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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › Once more the Spectra..
03-29-2010 03:42 PM  10 years ago
carpman

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Spain

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Well its definitely not engaging is it!!!!

I guess that can only be the clutch/bell as nothing can spin or rotate other than that....

Wonder if a clutch/liner on its way out has been causing your tail be be a bit on the jumpy side?
KEVIN
Trex 500ESP | Trex 600NSP | Trex 700 Gasser | MA Spectra G
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03-29-2010 03:51 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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Wonder if a clutch/liner on its way out has been causing your tail be be a bit on the jumpy side?
Only if it causes EMF/static - and the bell ain't hot.. but who knows..if it was just a jumpy tail then my holding onto the gyro should damp it.

How d'ya like the helipad?
pgk
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03-29-2010 03:52 PM  10 years ago
shawmcky

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Isle of Wight,United Kingdom

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rbort
I had a similar problem with engagment which i thought was the clutch,not on this model i admit,but it was caused by a damaged one way allowing the main shaft to freewheel when it should have been locking up solidly.Just a suggestion ,thats all.
Team- unbiased opinion.K.I.S.S principle upheld here
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03-29-2010 04:54 PM  10 years ago
Fixit

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UK

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pgk
The clutch is toast M8, the only problem is getting the parts to repair it or you could send it back for re-build but either way it’s a long wait.
I only like to fly gassed up
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03-29-2010 08:08 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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Raja

I'll give spectra credit where it's due

Dropping the engine was a doddle. I'd forgotten that I'd planned for it when mounting my switches and stuff on the baseplate... 4 small screws, 4 cable ties and unpeel some velcro then the 2 boom stay bolts and 4 ladder bolts.

Getting the clutch out was a bit more unscrewing but not that bad and for a change the pem nuts behaved.

OK so it's out. A lot of deposit in the clutch bell top. The liner looks pretty thick in all honesty. Also lots of deposit on the side of the clutch shoes and one can see the blueing on the flaps.. canlt remmeber if that's tempering in the factory or use. The slot widens to the open end..suggesting it's opened itself up some.

It's hard to measure the liner/shoe gap but I can get the tip of a feeler guage 0.8mm in there and turn the shoes.. allowing for curvature I'm guessing it's a 1mm gap.

There's no obvious looseness on the fan hub/motor but I haven't leant on it..??

Where do i go from here?

How much of the engine hunting note is tune and how much is clutch slip?

Despite playing this afternoon with it leaned to 1 and 1/8th low needle the plug was wet and dark just now?

Should I do anything while the engine is out?

At the very least i'll wrap a thermocouple around it since i have access (and now have a thermocouple)

pgk
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03-29-2010 08:19 PM  10 years ago
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Hmmm...
Looks like the clutch is opened too much and its overheated at one point or another hence the bluing effect.

You BEST bet might be to send it in for service and have it renewed, then you'll be sure its perfect to mount back into the heli. Otherwise if its open that much you'll need to replace the liner most likely, and hopefully be able to bend the shoes back in so the gap is even from one end to the other without them breaking. They might break due to the overheating, in which case sending it back will be the easiest answer just have it redone at the factory with the least amount of frustrations.

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 2703D, 4400 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3460 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1995 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 923 flts
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03-29-2010 08:39 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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Looks like the clutch is opened too much and its overheated at one point or another hence the bluing effect.
That's what i thought

Who and how do I get hold of the right person to send it to so i get a reply?
pgk
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03-29-2010 08:59 PM  10 years ago
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Minair
I just called there for you to find out. You can send it to Jeff Miller at Minair in Montana, address is on the website. He said he will service it for you and replace whatever parts are necessary for $15 plus parts. I asked about the clutch and the liner, and he said the clutch is $30 if you need a new one and the liner is $22 and he will install it and turn it down for you to the right tolerance.

As far as shipping, they can ship back US mail so its not costly to send back to you.

Hope this helps.

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 2703D, 4400 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3460 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1995 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 923 flts
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03-29-2010 10:18 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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Thanks Raja.. return post isn't the problem..you guys pay pennies..it's the price from here!
I was toying with the idea of sending the whole heli to you at one point .. would have cost £130 dismantled to frame, boom, blades head off size package.. and sending it whole would have been £230..

I'll probably get it packaged and posted with letters etc.. I bet a replacement is silly at UK prices!

Your a good lad, Raja.. and I'm planning on going back to Jamaica end april if you want a drink.. doing some house window shopping..
pgk
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03-29-2010 10:35 PM  10 years ago
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Hmmm...you're tempting me again
Is it easy to bring with you to Jamaica in a suitcase or so? Would that be least costly I wonder. One year while in Jamaica I sorted out Chris Kelly's Spectra - an Air Jamaica pilot. He showed up to the field and gave me his 10X tx, Spectra, gas can, and all his tools and walked off to go fly his jets. It took me all afternoon to program the radio and get it right, and he later came back and said "Wow, I've owned this thing for a year and never seen it fly so good" -- Turbogti was there - he remembers that day for sure at the polo club.

-=>Raja.
MA 1005 Hanson 2703D, 4400 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3460 flts
Whiplash V1-2 Hanson 300, 1995 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 923 flts
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03-29-2010 10:44 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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The aggravations of taking the lipos...

