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HomeAircraftHelicopterRadio - Futaba FASST › 8FG range check almost a disaster
06-06-2012 03:31 PM  6 years agoPost 21
AltecLansing

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North Carolina

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There is no zero throttle on this ship other than throttle hold and the ESC did not arm when in throttle hold during the range check.
Given what I'm reading here. I would think the quote below would be a possible suspect.

From panzflyer
The op states that he had a 30 across the board, so when it failsafes it sees Zero if thats how you set failsafe in the radio, Arms, comes out of failsafe and sees 30 so goes to spool up.
All Zeros in Normal or at least 0 30 30 30 would prevent that if the throttle is at low or keeping it in Hold.
This is interesting as why would 3 other escs not respond in the same fashion, unless they require to be at 0 throttle longer than the castle esc does in order to arm.

Man, I miss the eighties.

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06-06-2012 03:53 PM  6 years agoPost 22
stevehof

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Oceanside, CA, USA

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The op states that he had a 30 across the board, so when it failsafes it sees Zero if thats how you set failsafe in the radio, Arms, comes out of failsafe and sees 30 so goes to spool up.
All Zeros in Normal or at least 0 30 30 30 would prevent that if the throttle is at low or keeping it in Hold.
I think this is what is actually happening. His failsafe was set to absolute zero on throttle. So, the receiver goes in and out of failsafe for a while. Depending on the exact distance and other factors, maybe this in and out of failsafe cycle goes on for several seconds or more.

Again, things being what they are during a 'range check' we should have been in throttle hold or whatever condition was all zeros. If we had considered the possibility of the receiver cycling in and out of fail safe, we certainly would have proceeded differently. Live and learn. that's why I posted

The continued reference to the need to have all zeros in normal doesn't necessarily apply to some 8FG/Castle ESC set ups. I do have auto bail out set on my Castle ESC and I have Idle3 set to all zeros to arm my ESC. If I could rename my conditions in the 8FG this would not be so confusing to those who do not understand the Castle set rpm gov set up.

Synergy E7, Vbar 5 Pro, BLS255 & 256HV Hacker Turnado 530KV LE, Rail 696, CC120HV, WR Sup BEC | 18mz

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06-06-2012 07:09 PM  6 years agoPost 23
panzlflyer

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Goldsboro,NC,USA

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Some more testing is required it seems, alas i cant help because I found the Hobbywing to be the ticket for my Vbar setup.

T700,450Pro,Spirit Pro,Beast+, Qav 500,Futaba18SZ

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06-06-2012 08:35 PM  6 years agoPost 24
rtdillon

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Huntsville, AL

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Another voice! LOL
I use "normal" mode as my first governor setting. 30% flat line.
I do NOT trust the CC ESC (or any) to stay safe and unarmed. After turning on the TX I always go into throttle hold before powering the receiver.

Bottom line is that you are sending the 30% signal to the ESC during the range check and depending upon the ESC to not arm. When the ragged edge of signal loss is experienced there may well be random 000 signals decoded by the RX. That would arm the ESC and then the first bit of 30% throttle seen would cause the results witnessed.

As also indicated going into throttle hold did away with the problem. I would never have discovered this issue as I ALWAYS set to throttle hold until I am ready to spool up and fly.

In My Humble Opinion this is a procedural issue and something everyone has to be aware of. Thank you for starting this thread.

No,No..The other left!

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06-07-2012 03:26 AM  6 years agoPost 25
Gary Jenkins

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Nowhere, US

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Would you guys do a range check on a gas or nitro helicopter with the engine running? A powered up ESC and electric motor is like an idling piston engine. Desired and undesired signal changes from the receiver throttle output will result in engine and motor RPM changes.
There is nothing wrong with the ESC, just the operator.

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06-07-2012 04:09 AM  6 years agoPost 26
stevehof

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Oceanside, CA, USA

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Would you guys do a range check on a gas or nitro helicopter with the engine running? A powered up ESC and electric motor is like an idling piston engine. Desired and undesired signal changes from the receiver throttle output will result in engine and motor RPM changes.
There is nothing wrong with the ESC, just the operator.
Easy for you to say, after the fact. The point is that at least two folks at our field were fine with doing a range check with a powered but unarmed ESC. Maybe having zero throttle set at the time of range check is not even always safe. Maybe we should we be disabling the motor during range check? Maybe some receivers/ESCs under the right circumstance can garble the signal enough to start the motor no matter what 'safe' mode the transmitter is set to. How far should we go? I wonder how many people actually even bother to range check a new or recently crashed and repaired model these days...

