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Home✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-Electric General Discussion › 14+ Minute eRaptor 90 flight
02-28-2010 04:58 PM  10 years ago
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"Cam"

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UK

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14+ Minute eRaptor 90 flight
With practicing for my B test I've been changing the setup on my EMax to be better for hovering and flat circuits.

I've gone down to an 11T pinion, glass/carbon blades (680's) and 54% Throttle flatline on the Tx (really 65% of full throttle at the ESC) and also fitted the blue dampers.

14 & 1/2 minutes before my hands had had enough of the cold! - The LVC didn't even cut-in!

That was on a 12S 5000 pack that's over a year old.
DSX9
EMax V2
http://runryder.com/helicopter/gallery/37491/
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02-28-2010 09:47 PM  10 years ago
misskimo

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Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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hey, be carefull with low gov, it will swell up packs
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03-04-2010 10:00 PM  10 years ago
"Cam"

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UK

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All the cells were at 3.7 Volts afterwards at rest.DSX9
EMax V2
http://runryder.com/helicopter/gallery/37491/
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03-04-2010 10:09 PM  10 years ago
ESWLFSE

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Liberty Hill, TX

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Very interesting. Please accept my apologies if any of these questions are stupid, but I'm an E-beginner with only nitro Raptor experience.

Cam when you say you say you went "down" to an 11 tooth pinion do you mean a numerically lower ratio to maintain headspeed with a lower throttle setting? What approximate headspeed did this result in? What 680s do you fly?

Misskimo how does a low gov setting swell packs?

I'm interested in what you are doing because I am just getting back into the hobby after a short hiatus with an electric that will be here soon. I also prefer to fly in a more scale manner and do not fly 3D. What scares me most about electrics is short flight times.

TIA,

Mike
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03-04-2010 11:29 PM  10 years ago
misskimo

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Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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hey, well I been asking a pile of people about this, TP too! I found a way to heat up packs in low gov, the only way I can explain it is .
an ex , A tip that includes 2 9 volt batteries for hand warmers. in Alaska , its a good thang! just plug in 2 9 volt batteries and wait a few seconds they will heat up. once they get good a warm, unplug, they hold the heat a good long time.
so the only way I can see it is a backup of juice, like with TP gen 1 5S4p , swelled up a few of those in low gov that I couldnt explain! 1Ps came out! few of those in a low gov setting , poof! it just seams like in low gov it backs up the ions to create heat!

T
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03-05-2010 07:54 PM  10 years ago
nzreg

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Christchurch Canterbury New Zealand

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In anticipation of fitting my E-620 Raptor to a scale fuse I strapped on an extra battery and flew for 14 minutes 45 seconds, very pleased, my setup follows.
E-Raptor 620
600kv motor
9 tooth pinion
Throttle curve flat lined at 80 %
Kontronic jazz 55-10-32 ESC
10s 2p a123 battery
620 blades.
I expect to achieve around 11 to 12 minutes scale flying with the fuse on.
Trust this helps someone.
Reg
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03-05-2010 08:07 PM  10 years ago
MrMel

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Gotland

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hey, well I been asking a pile of people about this, TP too! I found a way to heat up packs in low gov, the only way I can explain it is .
an ex , A tip that includes 2 9 volt batteries for hand warmers. in Alaska , its a good thang! just plug in 2 9 volt batteries and wait a few seconds they will heat up. once they get good a warm, unplug, they hold the heat a good long time.
so the only way I can see it is a backup of juice, like with TP gen 1 5S4p , swelled up a few of those in low gov that I couldnt explain! 1Ps came out! few of those in a low gov setting , poof! it just seams like in low gov it backs up the ions to create heat!
I can explain it, Microbursts.

Even if dataloggers can't record them, they are there, ESC pulsing several thousands of times per second, at low Gov you get more microbursts (and higher) than with high throttle %

We are talking 200-300+ amps peaks on machines that "cannot" peak more then 100A with a data logger.

