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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › Piro during FFF
04-05-2010 10:53 AM  8 years agoPost 1
Evil_Homer

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Cubbington, Warwickshire, United Kingdom

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Hey all,
Bit of a problem with my Synergy and TREX600, both really struggle to do piro's during FFF, they really struggle to get to 90 to the direction of travel and then will either hang up or whip round as the heli slows. What can done to sort this out?

TREX600n with GY611
Synergy n9 with Spartan DS760

Thanks

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04-05-2010 11:17 AM  8 years agoPost 2
nivlek

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Norfolk England

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Is it the same in either direction ?

At the end of the day , it gets dark .

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04-05-2010 12:14 PM  8 years agoPost 3
heli-cuzz

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Pittston, Pa. USA

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What can done to sort this out?
Slow down a little.

Fury 55 NIB Furion6 CGY750 fbl helicopter-Frenzy CGY750 fbl nitro-Frenzy fbl NOBAR90

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04-05-2010 01:04 PM  8 years agoPost 4
LaurenceGough

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UK

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Can you get some pics of your tail on your heli?

Make sure the limits are set to the maximum travel on each end.

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04-05-2010 01:52 PM  8 years agoPost 5
Evil_Homer

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Cubbington, Warwickshire, United Kingdom

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Is it the same in either direction ?
Tends to be more rudder left input
Slow down a little.
Tried that, works to a degree, but I see others doing travelling piros far faster than I am.
Can you get some pics of your tail on your heli?

Make sure the limits are set to the maximum travel on each end..
Dont have pic's but will take and upload later. Travels are to the max without binding.

TREX uses carbon rod from servo to bell crank, wire pushrod from bellcrank to tail control arm.

Synergy is carbon on both rods.

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04-05-2010 02:20 PM  8 years agoPost 6
LaurenceGough

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UK

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Are you using the USB cable to program the Spartan gyro?

What tail servos?

Rudder left input (nose to the left) should be easier for the tail to move around in FFF, something is wrong for sure.

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04-05-2010 06:33 PM  8 years agoPost 7
Evil_Homer

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Cubbington, Warwickshire, United Kingdom

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The Synergy has a BLS251, the TREX is a 9256. The Spartan is configured using the USB

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04-05-2010 09:16 PM  8 years agoPost 8
nivlek

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Norfolk England

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Can you increase the gain of the gyros ? As it tends to be worse to the left (anti-clockwise) , that sort of rules out a tail power issue .

At the end of the day , it gets dark .

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04-05-2010 09:19 PM  8 years agoPost 9
LaurenceGough

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UK

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Could you please upload the file (or open the file with notepad) for your Spartan settings (save them first) or tell us these settings:

Here's my Trex 450 pro settings for example:

[Gyro]
Product=ds760
Application version=111
Firmware version=201
Memory Map version=3
[Servo]
High endpoint=95
Low endpoint=63
Midpoint trim=0
Servo=33
Speed=5
Type=0
[Common]
Direction=0
Rudder stick deadband=5
[Mode 1 (Rate Mode)]
Rudder exponential=-50
[Mode 2 (AVCS Mode)]
Acceleration profile=13
Deceleration profile=3

I may be barking up the wrong tree as both your helis have this issue but I just would like to know this first of all.

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04-05-2010 11:41 PM  8 years agoPost 10
Yug

rrMaster

UK. Herts

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Before playing around with gyro settings, there are 2 things I would do to get things working well mechanically. 1st off is to use bigger blades so as to get more thrust. 2nd, lighten the tail servo load (& consequently gyro gain) by using chinese weights. With correct adjustment, this should reduce the maximum servo load from several Kg down to nearly nothing depending on how well you persavere.

Vegetable rights and Peace

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04-06-2010 12:57 AM  8 years agoPost 11
LaurenceGough

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UK

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Chinese weights are not needed, especially for left piros. A matter of fact is that these helis should be able to do them no problem, unless there is an issue stopping them.

Look at pro's helis (ones which use many piro manoeuvres) none of them are using the weights.

They add extra load to the tail grips, tail shaft and tail bearings.

I used to run them, but I took them off all my helis.

Although your post does remind me, when you remove the tail linkages from the servo horn, does it all move freely throughout all the travel by hand?

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04-06-2010 01:16 AM  8 years agoPost 12
Yug

rrMaster

UK. Herts

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Of course the weights add more load, but only to the thrust bearings which can easily deal with this unless you are relying on using just axial bearings to cope with the thrust loads. If you do the maths, these are all grossly inadequate anyway so a failure is imminent. Shaft bearings are unaffected.
When removing tail linkages, with a well balanced TR system, the pushrod should move freely and with just a little loading at the extremes.
I think the reason why the 'Pros' don't use them is because it takes too long to setup and they can counteract this by using high power servos with a shortened lifespan.

Vegetable rights and Peace

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04-07-2010 10:45 PM  8 years agoPost 13
Evil_Homer

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Cubbington, Warwickshire, United Kingdom

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Hey all,
Thanks for the inputs, I have had to jump on a plane for the week, due back on the weekend for a couple of hours.

Both the helis have 95mm on them, though I do admit previously I had 105's on the Synergy, reduced them to try and save the gears, previously the piro performance was a lot better with the 105's, understandably.

The linkages are all pretty much bind free, smooth as possible.

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