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HomeOff Topics › Nitro vs. Electric
12-28-2010 04:55 AM  7 years agoPost 1641
Blades345

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FL

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Did you guys here about the cocaine dealer in California? He was cutting the coke he sold with nitro fuel. His customers were complaining because whenever they did a line of coke, the actually felt sluggish and got slower! LOL!

When u don't feel like soaring through the air with a plane, beat it into submission w/ a heli!

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12-28-2010 05:03 AM  7 years agoPost 1642
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Oh, BTW,I forgot to mention this.
I was actually a little surprised to see the YS50 looks to be in pretty good shape there looking at the ring and piston in the picture. I've been beating the crud out of this thing...kind of wanted to blow it for fun. And, just prior to this pic, she had been run, on the ground with neg pitch and WOT for 7.5 straight minutes.
By my calculation, that would be equivalent to a 12S 4600 mah pack.

Team POP Secret

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12-28-2010 05:05 AM  7 years agoPost 1643
BobOD

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Did you hear about Lithium. It's used as a mind altering drug. :P

Calms you down basically.

Oooo..oooo. look at that volts ad right now. See?

Team POP Secret

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12-28-2010 05:08 AM  7 years agoPost 1644
LonR

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Macomb,Mi

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Well let me know if you plan on getting rid of the YS50..

600LE,OS55,OS PowerBoost pipe,Align 610's,Spartan

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12-28-2010 05:14 AM  7 years agoPost 1645
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Will do Lon...but I'm going to hang onto it...in case the mileage ticks me off too bad.

Wouldn't that be a funny outcome? That would mean I'd have to like electric AND nitro. Kind of where I started.

Team POP Secret

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12-28-2010 05:15 AM  7 years agoPost 1646
Blades345

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FL

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Well let me know if you plan on getting rid of the YS50..
Me too Bob,, I could always use a good paperweight! lol

When u don't feel like soaring through the air with a plane, beat it into submission w/ a heli!

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12-28-2010 05:31 AM  7 years agoPost 1647
BobOD

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OK, I got Blades to admit nitros are useful. I'm done now.

Catch you guys later.

Team POP Secret

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12-28-2010 09:28 AM  7 years agoPost 1648
Footey

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Hamilton New Zealand

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Put me down for three of each....

They all have good and bad points but electric is the future for sure, like it or not.

Life is like a bath, the longer you stay in it the more wrinkled you get.

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12-28-2010 03:10 PM  7 years agoPost 1649
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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I want to see the video of that thing flying Bob!!! That looks to be my kinda nitro!!! How ya gonna get that wide .90 to fit in those narrow frames again?

Lets see a gallon of nitro costs 25$ roughly at 7 flights for a gallon at over 3.57$ per 8 minute flight with a .90. That's over 44 cents per minute not including nitro consumed tuning the engine and allowing engine to warm up.

A pair of turnigy 5000's roughly 200$ and can get say 80 good cycles is 25 cents per 4 minute flight or 6.2 cents per minute.

Summary, it sure is expensive to get a nitro heli to the power of an electric!
Wait let me get my flame suit on...ok I'm ready let me have it!

High Voltage just works better

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12-28-2010 03:33 PM  7 years agoPost 1650
BobOD

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at over 3.57$ per 8 minute flight with a .90.
I can spend 4 times that rate just to take my wife out to dinner. I'm just trying to make sure I compete with her.

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12-28-2010 04:03 PM  7 years agoPost 1651
rexxigpilot

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Florida

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Torque vs Horsepower
Yes, these two are misunderstood by most. This is also the reason why electric beats nitro for consistent power/torque delivery.

P = T * N / 5252

Where:
P = Power (HP)
T = Torque (lbft)
N = Speed (rpm)

The constant 5252 is a conversion factor which comes from (33,000 ft·lbf/min)/(2π rad./rev.).

Simply put, power is a function of torque and rotational speed or angular velocity. If you increase the torque at any given RPM the power goes up. Also, if you increase the rotational speed at the same torque, power increases.

