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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › Is a gas heli / .60 size Airwolf fuse right for my first project?
04-09-2010 08:30 PM  8 years agoPost 1
Adaboy

rrApprentice

Maricopa, AZ, USA

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Hi all I'm brand new to heli's (well 108 sim hours in)and I wanted to start with a scale model .60 size Century Airwolf fuse using the Century Predator Carbon Gasser SE NX V2.0. I need help determining if the tail mechanics, scale muffler, G231 or G26, electronics, gyro's, servo's, etc will work or require custom work to complete. Also if you could offer your advice/recommendations.

(I really wanted to start with a turbine engine but I've been talked out of it) .90 size gasser is what I wanted but I didn't see the Airwolf scale fuse for it.

Thanks guys.

Sounds like were cooking with gas....

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04-09-2010 10:21 PM  8 years agoPost 2
wws2010

rrApprentice

La Cresenta, California - United States

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Well you are not going to enjoy yourself, please get a 450 with some training gear first. You need to get a feel for flying in the real world. Then you can move on. Trust me you will crash that thing within the break in flights.

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04-09-2010 10:33 PM  8 years agoPost 3
ScottV

rrApprentice

El Dorado Hills, CA

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I hope you have alot of money, and I mean alot of money if your very first helicopter is going to be a 60 size gasser with a scale body.

Have you ever flown a helicopter before in real life. A sim does not count.

So long and thanks for all the fish!
`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.. ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º>

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04-09-2010 11:04 PM  8 years agoPost 4
thtoyman

rrKey Veteran

Gone ,Flying.

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advice/recommendations.

To much to start with. Hope you have alot of money.

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04-09-2010 11:41 PM  8 years agoPost 5
sonny1526

rrNovice

USA

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.60 gasser
Like the other guys said, you should start out small like a 450 or 500 size heli. I started on the sim countless hours can't tell how many but it helped with orientation and hovering, etc. I can tell tell you that the sim is about 75-80 percent accurate in teaching you to fly heli. I banged up that E-flight blade heli so many times but I learned a lot from it. Then as I got better switched to bigger and bigger heli. My favorite is the Raptor 50 because it can manuever pretty well just about any flying field. In the future you might want to look at the new Century Radical which is a 50 size gasser...well made and high quality parts.

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04-10-2010 12:00 AM  8 years agoPost 6
lrogers

rrKey Veteran

Mobile, Al

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Okay, if you start with the rig you are talking about, you will probably have close to $3000 in it not including your time. Odds are, it will last about 30 seconds and you will be rebuilding.

Now, if money is not an object, then the larger helicopter will be much more stable than a smaller one. My Mongoose gasser is the easiest helo I have to fly, but also the most expensive to repair. A set of main blades by themselves will run between 200-300 dollars and guess what is the first thing to go even in just a tip over?

Second, a scale bird is a big investment in time and money. You will be WAY ahead of curve if you fly the helo pod and boom first, no matter what size you start with. Get the manchine sorted out and dialed in BEFORE you go the scale route.

You mentioned a lot of sim time and that will serve you well. I also had a ton of sim time before my first flight and I can tell you there is a world of difference! The biggest being if you screw up, it's not just press the reset and go again. You be doing a tear down, damage inspection, ordering parts and doing a rebuild.

Also, the sim WILL NOT teach you things like engine tuning or proper set up. The difference between a good flying heli and a real pig can be a turn or two of a link. Even good manuals leave a lot to be desired when it comes to setting up your model and I can tell that the Century manuals aren't that good. They are okay for someone who has built and set up a model or two, but they are not beginner friendly (I've built a Hawk and looked hard at the Predator-downloaded both manuals).

I have also built a Funkey H-500D (Sceadu Evo 50) and I'm in the process of building a Century Sea King (JR Vigor). The manuals for scale fuselages are not step-by-step, detailed instructions. they are really more "general guidance".

