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Thunder Tiger
Raptor E325 › E325 Mini Titian tracking and shake on spool down.
08-13-2010 01:58 AM  8 years agoPost 61
edward85

rrNovice

Northeast Ohio

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Yep, it worked for mine, too!!!
I found this thread after buzzing my mini around my backyard, and it was exhibiting the same symptoms as the thread title.
So, I pulled the bearings and washers out of the grips, changed up the stack to match the OP setup, and BAM!!!!! Instant smooth!
Like a whole different bird. Good call on the change-up heli-nut.
That arrangement is the way it should have been from the factory.

You wouldn't happen to have any sweet tips on how to stop the whole "heli-to-earth-to-bits" symptoms, would ya?

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08-13-2010 01:32 PM  8 years agoPost 62
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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edward85
lol unfortunatly I can't help you with that one since I still seem to have problems with the heli finding the ground at the worst possible time. Lucky it usually is my 450 size heli's that kiss the earth, I am a bit more cautious when it comes to my big birds and keep them a couple stupids high so the wallet doesn't have heart failure.

Whatever happened to that whole "so ugly the ground repels them" bit, it doesn't seem to help me they still find the ground. Maybe an ugly paint job would help hehehehe.

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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09-05-2010 10:30 PM  7 years agoPost 63
husafreak

rrKey Veteran

Livermore, NorCal

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I have 2 MT's one in a Cobra fuse and the other is an SE for 3D. I solved the tracking issues in the plastic MT by using metal mixing arms but the spool up/down shake never went away and the effect is pretty bad in the scale Cobra fuse, it looks bad to see a scale heli dancing around like that! I will try your mod and report back. My SE has no issues with tracking or the shakes. Buth run CF blades. Thanks for sharing though, I am helping a flying buddy get into 450 helis and I recommended to him the MT plastic with your mod right out of the box!

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09-07-2010 04:11 AM  7 years agoPost 64
husafreak

rrKey Veteran

Livermore, NorCal

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I swapped the bearings in the plastic grips on my Cobra fuse MT and while ther is still some shaking on spool up/down there was zero vibration at flying rpm and in flight so I am pumped! Smooth as glass and a noticeable improvement. Thank you sir! I decided to leave my SE the way it is as it is smooth allready.

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09-15-2010 01:28 PM  7 years agoPost 65
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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Good to hear people are still finding this useful.

Thanks

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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09-27-2010 09:11 PM  7 years agoPost 66
arvai.arnold

rrNovice

Hungary

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Dear Heli-nut50!

I was just reading a mini titan topic in a hungarian forum, where somebody asked a fellow about this topic's ball bearing change. As I'm not an engineer, I cannot translate it word by word, but the main point was, that the 2 normal bearings have to be as far as possible from each other to reduce the momentum to the minimum on them. That is why the thrust bearing is between them.

After I read this, I asked Opener (who wrote the mentioned words), what he thinks about our dancing helis. He wrote, that either I should change the dampeners, or TO PUT WASHERS IN, TO MAKE THE MOVEMENT STIFFER.

I remembered, that I got 6 washers with my mini titan kit, and these were not mentioned in the manual, , there was just a paper, that said: "You may choose adding from 1 up to 3 0.1 mm washer at eachside as shown (next to the dampener) to diminish the clearence between the hub and the grip and to further stiffen the main rotor flapping" (PV0801(-R) )

I could not decide, wether this is the reason or not, but after putting in the 3-3 washers with the normal order of the bearings, there was no movement of the heli when spooling down. Absolutely nothing.

Are the dampeners too soft? I do not know, but this solution works for me as well. Credit goes to Opener (forum.rcmodell.hu).

Somebody did this mod with any success?

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09-29-2010 05:56 PM  7 years agoPost 67
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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Hmmm very interesting. So all you did was stiffen the dampeners by adding the washers. I did try this with mine before I changed the bearings around but it didn't help my spool up shakes and tracking issues. It did slow down the intensity of the spool down shakes. From what I have read and understand it sounds like the number one reason it happens is imperfections in the grips causing binding in the bearings. This is why when you switch to the metal head the shakes go away.

