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HomeAircraftHelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › Leaking Hatori SB-12-R-2 - newly fitted
10-29-2011 09:16 PM  6 years agoPost 41
tracknoob

rrApprentice

Miami Florida

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Excellent input, guys! And I will be sure to post to the thread as to whether the Loctite 246 works any better than it's normal cousin, the regular blue. As already advised, the Loctite I used did indeed seem to liquify once things got hot, because it sure did not hold those bolts in place!

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10-29-2011 10:00 PM  6 years agoPost 42
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Remember
How do you disassemble loctited parts?

You heat them...

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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10-29-2011 10:08 PM  6 years agoPost 43
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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Yep
And thats the Red stuff as well.

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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10-29-2011 11:40 PM  6 years agoPost 44
ddavison

rrVeteran

Brownsville, Pennsylvania

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I don't think "Blue" locktight will hold up. I have only had luck with "red". My cure is the same as Raja's. Stock gasket between motor and adapter. Homemade gasket between adapter and pipe with red rtv both surfaces. Ran it for 5/10 minutes retightened bolts. I also double nut the bolts from the pipe to adapter. I use red loctite on all bolts. My engine is mounted with the head forward so my Hatori is the one with the inlet offset more. This leaves a lot of weight on the rear of the pipe so I made a bracket and S/S clamp on the rear for a little support.

DaveDavison,GasGob,WhiplashGas,Spectra,JRXG11MV,12X

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10-29-2011 11:53 PM  6 years agoPost 45
tracknoob

rrApprentice

Miami Florida

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Remember, we are not talking about standard blue Loctite 243, but Loctite 246 on my next attempt:
Loctite 246 High Temperature, Medium Strength Blue Threadlocker

Loctite® 246™ High Temperature, Medium Strength Blue Threadlocker resists oil and mild surface contamination at continuous temperatures to 450°F. Suitable for fasteners between 1/4" and 3/4" (6 to 20 mm) diameters.
http://henkelna.com/faceted-search-...tUID=0000000JAO

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10-30-2011 09:23 PM  6 years agoPost 46
Malc1

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EVESHAM,UK

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Managed to rush home from work and get down the field before it got dark.

Only a tank through (about 18mins)and then the heli was getting a bit hard to see.

Couldn't see any leaking on the muffler and just a slight discolouration of the gasket seen - heated related by the looks of it.

Probably needs some more time now to see if its going to stay sealed.

Engine was sounding very nice and smooth this time out and the governer was off for now while I redo the curves.

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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10-31-2011 11:48 PM  6 years agoPost 47
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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I got 2 more flights today on mine
After the first 1/2 tank, I landed to check the outer bolts. Gave them moderate torque with a screwdriver type allen wrench, and they didn't budge. At the end of the day I checked them once more, still good!

Flew 2 tanks out or about 40 minutes runtime on the motor and no leaks. Happy so far

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-01-2011 12:58 AM  6 years agoPost 48
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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Good news then

Going to try to get some more flights in at the weekend to see what mine does.

Sort this out and I get on with sorting out the governer and then do the CGY750 convert

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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11-03-2011 01:10 AM  6 years agoPost 49
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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What a lovely day indeed!
I spent the afternoon flying my FPV plank (two batteries 20 minutes each) and the Spectra with the Hatori muffler for 5 flights or close to 100 minutes.

It was clear and calm, temps around 50 and winds 0 to 3mph max. With the fpv plane I flew it around the field, charles river, and the surrounding wetlands. You could see new flooding in the wetlands due to the storm we had on Saturday. I was able to shoot several landings with it FPV style, and that's pretty cool stuff you guys ought to try it.

On the heli I worked on pattern lines and precise maneuvering with transitions and there is something to be said about smooth 3D - when you got it and it flows it looks awesome. I sit on the back of the tailgate when I fly and listen to the music, when the sun started to go down and I ended up in the shade I had to move the truck to the other side to get some more sun as I didn't have any jackets and I could feel a little chill in the shade but perfect in the sun.

I would have probably put 1 more flight in, but I practically flew the TX battery down all the way, it was beeping 9.0v alarm during my 5th flight on the Spectra. I'll solar charge it tomorrow AM and head out once again the the afternoon.

And with all that flying, the Hatori muffler stayed on tight and no leaks whatsoever around the header between either gasket. I think I pretty much got it sealed nice now, and the gasket material I bought seems to be working quite well.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-03-2011 04:45 PM  6 years agoPost 50
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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four flights later and oil is absolutely p*****g out from between both joint faces.

Pulled the muffler off and inner bolts are a bit loose and outers just slightly and it looks like the gasket has acted a bit like a wick and drawn the oil through.

So basically I would say that's it come loose

Had a nice few flights through while the rain held off.

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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11-03-2011 05:01 PM  6 years agoPost 51
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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How about you do this
Install the plate to the motor with a stock gasket and some red rtv on both sides. Snug up, wait an hour and tighten.

