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Raptor E620 › looking to build A123 powered e620
03-09-2010 05:27 AM  8 years agoPost 1
renwick56

rrNovice

Tampa, Florida

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I am beginning the process of building an e620 from the remnants of a 50 Titan. I want to use A123 batteries. I plan on adding spacers to the frame to allow the use of A123's.

Now I have seen a few different A123 battery configurations, but some that are (seem) obvious are missing.

My A123 experience says that 5000 mah 10s lipo = 12s2p A123, thereabouts. Has someone tried this? What about 16s1p A123?

I am planning on using a Scorpion HK-4025-740 Motor.

Any comments are welcome.

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03-09-2010 07:12 AM  8 years agoPost 2
litespeed600

rrKey Veteran

St. Charles, Missouri

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Once you get past 10s2p you really start to get heavy. I flew 10s2p for a couple years and then blew mine up to a e710 to lighten the disk loading. I tried 12s2p but then it just felt heavy. I flew the 10s2p at first with a Orbit 30-12 and then about a year and a half ago went to a Neu 1915-1Y and really woke this thing up. I then converted the heli to lipo and 12s 5000 and it's just stupid powerful. I flew with a Z-power 600kv on 15s1p but it just didn't last long enough, flight time speaking. With 10s2p and the Orbit running 610 RotorTech blades at 1900 rpm I could get 13 to 14 min sport flights....that is one hell of a long flight, no matter what your flying! Prior to switching this one to lipo I bought a e550 for my 3D machine (lower cost on parts; blades mainly!) and started it off with the stock power system and 7s2p a123. At 2100 rpm I got 5.5 min flights and decent 3D ability. I then tried 6s5000 lipo's, got about 30 seconds more flight time, 50 more RPMs (according to my eagle tree logger.) and that was when I noticed how much lighter the lipo's were. I flew the 4 7s2p a123s back to back with a couple 6s5000 25c lipos and the lipo's won out for 3D but the a123s actually sport flew better. With the extra weight it made the heli much faster in FFF but it suffered in 3D ability. That was when I switched all my stuff to lipo.

I was always scared of the lipo's in my early years of R/C because of fires and them being fragile. On an Eco 8 I had that I converted to 4s on the first flight of a brand new 4s4000 Polyquest battery, a 165 dollar battery mind you the heli imploded (still don't know why after all this time, something I did just don't know what!) and the blade karate chopped my brand new first flight battery right down the middle of the pack and it started to swell. I read too much to burn down my house so I took it and threw it in a concrete sewer pipe. I was pissed so I went to a safer battery which was the V28 emoile batterys and then switch later to the a123's. Since the balancers became common place and lipo sacks, I believe lipo's are now safe as long as we pay attention.

The 16s1p can only be done with a PowerJazz controller...that's $450. With a CC HV controller you can do 15s reliably. Someone was trying 18s1p (Mr. Mel I think??) with a power Jazz but I believe weight was killing the project. 12s2p would be best with around 1000kv motor and 600 KV for 15s. I built a couple 12s2p packs (very similar to the Tanic 12s2p packs.) and flew them for awhile but I just kept noticing the weight as I got to be a better flyer. I sold some of mine and the rest went into my sons electric scooters as 9s4p in a 24 volt rated scooter. Has a top speed of about 20mph and pulls me (210 lbs) to that really quick. Saved about 7 lbs over the sealed lead batteries.

Sorry...I'm rambling on....too many Percets (SP?) to kill the pain in my shoulder I guess.

I'll dig up that info on the e710 conversion if this was you that asked me on RCgroups...I'll post it there in a PM.

Have fun with the project,

Tom

Married with 2 kids, I am no stranger to pain!

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03-10-2010 04:36 PM  8 years agoPost 3
concept1

rrKey Veteran

Youngstown, OH

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10s2p is heavy, good for sport flying.
I went with 15s and the scorpion 630kv motor and love it. 5.5-6 minute flights. if you lower the head speed for more sport flying you can stretch it out to closer to 8min.
but right now I see the benefit of running both 15s A123 and 12s Lipo on the same heli setup. with the cheaper 6s lipo's now I plan on getting a set for this summer. going higher voltage should give a more consistent power thru the flight. and going 12s lipo you should be able run the 15-20c lipo's, although I will be going with the 25c Zippy's which I think will give ballistic performance and great flight time! same performance as my A123's but a little less weight!

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03-11-2010 04:26 AM  8 years agoPost 4
Larry3215

rrApprentice

Gig Harbor, Washington, USA

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Ive been flying a stretched 550 (620 boom) with 600mm blades on 12S1P A123 cells for a while.

My head speed is 1900 and I dont do any 3D yet. Just hovering and FFF with some mild maneuvers.

I get a solid 5-6 minutes of flight time with some reserve left in the packs.

I also fly with a 10S1P 5000 lipo pack. I get 3 roughly 5 minute long flights on one charge on that pack.

Im running a 750 kV Medusa inrunner and an HV ICE 60.