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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09-29-2010 06:50 PM  7 years agoPost 68
arvai.arnold

rrNovice

Hungary

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Another interesting thing: when I first tried the spool down with the normal bearing order, the canopy was not on. ABSOLUTELY NO SHAKE. With the canopy on sometimes there is a little shake (no problem). After the first flying session I made a minor adjustment of the tracking, and tried the spool down without canopy. NO SHAKE. (tracking was OK)
So I think the fixation of the canopy is not so good, and this can make the shake bigger, or promote it. I'll try to mount the canopy somehow stiffer on the heli, and will see. Probably my grip's imperfection is not so bad.
Arnold Árvai
Zalaegerszeg, Hungary

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10-10-2010 11:16 PM  7 years agoPost 69
vigor1

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Dallas, TX - USA

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Is their a particular way the small washer at the end should be oriented? I installed the washer with the smooth/curved side facing the hub. Is this correct?

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10-12-2010 01:05 PM  7 years agoPost 70
heli-nut50

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Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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Is their a particular way the small washer at the end should be oriented? I installed the washer with the smooth/curved side facing the hub. Is this correct?
No this washer orientation really does not matter, mine has the bevel towards the screw. Only the one that goes against the dampner should have the bevel edge facing the bearing.

Hope it helps.

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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10-13-2010 11:45 PM  7 years agoPost 71
vigor1

rrNovice

Dallas, TX - USA

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The bearing swap didn't solve my spool-down shake unfortunately
But it's no worse than it was before, so I will keep it this way. Maybe metal hub, grips, and mixing arms would help?

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10-14-2010 01:16 PM  7 years agoPost 72
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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The bearing swap didn't solve my spool-down shake unfortunately
But it's no worse than it was before, so I will keep it this way. Maybe metal hub, grips, and mixing arms would help?
Hmmm very interesting. You are sure the spindle is not bent or the main rotor shaft? Even a slight bend will cause vibration at certain rpms then i have seen it go away. Its like a harmonic vibration sometimes, it only happens at certain head speeds. The best way to see if they are bent is to roll them on some glass.

The other thing I noticed on mine is you have to check the head is tight on the shaft. It seem to loosen over time. My trex 450se was bad for this and it always seemed to cause the spool down shake or at slow head speeds a whobble in a hover, which can also be soft or loose dampners.

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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11-23-2010 01:51 AM  7 years agoPost 73
Mightythor

rrNovice

Orting, WA

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Bearing Swap
I did the swap and it solved my tracking issues, half turn on one link and perfect tracking. thank you Heli-nut50.

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11-28-2010 02:11 PM  7 years agoPost 74
oldgeeza

rrNovice

united kingdom

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Tracking
Just did the bearing repositioning had one quick flight solved the tracking problem ( never could get the tracking right what ever I tried )Great thread solved a long time problem.

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11-29-2010 01:20 PM  7 years agoPost 75
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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Great to hear it is still helping people.

Thanks

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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11-29-2010 02:22 PM  7 years agoPost 76
stiganas

rrNovice

Romania

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Too sad these great mod comes so late. There where in time at least 10 fixes for the tracking issues of MT. TT never bother to solve the problem and a lot of us (me included) dumped the heli.

It was so frustrating, even now I check the tracking at the beginning of each flight (and of course is good because other helis don't have this problem). With the MT the tracking was good today, tomorrow was bad.

I did my part of mods but it was obvious that it is something simple and different - it was the trust bearing position. Thank you heli-nut50, TT should give you a token or something.

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12-01-2010 09:26 PM  7 years agoPost 77
heli-nut50

rrApprentice

Oil Springs, ON, Canada

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Thanks, glad it helped. TT should but I am just a small fish in a very big pond.

Clayton Brown
MAAC#49470
IMAC#6464

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