Install the muffler on to the plate with or without gasket and go fly for 3 to 4 minutes, take off the muffler while hot (if you're good you can pick it up with the allen driver and a screwdriver in the tail pipe - no need to loosen the side washered screws). and retighten the inner bolts. Put the muffler back on and do another flight 3 to 4 minutes and repeat (take off muffler and retighten inner ones). Do this until inner ones do not move any more and fly longer and longer between retightening.

Once done that part should be set then make a gasket for the outer plate to muffler and do the same with rtv. Fly short intervals and retighten while hot until they move no more.

You should be all set and done after that.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-03-2011 05:40 PM  6 years agoPost 52
Carey Shurley

rrElite Veteran

Orlando, FL - USA

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the only gaskets I've ever used on this muffler are between the header and the cylinder and I just use the stock zenoah gasket. Its pretty durable once you get it all tightened down

I've never put a gasket of any sort between the muffler/header. Unless its metal or has a metal core like the zenoah gasket I can't imagine that holding. I just use red or black hi temp rtv.

I suppose if you're intent on making some sort of gasket I'd suggest cutting one out of copper

Proprietor - Gas Powered Helicopters

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11-03-2011 05:43 PM  6 years agoPost 53
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Carey
I'm using grey gasket material I picked up from a hardware store. Its supposed to be high heat but if I remember right it said something like up to 450F which I thought might have been marginal at the header. Seems to be working well though.

If you want to try some, I can either send you a piece (PM me your address) or bring you some to OHB just let me know.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-03-2011 05:51 PM  6 years agoPost 54
Carey Shurley

rrElite Veteran

Orlando, FL - USA

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I've tried that stuff before, in the long run it seems to eventually blow out, although to be fair most glow motor gaskets blow out as well.

the ultimate fix is probably the same as its always been on the glow motor mufflers, which is to find a piece of glass, put some fine emory paper on it and then hone the mating surface of the aluminum muffler header.

Proprietor - Gas Powered Helicopters

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11-03-2011 06:20 PM  6 years agoPost 55
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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We'll see how it goes
Its just about 60F here today and my TX has been solar charging since this morning from yesterday's kill...

I'm taking the Spectra to the field this afternoon along with the 1005 to put more time on them. Too early to tell right now but flight after flight if it lasts then its proving itself. I'll keep my fingers crossed!

P.S. I'm looking at my weather icons on my desktop....

For me, sunny 49 sunny 48 and sunny 55 for Friday through Sunday
For you, rain 73, sprinkles 74 and rain 80 for Friday through Sunday

Oh boy oh Boy OH BOY I hope it improves for December!!

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-03-2011 08:06 PM  6 years agoPost 56
tracknoob

rrApprentice

Miami Florida

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My high-temp loctite blue just came in today, so I cleaned and prepped everything, and am about to reassemble.

I was going to try using the stock gasket with RTV, instead of just RTV alone, but I seem to have momentarily misplaced the gasket, so this version of experiment will be red RTV alone, wait an hour, torque down, wait over night, then remove bolts one at a time, apply Loctite 246 to them, re-tighten, wait *another* 24 hours for the Loctite to achieve max cure, and finally, test fly on Sat morning, stopping after five minutes to check tightness.

Although, if I have to re-tighten then, then that means the Loctite will have failed and I am then go to backup plan, hoping only the extra torque applied while motor is hot is going to hold it. Since the instructions claim it's good to 450 degrees F, even on somewhat greasy or oily bolts, then I have to think this is going to work.

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11-03-2011 10:23 PM  6 years agoPost 57
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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Looks like the Spectra's grounded for this weekend and I'll have to take a couple of T Rexs down the field instead.

Going to get the mating faces honed and either follow Rajas advice or try these surfaces again without using a gasket.

I didn't use any RTV last attempt with a gasket but I have RED and Copper here.

Couple of options.

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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11-04-2011 12:40 AM  6 years agoPost 58
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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3 more flights today
Still holding up fine. Mind you I never faced off any surfaces and I really don't 'clean' my bolts what well besides just wiping them down with a paper towel, i.e. there could be some oil residue on them but with what I've done things seem to be holding up.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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11-05-2011 08:23 AM  6 years agoPost 59
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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Flying today as a day off work.

I have managed to have another go with the muffler last night just to try it out this morning.

Ended up using a 1200 and 1500 grit paper wet on a piece of glass to hone the surfaces and have attached the muffler using copper RTV.

I used a hot air gun to heat up the steel mounting plate so I could tighten it as much a possible.
All bolts and surfaces have been completely degreased.

Just an experiment really,I still have Raja's option which is working out OK for him at the moment.

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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11-05-2011 05:40 PM  6 years agoPost 60
Malc1

rrKey Veteran

EVESHAM,UK

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Just back after about 6 hours down the field.

Worth a try with the muffler but no good.

After about 1 1/4 hours flying I am left with quite a major leak between the engine and the steel plate, a few droplets at the seal between the muffler and the plate and a leak that looks like its coming through the lower bolt hole.

Had some good flying with it and my other heli's though

Minicopter Diabolo - Kosmik200,Pyro750-56
SpectraG + G26 3D Max

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