Please understand, I not trying to discourage you, just want you to be fully aware of what you are about to jump into. I love my scale models and can't wait until I can turn my Mongoose into an AH-1 Cobra gunship! Now, if you want to start building your Airwolf while you are getting some "field experience", that's not a bad idea. You can spend months detailing a scale fuselage.

If you really want a large Airwolf, besure to check out the VARIO big Airwolf (http://www.eastcoastvario.com). The Vario line is not cheap, but there are a ton of scale bits you can add.

What ever way you decide to go, best of luck!

Larry Rogers - R/C Helicopter Pilot

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04-10-2010 12:05 AM  8 years agoPost 7
payne1967

rrElite Veteran

uk

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fly the heli pod and boom first
don't fit it into a scale body to learn on

a raptor 30 or 50 is a better bet as to the crash costs are a lot lower

irogers
is it the std or cs vigor in the sea king?

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04-10-2010 12:13 AM  8 years agoPost 8
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Hi all I'm brand new to heli's (well 108 sim hours in)
Did you stay in a Holiday Inn Express, too?

Advice?

1. Sim'ing ain't flying. Crashes do NOT reset themselves, and are not free.

2. Go ahead and spend some time building the scale ship and get it right. Don't be in a rush, see #1 above.

3. In the meantime, get a heli and LEARN TO FLY IT. See #1, above.

4. Seek local help in initial setup (either heli), flight trimming, and instruction. See #1 above.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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04-10-2010 12:15 AM  8 years agoPost 9
lrogers

rrKey Veteran

Mobile, Al

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It started life as a standard Vigor, but was upgraded to a CS.

Larry Rogers - R/C Helicopter Pilot

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04-10-2010 01:34 AM  8 years agoPost 10
broggyr

rrKey Veteran

Naugy, CT

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Sorry to harp on this, but someone who has no heli experience really has no idea what they're in for. The people who don't fly helis (or any aircraft) think that all you do is give it throttle and it lifts sraight up. I was one of them. I sure learned the hard way.

The sim is one thing, but real life is another. Seriously, unless you don't mind throwing away a couple hundred dollars per crash while you are learning (and yes, you will crash), then get a smaller beater heli and learn on that. It will be much cheaper to repair when you do crash.

We are not trying to pick on you or bully you, we are just trying to save you a lot of wasted time & money.

- Brian
irony [ay-ruh-nee', ay-er-nee'] adj.: Like goldy or bronzy, but made of iron

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04-10-2010 01:57 AM  8 years agoPost 11
Furious Predator

rrProfessor

Kitchener, Ontario, Canada

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predator gasser 60 would be a great machine to work with. but, since your new with the hobby, i would not put the scale fuse on it until you have some serious air time on that gasser.

crashes are inevitable, a scale fuse will add huge costs to your crash since the bodies do not handle them well.

the 450 is a bit of a piece of junk, but its an OK tool for learning, but not as easy as lets say a 50.

since you have the gasser, just fly it, the prices are not bad for that machine, and the predator handles crashes very well.

Shawn
Team Leisure-Tech
Team HelixRC

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04-10-2010 04:03 AM  8 years agoPost 12
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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Buy a Trex 450 to practice on.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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04-10-2010 05:43 AM  8 years agoPost 13
helibeast

rrApprentice

Mn

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There is no saying such as "Brave men and their proud simulators".
A real life experience learning to hover will quickly humble a would be pilot. Don't kill a great fuse by learning on it.

Champion,Magic,MiniBoy,Xcell60+50,Intrepid,Intrepid Gas,Baron30,Whisper,300X,mCPXv1v2,Concept,Nexus

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04-10-2010 06:50 AM  8 years agoPost 14
Adaboy

rrApprentice

Maricopa, AZ, USA

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Great advice!!!
You've given me some good advice, yes money is an object, and yes a sim is not the real thing so thank you for putting that in perspective. Also building the scale fuse while learning on the real thing (pod and boom) makes perfect sense and the time frame on build helps as well. One thing though I've noticed that everyone recomends different training birds to start out with as well as various articles I've read. Someone pointed out that larger birds generally are more stable which was my thought process as it sounds like I'm going to be spending some real money either way, just trying to get a little help from the bird it's self. any thoughts here?