However, there is a big difference in what happens with an electric motor compared to 2-stroke internal combustion engine as you increase or decrease the RPM from the peak power point. For instance, say we have a nitro engine and electric motor that both produce 3.4 peak shaft HP. The nitro engine will generally lose torque (and power) on either side of the peak power point. With the IC engine the graphs of torque and power will look like hills with an ascending side and a receding side from the peaks. Typically with a 2-stroke engine, the peak power and peak torque are made at fairly similar rotational speeds with peak torque always lagging power by a bit.

On the other hand, electric motors make significantly more torque when the rotational speed drops below the rated load/power point (see graph below). This is why electric helis don't bog like nitro, even if they made the same peak HP. The power advantage of electric becomes more obvious if you look at a power vs rpm graph of each.

Long story made short, electric rules!

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12-28-2010 04:26 PM  7 years agoPost 1652
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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It's just plain cheaper for me to have fun flying an electric. 44 cents for nitro vrs roughly 10 cents (figuring charging equipmement that lasts several thousand cycles) per minute to fly. I'm cheap I have to admit. The bulk of my $ and time goes to my family so the cheaper I can keep this hobby the better. If I'm dropping 25$ every week or two on a gallon of fuel the red flag would raise with the wife. Dropping a hundred every few months or so (barring a crash) and I only have to justify myself once every few months.

High Voltage just works better

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12-28-2010 04:45 PM  7 years agoPost 1653
BobOD

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The power advantage of electric becomes more obvious if you look at a power vs rpm graph of each.
Yes, and if only the energy density were there. :P

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12-28-2010 05:32 PM  7 years agoPost 1654
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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Yes, and if only the energy density were there. :P
At 1/4 the cost per minute what would you expect? More power or something

High Voltage just works better

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12-28-2010 05:40 PM  7 years agoPost 1655
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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It will be, just give it some time. The energy density that batteries store doesn't need to be as high as liquid fuel because brushless motors are Sooooo much more eff. than slobber meisters which puke most of their usable energy out the exhaust.

BTW I don't hate nitro motors, they still have their place for awhile longer

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12-28-2010 06:08 PM  7 years agoPost 1656
BobOD

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New York- USA

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Details please. What's been the trend of energy density over the past 10 years? It's very easy to find this information...just look at past literature of commonly used lipos and plot a graph. If someone does that, I will listen. My flying career is probably over after another 10 so I'm not taking a hunch on it.

Well, maybe not over but I'll probably be looking at this 600 class heli with the 91 in it and saying...what am I supposed to do with that? How does expo work again?

Blabber on all you want. It's been going on for years and nitro energy density still is the clear winner. When I want a nice long flight with all the power I need, I'll grab the nitro. When I want a quick blast of energy, I'll grab the electric. And, of course, that may change depending on this little project of mine...or it might not. But, at least I'm doing something to explore.

Those that are exploring flight time with electric are doing so by reducing HS. And if you want to talk about torque, the greatest impulse is stored right there in the rotating rotor. Consider that.

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12-28-2010 06:13 PM  7 years agoPost 1657
Aaron29

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USA

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..

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12-28-2010 06:17 PM  7 years agoPost 1658
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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When I want a nice long flight with all the power I need, I'll grab the nitro. When I want a quick blast of energy, I'll grab the electric.
Hey Bob, in another 10 you might not be able to handle that quick blast of energy with an E, so you better fly E's while you still are able!

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12-28-2010 06:44 PM  7 years agoPost 1659
Footey

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Hamilton New Zealand

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The main draw back with electric is charging big batteries at the field, generators can be a pain in the but (and need to be added to your cost per flight.

If you have mains power at the field then no big problem. I like to fly electrics most of the time but if I am going to fly all day it is just easier to pack a nitro machine into the car so you can fill and fly without mucking around.

Life is like a bath, the longer you stay in it the more wrinkled you get.

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12-28-2010 06:47 PM  7 years agoPost 1660
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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It can be bought from suppliers three cases at a time for like 18 bucks a gallon. That's like 70% or less what you otherwise pay.
Cool lets do the math.
7 flights from 18 dollars - 2.57 per flight/8 minutes = 25 cents per minute vrs approximately 10 cents for lipo.

I still can't justify doubling my cost per fun filled minute of going nitro

I do know I'd really enjoy flying a big nitro but dang those things are expensive to run

If we didn't have electricity at our field then I would be torn a little more. I must admit this thread has definitly peaked my curiousity of getting a nitro bird.

High Voltage just works better

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