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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsFutaba CGY › Futaba CGY750 v1.10 Released!
06-02-2011 03:21 AM  9 years ago
tayas

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North East of the USA

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so, lets take a head count.
who is very happy with the cgy750 and will not trade it for a vbar?
this way i will know if i should pick one up this weekend.
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06-02-2011 03:35 AM  9 years ago
knightofcarnage

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chicago

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+3 , I sold my vbars and skookum 720 to get 3 units.
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06-02-2011 03:41 AM  9 years ago
Eury

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Dover NH USA

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Polls like that are pretty useless, the people looking at this thread are more likely to be 750 users, so you'll probably end up getting thumbs up in that direction.Nick Crego

Citizen #0168
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06-02-2011 04:08 AM  9 years ago
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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Yes, PLEASE let's try to stay on a constructive discussion rather than let this thread degenerate into a pissing match over brand preference. In point of fact, constructive discussions will passively (and actively) tell you way more about how a product works than a simple poll.

Ben Minor
Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA
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06-02-2011 04:24 AM  9 years ago
BrainDrain_dx

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Wichita KS

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I would never trade my vbars for a 750.

I have two 750's and while they fly well after the update they still are not on par with the vbar. My biggest complaint is drift and not being locked in. I can take the vbar and fly any maneuver endlessly. Lets take a big loop for example. I can do 10 perfect loops in a row with my vbar by simply pulling back on the elevator. I can not do that with the 750 as they always seem to drift a bit. The first and second loop might be ok but then as I have to correct more and more they just get out of wack every time around. I get through the 10 loops on the 750 but it is so much more work to do it. Vbar has made me lazy I'll admit it. Flying a vbar machine is confidence inspiring. I feel comfortable in any maneuver. The confidence is there that whatever orientation you enter the move is the orientation you will exit the move and the model will only do what the stick commands. That is completely gone on the 750. Loop correction correction correction correction correction loop vs vbar loop loop correction loop loop. Vbar is easy mode and the 750 cant currently duplicate it for me.

I have 5 vbar machines and two 750 machines. All 5 vbar machines loop the same, tic toc the same, piro the same. The two 750's are nothing the same on two identical airframes. Both drift in different directions. Every time I go fly I try to trim the drift out to no avail. One piros well and the other does not(different tail servo) but my vbar have different tail servos and they don't seem to mind.

The only time I need a laptop for vbar is setup and first flight. if your new plan to spend an afternoon tweaking your heli. Then maybe once again after flying it for awhile. Most of mine are set it and forget it. Now that I have my settings down my vbar machines never see the laptop after the first few flight.

I have spent more time adjusting the drift out of the 750. The vbar you click a button, fly for one minute, set it down, turn off autotrim and proceed to beat it senseless. Hopefully someday I will get the 750's to fly the same.

So you can have my vbars when you pry them from my cold dead fingers but Ill let you have a 750 if you punch me hard enough in the stomach. I'm not giving up on the 750's quite yet but I need help and there is limited resources since the product is so new.

Oh and ps, damn you futaba for making me buy your transmitter to try your product. That's not very nice of you

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06-02-2011 04:39 AM  9 years ago
3D-ALEX

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Daytona Beach, FL

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Regarding what BrainDrain_dx said, that was the whole idea of the 750. It was not meant to feel like a computer was controlling your machine, but rather that you, the pilot, are still in control, but with all the mechanical and aero-dynamic advatages of a flybarless system. So yes, the 750 is definitely a unit that requires constant pilot input, and is meant for the pilot that takes pride in controlling his model and enjoys the challenge of making corrections, just as one would with a flybared system.

Just my $0.02

Alex
Alex Morley
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06-02-2011 04:53 AM  9 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Wow! Great post Alex!
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06-02-2011 04:53 AM  9 years ago
BrainDrain_dx

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Wichita KS

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Technology moves us forward. Sounds like a step backwards to me. First we had rate mode gyros, then heading hold gyros, now futaba makes a heading hold gyro that flys like a rate gyro... wait what?!?

vbar makes real life flying just like the sim. The sim has always been true to life with the exception of the randomness of correction needed. Now technology is here that eliminates that randomness in real life. A good step forward and a win for all in the sport. Now it takes less skill to do a perfect loop and more pilots can do them.

Someone please tell me how doing 10 corrections in a loop vs 1 would be more desirable. I fail to get why its better.

When I go fly I want to master a move but I dont want to spend 6 months to do it. Vbar cuts the learning curve. Now I can fly a perfect loop with ease and start working on my rolls, then my piro's, then...
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06-02-2011 05:02 AM  9 years ago
3D-ALEX

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Daytona Beach, FL

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Like I said, for the people who enjoy the feel of a flybar, because that is what they learned on, the 750 is perfect for them. For someone who grew up with the vbar, I understand your point of view as well. In reality, it is personal preference. That is why, after much debate, I have decided not to install the piro comp on my 750 as I belive in properly setting up a model and having the final say of what happens to the model as it is flying. Not trying to start a flame war, but the 750 was meant to feel different for a reason.