Points taken:
I have not flown a real bird and will not learn with scale fuse on.
Will research the Mongoose chopper
dkshema's post was awesome and point taken "see step #1" lol
Irogers - thanks for your input.
Furious Predator - thanks for the feedback on the gasser much needed.
And thanks to the rest of you for the strait talk as I'm leaning on your professional opinions and advice.

Last question say I went with the predator gasser which engine would be best g231 or g26?

I'm open to any advice/comments here. Thanks

Sounds like were cooking with gas....

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04-10-2010 11:52 AM  8 years agoPost 15
van-man-123

rrApprentice

n ireland u.k

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hope your wallet is fat you are gonna need it ,,,get yourself a pod and boom first

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04-10-2010 02:20 PM  8 years agoPost 16
Adaboy

rrApprentice

Maricopa, AZ, USA

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Pod and Boom - check
I know this topic has been touchy in other post; however, I must ask which is the best option FBL systems or not? then which is the best system for a gasser and why do you recommend it?

Next question has anybody used the Jewel RC generator to recharge the batts and run the electrical systems while in flight?

Lastly there are many radio's that shops have been saying are great ones, is the DX7 the truth? or being that one day down the road I want a scale with nice features what would be the best radio uner $500.00?

Thanks

Sounds like were cooking with gas....

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04-10-2010 02:29 PM  8 years agoPost 17
lrogers

rrKey Veteran

Mobile, Al

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Okay, Glad you are open to suggestions! Yes, the Mongoose is a great flier, but if you add in a generator and all the on-board electronics, you are going to be looking in the $3600 range.

My Mongoose is powered by the G-26 and was up-graded to the "pro plus" model by Bh Hanson products. This makes the engine smoother and produces a bit more power. Al ( the engine guru at Hanson) recommended to me that if I got another engine, he would recommend the G-27 since it had a 4 bolt head and sealed better. I'm prefectly happy with the G-26 and LOVE it's fuel economy. I can fly nearly 30 minutes on a full tank of fuel. The on-board generator supplies all the power needs for the on-board electronics.

My belief is that a Raptor 50 or T-Rex 600 will give you the best bang for buck while learning to fly. The .50 size machines offer good stabilty, have reasonable initial costs and resonable repair costs. The Raptor 30 is another low cost alternative. If you have someone to help you during the set up, the Hawk by Century is a very capable low cost helicopter. I used my Hawk as my "beater bird" and used it to push my flying skills. After about 55 flights, I plowed a field with it while pushing the envelope a little to far (still miss that bird).

Personally, I learned on my Hirobo Sceadu Evo 50. This one later became my first scale helo. (check my gallery for pics of them all) I have a T-Rex 450 and it is a fun helo to play with, but not one I would recommend as a first helo. They are inexpensive, but wickedly fast and can be tricky to fly in the wind. Mine is currently awaiting it's 8th post crash rebuild. Last Sunday I let it get a bit too far away and I lost my visiual orientation. I rolled right when I should have rolled left! The flip side is that if you master the 450, you will be able to fly anything you want. Parts are cheap and plentiful. Some of the more common parts that get damaged come packaged 2-3 to a bag, so time between crashs and flights can be kept to a minimum.

One thing you have not mentioned is what radio you intend to use. I won't get into the which is best debate. Futaba (my personal choice), JR, Airtronics and Specktrum all make great radios that will give you many years of good service. I will recommend that you go with a 2.4ghz radio (spread spectrum) no matter what make you decide on. Also, since you want to go scale, I would recommend at least a 9 channel radio. I started with the Futaba 9CHP Super and later moved up to the Futaba 12z. The extra channels are good for things like a governor, landing gear, lights, opening doors, etc.