Larry

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03-11-2010 03:15 PM  8 years agoPost 5
genexis

rrApprentice

SG

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My setup with custom A123 frame.

15S A123
Scorpion HK4025/630
HV 85

http://simplewords.genexis.net/ <-- more pictures of frame

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03-15-2010 08:41 PM  8 years agoPost 6
renwick56

rrNovice

Tampa, Florida

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The project continues...

1st issue - Cannot find all of the parts needed for a R50 to e620 conversion . Looks like places that carry R50 stuff do not carry e620 parts at all. Can someone PM me with appropriate e620 specific parts suppliers? Thanks.

Someone had asked me what I use to charge my A123's. I use a Mastech HY5020, and typically charge my Xs2p packs at around 18 amps.

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03-16-2010 08:49 AM  8 years agoPost 7
Hanson

rrNovice

Poland SILESIA

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here:

http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/...&sort=2a&page=1

cost of all parts will be maybe 50-60$ with alu lower frame

you may consider this upgrade for E620.. far better flying with ccpm 140

video of 1st flight: no 3d
http://helihelp.firehost.pl/heli/hanson/e620.wmv


my 14S A123 E620

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03-16-2010 02:21 PM  8 years agoPost 8
concept1

rrKey Veteran

Youngstown, OH

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Hanson,
what motor are you running with the 14s and what is your flight time? I have considered dropping from 15 down to 14s and probably raising my throttle curve

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03-16-2010 04:19 PM  8 years agoPost 9
GimpyGolden

rrNovice

Alliston, Ontario--Canada

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I know Amainhobbies.com has all the needed parts in stock, I just posted all the parts the other day here post#6
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=193742

This will cost you $112 from Amain.

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03-16-2010 04:38 PM  8 years agoPost 10
GimpyGolden

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Alliston, Ontario--Canada

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"here:

http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/...&sort=2a&page=1

cost of all parts will be maybe 50-60$ with alu lower frame

you may consider this upgrade for E620.. far better flying with ccpm 140"

Looks like my list from Infinity-Hobby comes to $91.39 for all the parts needed. How did you get $50-60, is there a discount code or something?

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04-27-2010 09:04 PM  8 years agoPost 11
renwick56

rrNovice

Tampa, Florida

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One Month and a few $$ later.....
I wound up flying with a 12s2p A123 onfiguration. Actually the best A123 configuration was 15s1p, powering a Scorpion 4025-740. However only 4-5 goood minutes of flying. On 10s2p with the Ripper OBL 49/08 with a 9 tooth pinion, gave me nearly 12 minutes of hovering, but with a governer mode around 80%, I was seeing <1800 RPM headspeed.

Now with the addition of a 2s2p pack in series (see photo), I am eating up about 3ah in 10 minutes, maintaining a headspeed of around 1930, throughout the flight envelope (I picked up FFF this weekend yeah!)

I am carrying around 4 lbs of batteries, however I recharge in ~10 minutes with my Mastek

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04-27-2010 09:58 PM  8 years agoPost 12
litespeed600

rrKey Veteran

St. Charles, Missouri

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You can safely drain 4 amps out of those packs, heck I even drained 4 1/2 afew times on accident. I did for years and never a problem. I made a 9s4p for my sons 24 volt scooter out of those packs and sold almost 100 cells and they still charge and discharge perfect. Takes about 1 hour on my TP1010 and he can ride it for about 1 hour straight at speeds of 25 mph. That's a 135 lbs 14 yr old.

It will do 20 with my 220 lbs on it.

I switched to lipo's cause I could buy them cheaper than the a123's.

Enjoy the flights. FFF is super fast with that extra weight, I could beat most planes on circuits.

Tom

Married with 2 kids, I am no stranger to pain!

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04-28-2010 03:46 AM  8 years agoPost 13
renwick56

rrNovice

Tampa, Florida

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Hey Tom -

You are absolutely correct about the A123's. I love them, and I like to use them every where that I can . Nevertheless, I too have begun switching to lipo's. The price of A123's have gone up, and the price of lipoly's (from Hong Kong) has dropped tremendously.

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04-28-2010 11:06 AM  8 years agoPost 14
Ben-T-Spindle

rrProfessor

Central Illinois

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I use to fly A123 but they have priced themselves out of the hobby market. I now use Turnigy LiPo that have a much better power to weight ratio, lower cost, and a high charge rate. LiPo technology keeps getting better and A1234 has stayed the same.

... BTS

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04-29-2010 01:57 PM  8 years agoPost 15
renwick56

rrNovice

Tampa, Florida

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I did the same...
I have also moved to Turnigy lipo's. However I am still using 2s1p a123 packs for my flight packs. I can depend that even under the extreme load from a heli flight system, an a123 flight pack will continue to put out 6.6 volts. The load on the pack would have to exceed 40 amps before the voltage would drop. And even then it would be no less than 5.7 volts.

If only they were twice the capacity or twice the voltage....

ttyl,
Ren

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