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HomeAircraftHelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › How to check the plug on a gasser (SOLVED!!!)
04-08-2010 01:09 PM  8 years agoPost 1
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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So my brand swanky new Radikal is built. I took it to the back yard last night just to get it started and hear the engine purr. Nothing

I have absolutely no experience with gassers at all, but I know the first thing I'd check on my nitro is if the plug is okay. Since I don't have a glow igniter for my spark plug, how do I know it's making sparks? Can I just take it out, put the boot on and turn the motor over with the EI plugged in? Will that make a visible spark so I can tell the plug and EI are working properly?

I suppose I should probably mention that the motor isn't new. It's been run before, and I've just left it at whatever needle settings the guy before me was flying it with.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-08-2010 01:28 PM  8 years agoPost 2
shawmcky

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Isle of Wight,United Kingdom

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Checking the spark
Remove the plug,push the plug lead on the plug,make sure its on properly as i have read here it needs a good firm push to clip it on properly,rest the body of the plug against the cylinder to earth it and spin it over,you should have a nice spark.

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04-08-2010 04:17 PM  8 years agoPost 3
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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Is the choke on?

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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04-08-2010 04:56 PM  8 years agoPost 4
Zman

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Florida

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rotor, most likely, your cap wasnt on tight enough, fairly common on this metal zenoah cap. As mentioned, give a really hard push. If it isnt on, it wont do anything. I really doubt you have a bad plug, spark plugs dont go bad like glow plugs do so easily. If you can get in a dark room, ground the plug to part of engine and turn over slowly (dont ask me why!) and you should see a blue spark everytime the magnet on fan comes over sensor. This is with ignition turned on of course. If the room is really quiet you may also be able to hear it "snap". If you have spark, but still no start, check plug to see if it is dry. If it is dry, come back on here and let us know and we will then give a plan to figure out why no fuel. But most likely, you spark cap just needs a good push, especially if you never even heard a bump on engine. If you heard a bump and the plug is really wet, then that would be flooded but doubtful.

Z

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04-08-2010 06:27 PM  8 years agoPost 5
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Wow, thanks for the advice guys. At least that gives me a place to start anyway. I'll give it another whack tonight. I thought I put the spark plug boot on pretty tight, but maybe not enough. I'll give 'er another push and see what I get.

Failing that, I'll pull the plug and see if it's drenched when I'm done, and try getting a spark from it. Yeah, I didn't figure they'd die often/easily, but it has been sitting all winter and I don't know whether the previous owner winterized the motor or not.

Fuel is definitely getting to the carb, so I should be good there. Anyway, I'll try again tonight and let you guys know what I get.

Thanks again!

Edit: Oh yeah, I did try with Choke on at first, then figured I'd give it a whirl without. Neither got me going.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-08-2010 10:03 PM  8 years agoPost 6
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Okay, I just got back in from trying to get it started again. No go. So I took the plug out, insert it into the EI's boot, plugged in the ignition battery, touched the threaded part of the plug to the crank case, and pulled the starter cord.

No spark. Absolutely nothing so far as I can tell. So I double checked that it wasn't the servo extension I was using by plugging the EI straight in to the battery. Nothing.

I don't have any other 4.8v batteries kicking around, so I went ahead and tried plugging it into my reg just for testing, and still nothing.

I'm not using a switch. For the moment it's straight battery to EI. I don't have a spare plug lying around to see if the problem is the plug.

I sorta suspect the EI because of the way it was mounted. The zenoah manual says it shouldn't be mounted so the bottom (I think) is touching anything directly. I'm guessing so that it can dissipate heat? Anyway, the previous owner had it mounted up with foam tape along the bottom, so I think it might be the EI that's burnt out.

Is there any way I can test the plug or EI separate from one another? I have a multimeter if it'll help me any. Any suggestions are welcome.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-08-2010 10:09 PM  8 years agoPost 7
shawmcky

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Isle of Wight,United Kingdom

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Do you have a lawn mower or weed whacker
you can use to test your plug ?just put the plug on the mower or weed whacker h.t(plug)lead and crank it over to check it sparks.

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04-08-2010 10:12 PM  8 years agoPost 8
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Are the plugs interchangeable like that? I'll go have a look at the weedwhacker.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-08-2010 10:17 PM  8 years agoPost 9
shawmcky

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Isle of Wight,United Kingdom

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I dont mean fit the plug to your mower or whacker
Just use the ignition system to check for a spark by laying the Radikals plug against an earth point lead connected and checking for a spark,you dont have to even take the plug out of your garden equipment as you are just checking for your sparks

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04-08-2010 10:32 PM  8 years agoPost 10
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well, I just came back in. The plug sizes are vastly different, and the boot on the mower and/or whacker don't fit the spark plug from the G20 properly. Guess I'll just have to find myself a new spark plug and see if it works in the G20 EI.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-09-2010 11:58 AM  8 years agoPost 11
Zman