Alex
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06-02-2011 05:03 AM  9 years ago
BrainDrain_dx

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Wichita KS

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Furthermore if we assume alex is correct then the poll is really about how do you like to fly your heli? its not a cgy vs vbar question at all.

If you want a flybar feel the cgy wins hands down.
If you want a sim feel the vbar wins hands down.

*edit* written without seeing your post. Everyone is on the same page. No flame war here
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06-02-2011 05:10 AM  9 years ago
Eury

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Dover NH USA

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I think it's got to be something in your setup. My 750 feels every by as locked in and predictable as my Vbars. It doesn't need any extra corrections and doesnt fly anything like a flybar.Nick Crego

Citizen #0168
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06-02-2011 05:10 AM  9 years ago
3D-ALEX

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Daytona Beach, FL

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One final note, a couple of local club members tried turning their gains up to like 120 or something (as Herman had mentioned to me) and they claimed that it had the vbar effect, as in a very "sim" like feel. They changed the gains back to normal though becuase, like me, they learned on flybared machines.

*edit* Sorry Eury didn't see your post. My 750 feels just like a flybar (and yes I have tried vbar and such). It is one of the things I love most about it.

Alex
Alex Morley
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06-02-2011 05:17 AM  9 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Yea I didn't want to say anything since usually saying something to help usually ends up in someone saying or seeing it as an opportunity to somehow say something negative about the futaba cgy750 so I kind of given up on trying to reiterate that's it's awesome in it's own way! But yeah Ive tried all gains and the higher you go the more locked in it feels(no corrections needed)!
I..... Like alex lower my gains to about 50 to get that flybar feeling on my Heli and love it there. BTW I've forgotten to mention that piro comp with gains not high enough will still drift a bit. As soon as you get the gains up higher it holds rock solid in piro pogos.
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06-02-2011 05:18 AM  9 years ago
3D-ALEX

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Daytona Beach, FL

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Interesting. I may have to try it after all. Perhaps this weekend...Alex Morley
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06-02-2011 05:19 AM  9 years ago
BrainDrain_dx

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Wichita KS

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my piro pogos look like two monkeys fighting over a banana (pre update)

My gains are in the 50-60 range. Will try to raise them.
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06-02-2011 05:21 AM  9 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Alex it really is worth tryin on low gains it somewhat doesn't need that many corrections but follows your small inputs just like before. I am gonna put some serious flights on it this weekend to be SURE though about keeping it on indefinitely. It's been windy as hell and I like to tune MY setup when there is less wind....
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06-02-2011 05:26 AM  9 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Brain raise them up till you get the slow wag in skids and then lower five clicks and try it there to see if you like it. I can get up to 105 on mine before I see wag. Mind you it's gonna feel really locked in.... Compared to lower gain setup. I personally can't fly it like that, too dynamic for my blood.

Edit: Even if you start seeing wag and want to keep the high gain, you can now lower I-gain to keep the locked feeling of higher gain without wag. Damn futaba thinking ahead again.
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06-02-2011 05:49 AM  9 years ago
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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The better part of two decades of competing with FB models in the presence of the best pilots to have ever touched a transmitter has taught me a great deal about the black art of FB set up. I know exactly how to program mix out virtually all the quirks that most guys complain about with FB models. I can make a FB model sit in a hover, roll on a string, and loop or flip on axis with precious little needed extra attention from the pilot. My 750 models pretty well fly the exact same way except I've not had to do the mixing and hours of set up time at the field to get them to fly as described. If anyone has a 750 in a model, and it flies like a FB model with none of the mixers I've used for years in play (IOW it pitches up it rolls, loops off heading, or otherwise displays classic uncompensated FB model tendencies), then you've missed a good deal of the boat with some aspect of set up. It should and does fly WAY better than that. This concept would apply to any of the known well flying FBL systems on the market today.

Ben Minor
Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA
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06-02-2011 06:18 AM  9 years ago
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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Ive flown the 750 pre update and it was pretty good. They have the basics down.

BUT, it definitely does not feel like a flybared machine and it definitely doesn't require a pilot to make as many corrections as they had to do with a flybared machine. The 750 has a locked in positive feels but has a nice, direct/crisp response when the pilot gives a maneuver.
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06-02-2011 06:24 AM  9 years ago
gorn

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Western Australia

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Im with Ben on this.
Im doing far less corrections than with flybar ever before.
Mine was very simple to setup, and my gains run between 80 and 90 for head and tail.
I have not had a chance to fly the piro opt yet, hopefully this weekend.
For the love of the hobby
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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsFutaba CGY › Futaba CGY750 v1.10 Released!
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