A whole smelly helly?
I've often wondered how one would deodorise it for transport.. rinse it in vodka I suppose?
It's within luggage allowance weight..pull the tail, big suitcase and a heap of polystyrene chips..Using special transport cases adds massive weight and size and extra costs...
pgk
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03-29-2010 11:32 PM  10 years ago
lejon

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Las Vegas, Nevada

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Isopropoyl alcohol
When I traveled with my gasser I would buy some rubbing alcohol and put it in the tank and use the primer bulb to flush it then empty the tank and once I got back I would then run the regular oil / gas mix. I had them check several times for fumes and there were none. To the best of my knowledge it did not harm the engine as I didn't try and run it with the alcohol.

Lejon
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03-29-2010 11:44 PM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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Thanks..cheaper than vodka (well UK anway).pgk
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03-29-2010 11:49 PM  10 years ago
dre4473

rrApprentice

Clarksburg WVa

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Tail wag!
Check the spark plug in the engine to make sure its a resistor plug that will stop the tail servo problem!I had that with my 1005 gasser when I got it and the fellow had a regular plug in it..Doesnt matter if your 2.4 or not..Mine had a 2.4 spectrum running my 9303..Hope this helps ya..
Donald R. Edwards JR Fly it like you stole it!!!
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03-29-2010 11:56 PM  10 years ago
smallplanes

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S.C. ,SSA

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I'm begining to think that the new MA does not know how to make a clutch. I think there using the wrong metal and there boring out the liner to much when they glue it in. If i were you i would buy a liner for a different brand heli wrap the clutch shoes one time with black tape and JB Weld a new liner in. Because i can tell by now that the new MA does not have it down pat yet. Theres no way i would send it from the UK just for that. Just say it ends up a little out of round well let the shoe size it to where it needs to be not a lathe thats cutting them to big every time. Just a tip.

Thanks

Spectra G 26cc
Jewel
Bat 27cc
Trex 700<br
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03-30-2010 12:15 AM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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This clutch was the 'old Ma' before the change.

I redid my 600'd clutch and made the mistake of wrapping it in tape and seating it very nicely... had no end of trouble getting the thing apart with a bit of an epoxy leak (I used the slow set good stuff).

It was also too good a fit and I had to run it up holding the head to cut it back so it could idle

You're the man that could cut some handy rounds to put in clutch shoes for different helis to get it perfect with a screw in handle.

Oh and can you make a parallel plier that opens on squeezing the handles with ends to pull the front TT mushroom out of trexes in one hit and a tool to squeeze the new bearing one... would save all that leavering and tapping..
pgk
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03-30-2010 01:01 AM  10 years ago
Fixit

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UK

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Relining the bell is easy if you have a lathe and I would do that for you if you find a liner, I found a thick Vario liner that worked on my excel.
The shoe is toast and I wouldn’t bother trying to bend the fingers back as they will probably just snap off within a couple of flights.
I only like to fly gassed up
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03-30-2010 04:16 AM  10 years ago
jschenck

rrProfessor

La Vista, NE.

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I look for ~.2mm gap with my clutches. Just relined my T700 bell and a few 50's. I like the Raptor-90 clutch liners. It was a bit short for my 700 so I did the 700 with two pieces. Wrap the clutch with some black vinyl tape, put the clutch in with the starter shaft in to center it and let the glue set (15 minute epoxy).

Didn't check the gap when I built it, this was the result within 1 gallon (Vision 50)

Clutch 41.6mm

Bell was 42.2mm, so gap was .8mm (!!)

Relined the bell to ~41.8mm, been flying fine since. took a few flights to get the clutch to not be grabby at idle but it was never too bad. Same story with my 700 but I relined it before breaking the clutch.
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03-30-2010 08:15 AM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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As I commented.. relineing the clutch isn't such a big issue for me so long as i know what the Minair recomendantion is for gap and I can get a liner and shoe.. so perhaps a call to local distibutor to see if they actually have any. I don't see that a lathe is necessary unless you can't get the liner in right to being with. To be fair the delrin ball looks fine and the bearings feel good.

I don't generally trust 30 min epoxy for long lasting hold.. but that's personal choice. Wrapping a shoe in tape doesn't make it round.. but thinking about it since the old one is toast I could pound it/wedge slots to get it round enough and even run it in a slow drill to check it's close and run the assembly smooth before re-fitting to help cut back any high spots..?

..and If it mess up then fixit could have a go..

First thing will be make a call and then clean up the bell..

I'm also waiting to hear back from Al Hanson to see if he has any comments about his engine and that hunting sound and the mucky appearance through the plug hole at to whther i should leave that or pull the cylinder and clean it...
pgk
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03-30-2010 11:15 AM  10 years ago
pgkevet

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Wales

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A little knowledge is a dangerous thing

I thought I'd have a go at this myself..it seemed sensible to try and get the bottom driver with ball off to pull the shoe and then get the shoe/spindle part replacement. Mistake!.. Whoever assembled that had a viscious streak.. by the time I'd got enough heat on those grub screws to even shift them even a tiny bit the delrin ball was softening... and I was being progressive with added heat

So I called Dave at Motors and rotos.. 40 mins of autodialling later (when you get through he knows his stuff.. but it's a challenge). He then tells me I didn't have to do that and the shoes unscrew and the ball is simply clipped on and he's happy to do it ..it only takes him 5 mins to sort the things. Only issue is parts are sitting in customs still (I've got the same problem with a 700n kit.. british sloth).

So anyway easier to admit I screwed up and send it locally and let Dave sort it and eat crow. I'll know for next time.

I suppose it would help if the minair manual went into such details instead of showing it as a complete unit - hint.

Packing and posting now..
pgk
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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › Once more the Spectra..
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