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Florida

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Rotor,

if you can locate a ngk cm-6 locally at auto store (mine was able to bring one in the same day from warehouse) that is a great plug to use. Also teh honda plug part number 98052-56471 will also work.It could be plug but still say probably not unless the previous owner killed it by trying to gap it and cracked something.
If the plug was wet and cap was on tight and plug was good, there should be no reason it didnt fire other than a bad ignition. It does sound like sensor was mounted wrong. Can you ask the owner if the last time he ran the engine, it started and ran fine or was he having a problem geting it to fire as well? Also were you able to check in a dark room for spark? It is really hard to see if there is any daylight at all. Last time I had to check for spark in daylight, I volunteered a fellow members finger to hold cap as I spun it with electric starter. I assumed it had spark since he walked away cussing me out. . Probably wont get him to fall for that again. Man I wish I was there to help you through this but you are going about trouble shooting like a pro.

Keep us posted.

Z

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04-09-2010 12:32 PM  8 years agoPost 12
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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There's a Champion (Y28 I think?) in there right now. Didn't know what other plugs it could use - so thank you for that!

As far as I know, the previous owner wasn't having any trouble with it. The guy is local, but not someone I end up seeing often.

The big reason I suspect the EI is because after reading through the Zenoah manual online, it shows a few ways of how to mount the EI and it appears to have been mounted in one of the ways they specifically say not to. There was foam tape along the bottom of it. I'm guessing that's the side that dissipates heat the most? Anyway, so EI could be toast.

I'll go looking for one of the 3 plugs I now know will work today, and see if it helps any. If not, then I have a spare plug. No big loss.

Failing that, I'll bring everything to the club this weekend. There's a few plankers there running DL50s and what have you. Hopefully I can test my plug in their ignition system just to be sure.

Worst comes to worst, I suppose I'll get getting me a new ignition system. Any suggestions on a system better than the stock zenoah? Maybe something lighter/less clunky?

Again thanks for all the info Zman! You're a scholar and a gentleman. I don't care what people say about you! :P

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-09-2010 04:01 PM  8 years agoPost 13
Zman

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Florida

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Np Rotor. At this point I am as intrigued as you and like problem solving! . I was really hoping it was just the cap not on really tight as that has happened to a few folks here and they were up and running in no time. Did you ever get a chance to go into a really dark room to make sure there wasnt a spark? It really is hard to see with any kind of light. Or if you dont mind a little pop, just hold onto the plug cap and spin it over with a starter, you will know real quick if you are getting spark or not.

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04-09-2010 06:12 PM  8 years agoPost 14
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Yeah, stuck my finger right on the electrode when I was doing it yesterday, and didn't feel anything.

I took your suggestion, and just pulled on it slowly. One of my buddies made the suggestion that some of the modern EI systems won't spark unless you pull fairly aggressively as a safety feature in case you forget to turn it off. I don't know whether that's the case with this one, but can't hurt to give that a shot too.

I'll git 'er goin'. And when I do, I'll let you know what it was. Even if it's a little embarrassing. I suspect it will be

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-09-2010 06:28 PM  8 years agoPost 15
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Click
If you just move the magnet past the ignition sensor, it should fire and you will hear a click. You can go back and forth over the sensor with the magnet and make it click and fire. It fires when it goes past the magnet, not rpm related.

I tested this with the stock Zenoah ignition and the Hanson supplied aftermarket ignition when I was checking current draw. Both work in this manner.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4210 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3280 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1555 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 393 flts

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04-09-2010 06:50 PM  8 years agoPost 16
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well crap...

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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04-09-2010 07:52 PM  8 years agoPost 17
smallplanes

rrElite Veteran

S.C. ,SSA

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What i do to see if it has good fire is i stick it to my nuts and pull the cord very hard.haha Just kidding


Spectra G 26cc
Jewel
Bat 27cc
Trex 700<br

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04-10-2010 06:35 AM  8 years agoPost 18
Against Gravity

rrVeteran

Pottstown PA

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Testing
I also have heard that the Testicular test was very accurate.
"If carefully done".

AG

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04-10-2010 08:04 AM  8 years agoPost 19
shawmcky

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Isle of Wight,United Kingdom

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^That is true
Just make sure your big toe is earthed

Team- unbiased opinion.K.I.S.S principle upheld here

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04-10-2010 03:35 PM  8 years agoPost 20
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well I finally found a place in town that had the NGK plug in stock. I just picked it up, slapped it in and.... Nothing

Still no spark.

I'm sure the sensor is lined up with the fan magnet. So what should the next troubleshooting step be? Looks to me like either the EI or the sensor is dead. Is there any way to test them independently of one another?

Should I just go ahead and buy myself another EI? If so, where do I get one, and which one should I get?

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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HomeAircraftHelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › How to check the plug on a gasser (SOLVED!!!)
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