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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterFuel-Helicopters New or Limited ActivityAvant › Mainshaft Shearing in flight because of mod w/ fix
04-28-2011 02:49 PM  10 years ago
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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Based upon these results, it seem that converting the stock Avant head to FBL using aftermarket pitch arms and an aftermarket swash driver is a bad idea. I will no longer encourage others to do this in lieu of purchasing a RigidCore head as it appears under load the conversion can fail.Avant RC
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04-28-2011 03:33 PM  10 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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I agree. I converted mine just to see if I liked it with FBL so I know if I wanted to buy the rigidcore head and I do.I am running the 500KV on that machine so will probably be fine but still may change back being I really dont believe converting the stock head is a good idea.

Tom
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04-28-2011 03:41 PM  10 years ago
joe_dejesus

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Miami, FL

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I have converted many helis with no issues, I am no designer but the shaft is not connected any differently amongs the flybarless and flybar head. stresses in broken shaft area dont seem different, maybe i am wrong.

come by my shop (not privileged to carry avant line as order qtys are to high for demand here) but I can hook you up and get you into something else.. I fell for you on your loss...

joe
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04-28-2011 03:49 PM  10 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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Look at pics of the converted head and then the rigidcore. Very easy to see the difference. Rigidcore comes down much further on mainshaft and clamps around it at bottom. This will take alot of load of the very top of the shaft. When you run very aggressive cyclic throws which fbl is capable of it puts alot more force trying to twist head back and forth and the longer headblock and clamping design will help tremendously with taking that load off the top of the shaft.

Tom
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04-28-2011 03:54 PM  10 years ago
Clarence Creer

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Fort Worth, Texas

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Very interested in seeing the pictures. Are they blocked? I can't see them.Team Kontronik Team minicopter/PeakAircraft
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04-28-2011 04:14 PM  10 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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They arent blocked. Just checked and they are still there.
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04-28-2011 04:26 PM  10 years ago
Ronald Thomas

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Gainesville, Fl, USA

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Other companies' FBL heads clamp the same way the FB head does so I don't understand why Avant would need to do so unless the main shaft was not good enough. Avant also has a FBL specific main shaft correct? Also if this was an issue, why wouldn't it be put out in a bulletin BEFORE this happened especially when almost every FBL Avant on the market does not have a Rigidcore FBL head because of availability???
It sounds like a problem with that main shaft to me especially when there are many reports of bent main shafts in flight(I had one also on my Aurora).
BTW I ran that exact same power system in my FBL Trex 700 and never had any issues. I am sure Avant's QC is better than Align's.

Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!
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04-28-2011 04:31 PM  10 years ago
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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The RigidCore head goes down until about 1 inch above the swash (at neutral pitch). The OP's main shaft sheared off at the place where the two bolts go through the shaft, so in essence the RigidCore head is holding the shaft for an additional 1 inch more than a stock flybarred head converted to flybarless. Again, based upon the results posted, it seems converting the stock Avant head to FBL is not an acceptable option. Until the RigidCore heads are readily available, it seems that the use of either an RJX head or perhaps the new Miniature Aircraft FBL head is a more safe option.

^^^ RigidCore on the left, MinAir head in the middle, RJX head on the right.

Based upon these pictures, the RJX head does not clamp any lower than the stock Avant head so it might not be safe either, while the MinAir head clamps perhaps slightly lower than the stock Avant flybarred head.
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04-28-2011 04:41 PM  10 years ago
Azlum

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Limington, ME - USA

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Does the MA fbl head fit the Aurora with no modifications?

