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HomeAircraftHelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Question about electric heli build
10-15-2011 11:21 PM  6 years agoPost 1
Bouchah

rrKey Veteran

Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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I consider myself new to the electric side of this hobby although I do own a TRex 250 and my son owns a 450 that I have worked on some. I am currently building a TRex 550 3GX, plan on going stock with everything. I would appreciate any tips for the build, IMO the manual really is lacking.

My question is, other than during the build, how often do you unplug the motor leads for what ever reason? I am installing the motor, running the leads between the frames towards the tail. From what pics of other builds I have seen that seems to be the way to go, then the ESC motor leads are routed through the frames to plug into the motor. This position of the connection point seems to be a PITA if there is going to be a high frequency of disconnecting and reconnecting the motor.

Another question, where does everyone mount the FBL RX? Currently I have the mounting plate in the lower position thinking it would be better protected in the event of a crash. However, I recently read that installing it in tho lower position makes it difficult to see the LED's and reach the gain settings. What do you think about the mounting position selection of the FBL unit?

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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10-15-2011 11:56 PM  6 years agoPost 2
wrongler

rrProfessor

Brewerton, New York

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The motor lead will probably only be unplugged to change motor or change/program ESC.

FBL RX on mine is mounted on bottom, If you need to access it just take it off and do what you have to do and put it back.

Bill Whittaker

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10-16-2011 12:13 AM  6 years agoPost 3
dkshema

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Cedar Rapids, IA

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The motor stays plugged in unless you need to change it out or perhaps want to do some serious radio maintenance and you'd not want to be bothered with having the motor jump to life and ruin your day. Someday if you need to change out motor bearings, you'd also want to unplug it.

Even at that, you have at least three options when setting up your radio.

1. Use a standard 4-cell flight pack to power the electronics while setting up center, throws, and stuff like that. You don't need the ESC even plugged in for this method.

2. Loosen the motor mounting bolts and since most motor mounts have slotted holes, move the motor away from the main gear so that the pinion is no longer engaged. Tighten the bolts down a bit so the motor stays put while you go about your radio setup stuff. Set up your radio as normal, using your LiPo and ESC.

3. Remove the pinion from the motor. Set up your radio as normal, using your LiPo and ESC.

One other thing. You always have a 50-50 chance that the motor will spin the right direction if you randomly plug all three motor wires into the ESC. If you're lucky, you can change motor direction through your ESC programming, or if you simply swap ANY two of the three wires, you'll get the right direction.

-----
I recently read that installing it in tho lower position makes it difficult to see the LED's and reach the gain settings.
And how often do you need to see the LEDs?

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-16-2011 12:22 AM  6 years agoPost 4
MichiganFlyer

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Lansing,MI

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skip (a delete post option would be nice)

Friends don't encourage friends to fly helis! It can cause part shortages.

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10-16-2011 03:56 AM  6 years agoPost 5
Bouchah

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Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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Michigan flyer, not sure what "skip" is all about, please don't try to boost your rr status at the expense of my topic. Only having been a member for five months and a noob at the beginning of that you must be bursting at the seams with valuable knowledge, tips and tricks, so instead of keeping it all to yourself, let's see some good stuff, not "skip". If skip is all you have, then please do, "skip" without comment.

Others that replied, thank you for your help.

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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10-16-2011 04:06 AM  6 years agoPost 6
MichiganFlyer

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Lansing,MI

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Actually I made a post that was incorrect. So instead of leaving it up I erased it and didn't want to put deleted so I put skip. Sorry is deleted a more correct response?

Friends don't encourage friends to fly helis! It can cause part shortages.

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10-16-2011 04:11 AM  6 years agoPost 7
Bouchah

rrKey Veteran

Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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Yes, deleted or leave blank

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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10-16-2011 04:41 AM  6 years agoPost 8
MichiganFlyer

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Lansing,MI

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I do agree though that the motor/esc wires should stay as protected as they can be right along with the battery to the ESC. Watched a heli fall out of the sky due to a cut wire due to chaffing.
I doubt 80% of the guys unplug there motor while making adjustments. Twice at a funfly this summer the guy next to me had his heli spool up on him. He is two years into this. Not sure what he did to make this happen.
I would protect my wires first, or during setup make them accessable and then protect them the best you can.
I don't think ESC's fail for zero throttle, I think people fail.

Friends don't encourage friends to fly helis! It can cause part shortages.

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10-16-2011 04:58 AM  6 years agoPost 9
dkshema

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Cedar Rapids, IA

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Twice at a funfly this summer the guy next to me had his heli spool up on him. He is two years into this. Not sure what he did to make this happen.
He is careless. Plain and simple. Goes along with being a newbie.

We've all been surprised at least once, but twice in the same day? Careless. Not only put himself in danger, but everyone around him.

Electric stuff needs a good deal of respect, as those motors can go from zero to the speed of light in no time at all.

-----

During the build, it is always a good idea to make sure all wires are well away from rotating bits and/or sharp edges. Whenever I build a heli with a carbon frame, my first step is to take some 400 or 600 grit wet or dry sandpaper, and wet-sand ALL edges of the frames. That includes holes, cutouts, the outline edges -- and I make sure all those nice, sharp edges are no more. If I end up running wires through any of the holes, I make sure to tie the cable down so it can't move and make sure there is something under the cable, between it and the frame to prevent chafing.

-----

My throttle hold is set to turn the motor OFF, and I use that as a safety when I'm about to handle a heli that's plugged in and whose ESC has been armed.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-16-2011 05:08 AM  6 years agoPost 10
Wyorcflyer

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Cheyenne, Wyoming USA

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Another question, where does everyone mount the FBL RX? Currently I have the mounting plate in the lower position thinking it would be better protected in the event of a crash.
I mounted the FBL plate and 3GX in the top position and the vibration from the tail drive made the 3GX inconsistent. It didn't go crazy it just didn't work well.