Dataloggers record 10samples per second, which isnt near enough to catch a microburst, but you can test it on the bench to see them with lab grade equipment.
Gone fishing..or hunting..or something
My site: http://heli.dacsa.net - VBar videos and more
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03-05-2010 11:30 PM  10 years ago
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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I'm going to go with green Gamma radiation, it'll swell a human up to unbelievably large sizes!If you skip me I can't play!
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03-06-2010 12:25 AM  10 years ago
misskimo

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Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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hey, Yeeh! Mel! I know its there, my way of dealing with it was to run 85% for the first 2 to 3 min, then low gov it for a min or 2, open it back up ( kinda like a motor boat motor from back in the day) " blow it out" for 2 min and low gov again for a min and land.
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03-06-2010 11:40 AM  10 years ago
"Cam"

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UK

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ESWLFSE
I went “down” from a 12T pinion to an 11T. This unloads the motor, battery and means the gov doesn’t have to work as hard. Also the shorter heavier blades mean the gov is also having an easier time.

I’m using a Kontronik JIVE which normally spools the blades down over 30 seconds when the battery’s low on voltage. I can imagine that running a pack hard loads the cells more so you have a greater voltage drop, and also the when you unload the pack again after the LVC has cut-in, the recovery voltage is higher. Running packs gently will mean the energy in the battery is a much closer reflection of the voltage under load. Where, when running the packs hard there’s really a lot more capacity left than the voltage would suggest – so the LVC cuts-in sooner. Running the packs gently the LVC will cut-in much, much later and closer to when the pack is actually fully discharged.

misskimo
so the only way I can see it is a backup of juice, like with TP gen 1 5S4p , swelled up a few of those in low gov that I couldn’t explain! 1Ps came out! few of those in a low gov setting , poof! it just seams like in low gov it backs up the ions to create heat!
To get the same power when the battery voltage is low (after a long hover) the ESC has to pull more current. Moving electrons are what heat’s up the battery.

My old packs were barely warm after those 14+ minute hovers.

•MrMel
The “microbursts” thing might be transient voltages that draw very high currents – but this will be for incredibly short amounts of time.

Of course, I'd expect I could get even more runtime with a more efficient Kontronik motor, and by running the gov as close to 100% as comfortable and using the smallest pinion possible. But then that’s into the realms of gear meshing and what’s practical for the power wanted. I can go to a 10T pinion, but a 9T would need a new 5mm motor shaft and I doubt neither the 9T or the thinner shaft will transmit the power without something failing!
DSX9
EMax V2
http://runryder.com/helicopter/gallery/37491/
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03-07-2010 12:38 PM  10 years ago
MrMel

rrProfessor

Gotland

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•MrMel
The “microbursts” thing might be transient voltages that draw very high currents – but this will be for incredibly short amounts of time.
Yes, they are short, but how does it affect battery life?
I actually contacted factories (via some sources in HK), because I suspect that microbursts are involved in why does a pack last 300cycles for one person, where as other die after 20 in the "same size application".

It could be those microburst's, at least its a logical guess.
Specially when you weigh in the fact the Plane people make sure their prop size/esc etc is up to running 100%, that's their "setup", and their packs last often longer.

Problem is, the factories doesn't know for sure either, we (hobby people) are the testing ground for packs and new chemistry, so there is no firm facts.
The only thing they do know, running at max all the time hurt packs (EDF's are pack eaters)

Sorry to get a bit sidetracked...
Gone fishing..or hunting..or something
My site: http://heli.dacsa.net - VBar videos and more
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03-07-2010 01:25 PM  10 years ago
nivlek

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Norfolk England

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I'm wondering if shorter battery/esc input leads (lower inductance) and bigger input capacitors would help the battery out in this sort of situation .
Fitting some caps closer to the battery might help as well .
At the end of the day , it gets dark .
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03-07-2010 06:25 PM  10 years ago
Busher

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Manchester, England

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I was thinking along larger input capacitors, these would help with micro bursts if they are causing the problems.
However why bother if the setup is staying cool and giving good flight time.
Good luck
Busher
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