Just curious.
- Azlum
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04-28-2011 04:43 PM  10 years ago
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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You would have to do some minor modification on the MinAir head in order to get to work on the Avant shaft (e.g. drill out the Jesus bolt holes slightly), but there are not a lot of FBL heads available that will safely swing 710mm blades. Obviously the Mikado plastic 10mm head is not be an option.Avant RC
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04-28-2011 04:53 PM  10 years ago
stang281472

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Commack, NY

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I have ran the scorpion 560 without any problem as well on the stock head flybarred with no problem as well. 8400 watts peak and no problems. Apparently the fbl puts enough load to become a problem. Going to a bigger shaft may be needed. However Justins machine with rigidcore head is running a motor capable of 9600 watts peak and he hasn't had any problems. So who knows. Could be a one off defective shaft as well. Had a bad set of racing forged axles in my 600hp mustang once also. Snapped it on the street. This is why I hope the OP sends shaft in to be checked out. The bent shafts were before they went solid. The hollow ones could bend in flight with fbl.
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04-28-2011 05:15 PM  10 years ago
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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I am still running the hollow main shaft in my e-Aurora with the Scorpion 4525-520 motor and the RigidCore head. I have not had any problems with the helicopter (other than breaking the right frame after a bad auto), but since these heads are so hard to come by at this time, I am not doing anything too violent which will potentially put the helicopter at risk.

My biggest concern all along with using the bigger motor has been to either strip a main gear or strip the one-way, and to be honest I have not had a problem with either. I do find that the main gear needs to be replaced from time to time as the plastic wears away, and I am using the larger Tsubaki one-way bearing, but other than that the heli has been flawless.

It should be noted that the OP is using the lighter 4400mAh ThunderPower batteries. Using these batteries saves 6 oz over the weight of the 5000mAh ThunderPower lipos, and even more weight over Hyperion packs. Less weight equates to less stress on the airframe (and the main shaft).

That being said, Jason Bell is running pretty much the same setup as I am (with the exception of the larger 5000mAh lipos and a CC 120HV instead of the Jive 120), and he flies his helicopter 10 times harder than I do. He has not reported any problems, so maybe with the OP it was just bad luck?
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04-28-2011 05:43 PM  10 years ago
joe_dejesus

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Miami, FL

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I am sure Avant's QC is better than Align's
I do agree 100%!

Joe
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04-28-2011 07:47 PM  10 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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I just sent Avant an email regarding what happened.... Fingers crossed.
Hopefully I can get her back in the air soon im really bummed out about it still.
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04-28-2011 09:39 PM  10 years ago
Jason Bell

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California

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Avant also has a FBL specific main shaft correct?
One main shaft for both the nitro and electric auroras. At least until the official release of the RigidCore head no differentiation. There might be a FBL specific or they might switch them all the that one as the standard.
I have ran the scorpion 560 without any problem as well on the stock head flybarred with no problem as well. 8400 watts peak and no problems.
I have ran the same, but FBL as well at 2150 rpms. I am now running flybarred eAurora for the time with the 4525-520kv and an Ice 80 peaking 8700 watts (11.6HP) @ 198A.
That being said, Jason Bell is running pretty much the same setup as I am (with the exception of the larger 5000mAh lipos and a CC 120HV instead of the Jive 120)
Ice 80HV actually.

I can say this is the first time I have seen this happen-with stock parts(other than the FBL conversion parts). I have seen this once before, but the customer had drilled out the mainshaft to run a M4 screw with a nut on the other side, which lead to the same type of crash.
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04-28-2011 09:41 PM  10 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Maybe it was a just a bad main shaft.....
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04-28-2011 09:54 PM  10 years ago
Tradhunt

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Fairfield, Ca. USA

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I'm thinking bad shaft. Things happen and it might have went through inspection and not been noticed... Hard to say. But it happens to all manufactures.I don't crash... I land with style
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04-29-2011 02:38 AM  10 years ago
FLYERCLD

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Proctor, Arkansas

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Mainshaft
WOW and double WOW! Thank GOD no one got hurt... I also feel your lost but hey the heli can be replace.

Charles
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04-29-2011 04:29 AM  10 years ago
3D-ALEX

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Daytona Beach, FL

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Wow Jason the way you fly I can't believe you get away with using an Ice 80HV. Insanity.Alex Morley
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04-30-2011 06:33 PM  10 years ago
haq0901

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Miami, FL USA

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Well..... It's been TWO days and no response yet. I would atleast expect them to say I'm responsible for the failure, if they don't want to help me. Maybe this type of service is nominal from them. I don't know but I need frames and they are the only suppliers. Weekend is here and really sucks I don't have avant in the air.
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