If you have tail issues it may be the 620. My T550E full stock flew very course on the tail. I switched to a BLS251 and it made it much smoother, better resolution and overall much more consistent.

The blades are not "FBL" blades. I tried some FBL blades and it really took the snappy quick personality away. I wanted it to be snappy so for me the stock blades are better than FBL blades.

Jack

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10-16-2011 05:55 AM  6 years agoPost 11
MichiganFlyer

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Lansing,MI

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dkshema I agree. A SAFE heli guy checks his tx and then checks it again after he sets it down to turn his heli on. Once the heli and tx were on the guy must not have remembered what he had(a head chopper).

Friends don't encourage friends to fly helis! It can cause part shortages.

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10-17-2011 12:49 AM  6 years agoPost 12
Bouchah

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Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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I have a couple more questions more specific to the TREX, 550e, I will ask here first to see if I receive any response before making a new topic.

Q#1
On page 14 of the manual it shows a pic of the pinion and main gears alignment in relation as to where the main gear should ride on the pinion. It says "must be within 1mm and keep gear mesh at proper distance." On my build I have a distance of 2.4mm from the end of the pinion to the top surface of the main drive gear. I don't see how to change this without shimming the motor down off of the mounting plate. When attaching the pinion to the motor the manual says "When fixing the screw of pinion gear, please aim at the fixing point on motor shaft." I have the set screw as far down within the "fixing point" as it will go. Does this really make any difference where the gears line up as long as the main gear is not hanging off the end of the pinion?

Q#2
When meshing the pinion to the main gear, on my RC cars I run a piece of paper through the teeth, if it rips or cuts the paper the mesh is too tight, if there are no marks, the mesh is too loose. The manual only says keep the gear mesh at proper distance. Anyone else use my method, is my method OK, any suggestions on how you set your gear mesh?

Thanks

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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10-17-2011 02:11 AM  6 years agoPost 13
Wyorcflyer

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Cheyenne, Wyoming USA

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A#1

A picture might be helpful.

A#2

Yes the mesh is indexed as you state. Be careful though stay on the tight side. If the mesh is loose at all the motor has enough power to strip the main gear. Don't ask me how I know.

Jack

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10-17-2011 02:43 AM  6 years agoPost 14
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Are you using a stock Align pinion, and the stock Align motor?

Is the set-screw of the pinion located somewhere in the flat that's ground on the motor shaft?

Is there something you did wrong when installing the main gear/main shaft that has the gear lower than it should be?

-----

I set my mesh using a piece of paper between the main and pinion gear, making sure that the pinion is tight against the paper as I tighten the motor bolts.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-17-2011 03:06 AM  6 years agoPost 15
Two Left Thumbs

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Houston, Texas - USA

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About Q#1 ...

The manual is a little vague on this point. The primary concern is the gear rides completely on the flat portion of the pinion gear, well away from the lower ramped portion, but not too high either, while utilizing the flat on the motor shaft.

The motor wires are very short. I could not find a great solution either. I have them routed out of the frame cutout which surrounds the main gear. This allows for easier unplugging of the motor wires.

A couple of thoughts. Set the pinion as the last step, after you set up the radio and 3GX. Keep it away from the main gear. Also change your throttle curves to 0 0 0 0 0, and make sure Hold is enabled. Then check it in the monitor, to make sure throttle never goes above 0 in any mode.

After you set the pinion, set up the proper throttle curves in your transmitter.

Take your time on the 3GX setup, don't fly until you are certain of all the setup steps.

Have fun with the 550

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10-17-2011 03:09 AM  6 years agoPost 16
Dr.Ben

rrMaster

Richmond, VA, USA

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Optimum gear mesh has just a bit of backlash when the gears are warm from running. There is nothing wrong with meshing on a piece of paper, but you still need to check the lash immediately after a flight. A small amount of silicone grease on the maingear lowers the average pinion running temp by 15+ degrees. Remember that in an electric model you don't have exhaust residue coating everything for active lubrication.

Ben Minor

Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA

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10-17-2011 03:12 AM  6 years agoPost 17
Bouchah

rrKey Veteran

Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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I may be able to post a pic tomorrow.

Yes, stock motor and pinion. I don't think anything is different from what the manual says to do as far as the build goes.
Yes the set screw is in the flat of the motor shaft.

Even with using the paper to set the mesh, is there a small amount of backlash or are the teeth always
touching each other?

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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10-17-2011 05:03 AM  6 years agoPost 18
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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I took a look at the 550e I've been flying for over a year. The pinion is down as far as it will go, the set screw is in the flat on the shaft, and I've got about 2.5 mm of the pinion protruding above the top of the gear. I'm on the flat part of the pinion, the gears mesh well and I've had no unusual wear or problems flying my 550e.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-19-2011 12:32 AM  6 years agoPost 19
neilg.

rrVeteran

north of borston

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may i add something to this discussion. i assembled the frame and all servos and then split frame to run protected servo wires and install tie wires. then all i have to do is put frame back together and make sure it is squared up.

In Nomeni Patri Et Fili Spiritus Sancti

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10-20-2011 03:15 PM  6 years agoPost 20
Bouchah

rrKey Veteran

Willow Spring, N. Carolina USA

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Dkshema
1. Use a standard 4-cell flight pack to power the electronics while setting up center, throws, and stuff like that. You don't need the ESC even plugged in for this method.
I am using the 3GX, the RX, ESC and FBL unit are all in one, is there any way of still using a 4 cell pack without putting power to the motor?

Blade 130x (5)
Trex 550 V2 (18)
Shuttle ZXX
Freya Xspec (20)

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