Take your time, ask questions, do your research and you will come out way ahead of the game. ABOVE all, try to find some local help. Having an experienced pilot guide you through things like set up, radio progaming and engine tuning is invaluable. Pus, you just might get a new friend and someone to fly with!

Larry Rogers - R/C Helicopter Pilot

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04-10-2010 02:49 PM  8 years agoPost 18
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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Last question say I went with the predator gasser which engine would be best g231 or g26?
If you're going to buy a gasser and you have no experience with gassers, I recommend you talk to Wally and consider one of his motors. I have a 30cc Wally motor in my Spectra. I sent you a PM with his info.
Next question has anybody used the Jewel RC generator to recharge the batts and run the electrical systems while in flight?
Raja's Jewel is an excellent addition to a Predator gasser. Raja is also a good guy to get to know if you are considering a gasser. I sent you a PM with his info.

MOST IMPORTANTLY: If I were you, and if you have never flown a heli before, I would buy an Align Trex 450 Sport to learn on. The price of a crash is a 450 Sport will be maybe $100. The price of a crash in a Predator gasser could be $500 or up. If you crash 3 times in the first month, you could save nearly $1500 by NOT flying a Predator first. Here is a link to a Align Trex 450 Sport.

http://www.readyheli.com/KX015076-A...bo_p_34878.html

When you outgrow the 450 Sport, you can always sell it. You might also check the classified section on RunRyder and buy someone else's 450 Sport ready to fly. Learn for a few months on it while you are building your Predator.

I taught myself to fly helis on an old Trex 450. I put wood blades on it and some big training gear. I crashed it alot. It was expensive. The 450 size helicopter are small and kind of hard to see at a distance, but I feel one of the benefits of learning on them is that if you somehow get out of control and happen to hit yourself or you hit something else around you, so long as you have wood blades and not too high a head speed, the damage will be a lot less. If you're flying a big 600 sized electric, you have to go to a much larger field to fly, and if you get out of control and hit yourself the results could be really disastrous. Whatever you do, don't try to learn to fly when there are kids around. A newbie pilot and kids do not mix. These helicopters, even a 450 with wooden blades, are dangerous. There was one guy on here who used to fly behind a plexiglass "Foo Shield". When I was learning how to fly, I can't tell you how many times when I was practicing hovering nose in that the helicopter would come forward at me and I would have a near miss. At least my helicopter was small.

One last thing: Don't learn to fly alone. If you do get hit, you'll want someone there to drive you to the hospital.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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04-10-2010 02:49 PM  8 years agoPost 19
ShuRugal

rrKey Veteran

Killeen, TX

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Lastly there are many radio's that shops have been saying are great ones, is the DX7 the truth? or being that one day down the road I want a scale with nice features what would be the best radio uner $500.00?
DX7 is a good choice for a starter radio. Seven channels will get you the normal heli controls (Yaw, Pitch, Roll, Collective, Throttle) as well as Gyro gain and, if you want it, Governer speed.

As for under $500, that's a DX7, or Futaba's 8FGH. Or you could get an Airtronics radio with as many as ten channels in the 300 range, but the Airtronics 2.4 system is not nearly as robust (resistant to interference) as Futaba or Spektrum. Probably that would never be an issue in real-world flight situations, but it's something i wouldn't take a chance on.

AMA 700159

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04-10-2010 03:47 PM  8 years agoPost 20
Adaboy

rrApprentice

Maricopa, AZ, USA

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Good Info
Ok so sounds like I would like to go with the spektrum radio, sounds like more than seven channels will be the best thing so I'll have to figure out which one to go with. Local help has been pushing me towards the align 600 seris with FBL system. Is the FBL the better rotor system to start with for a beginner? And how difficult is it to convert a pull start engine to an electric start? Thanks

Sounds like were cooking with gas....

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