2012 01:16 PM  6 years agoPost 6
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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It isn't critical on D gain exactly where you start. Start at 100 and lower it 10% at a time until the wobble stops. You may end up between 0 and 50%. I gain on ELE is best at 40 % or less. AIL is less critical and is often fine as high as 60%.

As long as you haven't bottomed it out at 0%, if the lower D gain stops the wobble, you can then go back and jockey its value to find the highest TOTAL gain you can run with picking the wobble back up.

Ben Minor

Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA

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06-08-2012 02:21 PM  6 years agoPost 7
gwright

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Champaign Il

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Ben, did you notice the pitch afr at 25%?
Sounds like you have a LOT of mechanical gain, necessitating the low electronic gain. Just judging by the numbers I'd think the first place to start is shorter arms to reduce the mechanical movement and increase resolution, thus getting the pitch AFR up a bit, if not into the 50~60 "happy range". This will allow much higher P gains. Of course the measured cyclic pitch will decrease, but the the higher gains will probably give you back most, if not all the actual cyclic response while flying.

I use multiple rpms and in the lowest rpm on my CGY machine (1600) I'm near 100 on the gains. In my highest mode on that machine at 2000 I can max them out at 150, but get an occassional momentary wobble there, so have them in the 130's. Collective 14+/14+ and cyclic 9/9 (I fly mostly in the lower revs, hence the large pitch ranges).

Gary Wright

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06-08-2012 03:21 PM  6 years agoPost 8
Knud Pedersen

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Denmark - Europe

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On the swash I have %60 with 8 degrees for both elevator and aileron. For the pitch I currently have +-10 with %25
Ben, did you notice the pitch afr at 25%?
Sounds like you have a LOT of mechanical gain, necessitating the low electronic gain.
I use the JR HD Servo (JRPA215) and the servo arms are 20mm from center of the servoarm to the center of ball.

I have just checked the CGY AFR´s:
AIl AFR 65% (gives aound 8-9°)
ELE AFR 65% (gives aound 8-9°)
PIT AFR 62% (gives aound 12-14°)

PS: have you changed the TX AFR´s?

ChopperKnud
Team Miniature Aircraft
ThePitchbrothers

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06-08-2012 03:34 PM  6 years agoPost 9
gwright

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Champaign Il

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No sir TX AFR AND ATV all at 100.

Your first post indicated 25%. Maybe I just misunderstood that to be swash afr in 750

Gary Wright

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06-08-2012 03:47 PM  6 years agoPost 10
Knud Pedersen

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Denmark - Europe

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Dont you mean in brainapp's first post?

ChopperKnud
Team Miniature Aircraft
ThePitchbrothers

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06-08-2012 04:06 PM  6 years agoPost 11
gwright

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Champaign Il

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sorry,.. dementia/senility must be setting in.

Gary Wright

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