RunRyder RC
WATCH
 1 page 625 views POST REPLY
HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-Electric Battery-Charger-pSupply › Gens Ace 3S dropping HS 1 minute into flight
03-26-2012 08:24 PM  7 years ago
Topic Vote0Post 1
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Gens Ace 3S dropping HS 1 minute into flight
I got 3 Gens Ace packs with a 450 Pro and during one of my first three flights I had a very noticable drop in HS about 1 minute into flight. During the next 3 flights it happened again on one of the flights so I marked that pack. On the third set of flights, same issue, same pack. I resoldered the plug in case there was cold solder and flew 2 more sets of flights and got the same issue on the same pack so its obviously that pack.

What could be the issue here ? The cells show correct voltage and the pack is strong the first minute but it never fails to drop out.

Also can anyone suggest an alternative to this pack? I would like to stay near same price but a bit more is ok. I want a quality pack.
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 04:03 AM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
If you have the capability to check the IR of each individual cell do so. The iChargers and FMA Powerlabs/cell pro 10 can do this. I bet you got a bad cell with high IR in it causing a significant voltage drop under load.

If you can confirm this, send the pack back from where you bought it and tell them the cell is bad and show a picture with the IR, they should replace it without question.
Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 03:13 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Unfortunately I have no way to test and I purchased the packs in a heli package here. The packs were very new with just a few flights on each. The seller does not have the receipt but said he got them from xheli. I know its a long shot but Im going to contact them and see if they can do anything."I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 03:32 PM  7 years ago
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

MyPosts All Forum Topic
If you have a charger that displays voltage per cell (using balancer plug), set to "discharge" at 1 amp and monitor each cell. The bad cell will display rapid voltage loss when compared to the others.

The opposite is also true when charging. The bad cell will rapidly go up to 4.2 (limited by charger) while the other cells are catching up.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 03:44 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
I have a Triton 2 EQ on the way. Looking at the specs it seems that it will display the necessary information..

* Displays input and output volts, peak volts, average discharge volts, charge and discharge capacity, currents and time, data for 10 cycles, errors, and individual lithium cell voltages

I pretty sure this is the issue since its consistent on this pack without fail. Im just wondering what could have happened between the time the seller sent them to me and the first time I used them that would make the cell go bad.
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 03:53 PM  7 years ago
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

MyPosts All Forum Topic
yes...that charger will display such info.

Even a new battery could display such behaviour, so I would not bother the seller.

Provided the other batts dont display same behaviour, I would not worry about why it happened.

I would set questionable batt in storage mode until new charger arrives to verify such.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-27-2012 07:51 PM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Yeah xheli/hobbypartz/nitroplanes are all the same company. Take a picture with the charger when you can of the bad pack and email it to them asking for a new battery replacement. Tell them you got a bad cell and they should replace it.Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-28-2012 06:11 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
I doubt Xheli is going to work with me since I purchased it from the original buyer. I was kind of expecting the seller to offer to contact them and try to get an exchange since they would surely have a record of his purchase but he stated he deleted the email receipt.

I emailed Xheli the other day and have not gotten a response so far. Charger arrives today so I'm going to take a pic of the battery and charger display, provided it displays a clear problem, and send another email.
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-28-2012 08:06 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Got the charger and set up a discharge per instructions, which was cell capacity divided by 5 and cut 9V cutoff for 3S pack. Pack is 2200 3S 55C.

It is dishcharging and cells are 4.13 / 4.12 / 4.11 at the moment but I get the feeling that the draw is not going to be nearly enough to simulate the type of draw it gets from the heli, in which case this will be a waste of time.
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-28-2012 09:27 PM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
The problem is chargers cannot themselves discharge past 50watss, you need a regenerative discharge feature like iChargers or Powerlabs use to crank the discharge up to 20,30 even 40 amps. I haven't used the new Tritons but see if it has this feature, you might have to make a little discharge extension with a light to get the discharge higher.Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-29-2012 01:53 AM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Looks like Max draw is 3 amps.. not quite enough "I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-29-2012 02:13 AM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
e_Widowmaker
Looks like Max draw is 3 amps.. not quite enough
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
Not bad, mine pulls 2.6amps at 24V on the iCharger 306b without the regenerative discharge . Definitely sucks if you gotta discharge the packs and can't fly them to discharge.
Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-29-2012 05:44 PM  7 years ago
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

MyPosts All Forum Topic
It is dishcharging and cells are 4.13 / 4.12 / 4.11 at the moment but I get the feeling that the draw is not going to be nearly enough to simulate the type of draw it gets from the heli, in which case this will be a waste of time
If you did not see a "rapid" change in voltage in any of the cells, test is concluded, given charger available.

As a reference, cells should be within .05V of each other.

Sorry I did not indicate a "short period" for testing.

A charger that monitor individual cells IR, would be a better feature for testing.

Heres a product to consider => HXTBM3S <= type product code into hobby kings web site. LED will change color from green to yellow below 3.3V per cell. Now you can "see" which one if any is dropping out quicker than the rest of the cells while under load.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-31-2012 12:21 AM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
I flew the pack again today and as expected the HS dropped just under 1 minute into flight. I was ready with my meter and as soon as I landed and stopped the rotor I disconnected the battery and tested each cell. The 1st cell was lower by 1.5 and it slowly raised back up closer to the other two.

With the things I have to test thats the best I can do. Xheli / HobbyPartz has not responded and I cant see buying equipment to test and confirm a bad cell when nothing will come of it. Im done buying used when it comes to packs for sure. I also tried to create a ticket on the HobbyPartz site but even though I enter the Captcha Text exactly as its shown, it says its invalid
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-31-2012 12:49 AM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
That really sucks. You definitely got a bad cell and I'm sure the IR of that cell is much higher than the other cells in the pack. Keep nagging Hobbypartz or check out their forum at rcgroups to see if you can get it resolved.Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
03-31-2012 04:02 PM  7 years ago
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

MyPosts All Forum Topic
I cant see buying equipment to test and confirm a bad cell when nothing will come of it
.

Look at it as being cheaper than purchasing a charger capable of reading IR. Even new batts can display same symptons.

Best of luck.
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
04-01-2012 03:29 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Im doing a slow cycle on the pack now with 2 amp draw. The cells started even but within a minute the one cell dropped. When I started typing this post it was 3.73 / 3.73 / 3.50. The difference increases every minute and this under just light load. Looked over and the low cell had started dropping by 1/100th every second... like a countdown so I stopped it.

On the flip side when I charged it, that one cell shot up to 4.20 when the other two were still below 3.9.

I didn't mean to shoot down your suggestion for equipment to test the pack. I will probably change chargers. Any suggestion on one that will monitor IR and is also AC / DC ?
"I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
04-01-2012 09:17 PM  7 years ago
Shortman

rrKey Veteran

Portland, Oregon

MyPosts All Forum Topic
The FMA Powerlabs are nice and the iCharger 306b/3010 are also good. I am using the iCharger 306b, would love to get my hands on the Powerlab 8 though Team JR
Team ThunderPower RC
Boca Bearings
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
04-01-2012 10:03 PM  7 years ago
The_Widowmaker

rrElite Veteran

Bear Valley Springs, CA

MyPosts All Forum Topic
Those look nice but Im set on AC / DC ."I'm a Virgin.. I'm just not very good at it. "
SHARE  PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 1 page 625 views POST REPLY
HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-Electric Battery-Charger-pSupply › Gens Ace 3S dropping HS 1 minute into flight
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 0  Topic Subscribe

Saturday, August 17 - 4:14 pm - Copyright © 2000-2019 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online