Synergy E7, Vbar 5 Pro, BLS255 & 256HV Hacker Turnado 530KV LE, Rail 696, CC120HV, WR Sup BEC | 18mz

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06-13-2012 02:42 PM  6 years agoPost 27
Lewd Skywalker

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Manila, Philippines

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Hi! I was reading through as this was an interesting post. I'm using a 14mz on my T600e Pro with Cc icehv80 and 6203sb. Using Cc in gov mode.

I was just wondering why your throttle curve is straight 30% when you can set it at 0-30-30-30-30 so that you can start with regular spool up. Mine is set at 0% at lowest stick position and 30% straight from 12.5% stick position. The straight 30% and use of the throttle hold seems to be dangerous practice. Also you must make sure you do the throttle calibration when using the CC gov mode.

Btw, i tested failsafe mode on the 14mz using above setup and I did not experience the mentioned spoolup. Maybe someone can try their 8FG using 0-30-30-30-30 and check failsafe.

Also doing range check with the motor connected (or engine running) or blades installed is dangerous too.

SDX FBL | Eagle3 SWM | Trex 600EFL Pro

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06-13-2012 03:33 PM  6 years agoPost 28
Eury

rrProfessor

Dover NH

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He does it with 30 straight across so he has an additional flight mode available. Now there are 3 full modes and speeds that are open for all flying. The way you do it (me too) you can't flip it upside down with the first head speed.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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06-13-2012 03:42 PM  6 years agoPost 29
Lewd Skywalker

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Manila, Philippines

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Ok thanks Nick now it's clearer.

SDX FBL | Eagle3 SWM | Trex 600EFL Pro

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06-13-2012 03:48 PM  6 years agoPost 30
Eury

rrProfessor

Dover NH

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It's actually a pretty good idea, especially on an ESC that spools up as nicely as the Castles. I can never bring myself to do it, I like knowing that I have to do 2 things to make my heli spool up. I wouldn't feel comfortable walking out to the runway with a heli that was just one flip of the switch away from spooling up. I'd always be afraid that I'd bump it.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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06-13-2012 04:02 PM  6 years agoPost 31
Lewd Skywalker

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Manila, Philippines

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Same here Nick. WhenI first programmed my 80hv, I was trying to setup that way reading from some threads here in setting up Cc in gov mode. But due to the way it being non traditional or not in my practice, I never felt comfortable so I went back to 0-30-30-30-30 with 1700rpm since I don't also fly 3d in normal mode. My idle1 and 2 are setup for (straight 70%) 1950 and (100%) 2400 though.

Anyway thanks for sharing Steve, the post made me double check my failsafe settings since some of my birds had throttle passed through the FBL unit's own gov.

SDX FBL | Eagle3 SWM | Trex 600EFL Pro

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06-13-2012 04:11 PM  6 years agoPost 32
stevehof

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Oceanside, CA, USA

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I wouldn't feel comfortable walking out to the runway with a heli that was just one flip of the switch away from spooling up. I'd always be afraid that I'd bump it.
FYI, the way my 8FG is set up it would take two opposite movements of switch G to start the motor after plugging in my batteries.

Switch G is set to arm at front position (Id3, zero flat), hold in the middle and motor ON (norm, id2 &3) in the rear position. I plug in the batteries in hold, which will not arm the ESC due to the fact that it is set slightly above zero to facilitate Castle's auto bail out feature. So, the switch would have to be bumped to the to the front of the transmitter and then bumped all the way to the rear to start the spool up. I walk to the flight line in hold then move SG to the front to arm the ESC and then all the way back to start the spool up.

EDIT: This setup only works when you have Castle's auto rotation bail out set up correctly. And, when practicing autos you must remember to move the switch to your zero throttle curve, in this case, Id3 to reset the slow spool up. If you land and spool down and forget to reset to slow spool up, well, you might be in need of a new main gear...or worse...since it will try to go to full spin within a couple of seconds.

Synergy E7, Vbar 5 Pro, BLS255 & 256HV Hacker Turnado 530KV LE, Rail 696, CC120HV, WR Sup BEC | 18mz

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06-13-2012 04:13 PM  6 years agoPost 33
Eury

rrProfessor

Dover NH

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So, the switch would have to be bumped to the to the front of the transmitter and then bumped all the way to the rear to start the spool up. I walk to the flight line in hold then move SG to the front to arm the ESC and then all the way back to start the spool up.
Never thought of that, sounds like a good idea that I may have to try. Thanks.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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HomeAircraftHelicopterRadio - Futaba FASST › 8FG range check almost a disaster
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