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HomeAircraftHelicopterComputer Flight SimulatorsPhoenix › How to do Piro tic tocs --- Phoenix 2.5
01-13-2010 01:44 PM  8 years agoPost 21
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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I am having a really difficult time "stiring" the sticks. How are you guys initializing it. Do you correspond one part of the circle with one part of the heli? For example, on jags piros I noticed that when he thrusted the heli backwards the tail was down when he gave back elevator to get it going the other way, and opposite on the other side of the rainbow. Whats the trick?

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01-13-2010 02:25 PM  8 years agoPost 22
Jag72

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South of Boston

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Rogman...
I can stir the sticks all day long for regular piro flips...but even I cannot fully figure out the stir method for piro rainbows and piro tic tocs...

SO with that being said...I found it easier to input corrections at one or 2 points in the rotation until you fully understand the move and eventually the "Stir" will become natural...

That's basically how I learned regular piro flips as well...I stirred wildly ...and eventually you will pick up the timing and proper stir rate etc...to get it perfect..

it's really hard to stir when the heli is knife edge though as it doesn't leave alot of room for error...so I say try doing it the way I do it first..onve you master the move and you start to "recognize" what theheli is doing at all times you will then eventually learn the "stir"

I always give an elevator back input when the heli is tail down and i'm in the positive collective...and I always give elevator forward when i'm into the negative pitch and pushing theheli away from me..

that's just how I do it though

Anthony

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01-13-2010 10:33 PM  8 years agoPost 23
Wimbledon99

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UK

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Just had a look at the videos - has anyone got an aspirin?

Made me dizzy

Nice Flying Gents

3D?? No - just another input error!!!

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01-14-2010 02:04 AM  8 years agoPost 24
Al Austria

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Gainesville, FL

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Here is one of my better attempts of a "Chris Harmon Style" piro tic-toc, starting around 0:48:

Watch at YouTube

And another one starting around 1:17:

Watch at YouTube

Sorry, no stick movements but, being able to break down the maneuver and its stick movements mentally will put you at a great advantage.

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01-14-2010 10:25 PM  8 years agoPost 25
raynman

rrKey Veteran

Lyall Bay - Wgtn - N.Z

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I found this move to be easy - especially if you are comftable with piro flips!

It seems the stick movements are the same - Just dont flip the heli over complete! Quater flips seem to work so you can get the angle of the blade in a postion to tic toc back and fowards.

Just my 2cents.

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01-15-2010 02:15 AM  8 years agoPost 26
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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Alan, that's some incredible flying.

Are any of you guys using a cyclic ring on your TX (i.e. a little round plastic thing that glues in place) in order to be able to "stir the sticks" real fast.

Copternut: Looks like you're flying a Fury 55.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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01-15-2010 08:19 AM  8 years agoPost 27
MrMel

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Gotland

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Are any of you guys using a cyclic ring on your TX (i.e. a little round plastic thing that glues in place) in order to be able to "stir the sticks" real fast.
You will find out that your are not that far off from center, so the cyclic ring isn't really limiting anything, it was used to prevent binding in the corners on Raptors etc.
(now built into many radios programming wise)

But for "stir" moves, they wont help as your stirring just a few mm from center.

Gone fishing..or hunting..or something
My site: http://heli.dacsa.net - VBar videos and more

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01-15-2010 01:40 PM  8 years agoPost 28
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Plano, Texas

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(now built into many radios programming wise)
Despite electronic limiting which prevents actual binding of the swash, the gymbals are still rectangular. I find this an issue when I'm trying to do piro flips and I want to stir the sticks fast. The stick then goes "bump bump bump" on the corners of the gymbal.

So to do this move you're not stirring the cyclic stick way out at the ends of the gymbal? Maybe the secret is not to give as much control input? I find it really hard to give consistent cyclic inputs without rubbing the stick on the sides of the gymbal.

Avant RC
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Thunder Power RC
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01-15-2010 01:43 PM  8 years agoPost 29
MrMel

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Gotland

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Yep, most common "mistake" when doing piroflips is that you move the stick too much, I'm no-where near the corners.

Gone fishing..or hunting..or something
My site: http://heli.dacsa.net - VBar videos and more

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01-15-2010 02:13 PM  8 years agoPost 30
Jag72

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South of Boston

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Piro tic tocs..
1st of all KIller flying as usual Alan...

secondly..I am very comfortable with piro flips and understand that this is basically an off axis piro flip...BUT...trying to tell your fingers and brain to understand that is something I haven't mastered yet

so I obviously have come up with my own way of doing it

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01-15-2010 08:30 PM  8 years agoPost 31
Bundian

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Fort Lauderdale, FL USA

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I can stir the sticks all day long for regular piro flips...but even I cannot fully figure out the stir method for piro rainbows and piro tic tocs...
Jag basically you do a smaller circle, and you correct to both left and right as it starts to go...hmmm it might not make any sense, but try to do the small circles first and you will see right away what i'm talkin about and you will know how to correct it during stirring, basically it will become a bit like an elliptic shape.

Also you can do it in a way as Al is doing it right before he starts the piro on the first video around 46 seconds, you can make it piro constantly that way too, in that case you do kind of a diamond shape with the stick instead of stirring and you correct at each corner of the diamond ( i hope i'm making sense )

I know I've promised the videos but I reinstalled my computer and I haven't put fraps back up to capture it

However since you're using Phoenix just find me online my session is called Florida Heli Fun or pm me an we set a time to meet online and I'll show you what i mean

Andrew

Fly it like you stole it!!!

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01-18-2010 05:42 PM  8 years agoPost 32
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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I wish I had someone on real flight 5 to help me with this...

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01-18-2010 06:58 PM  8 years agoPost 33
Jag72

rrProfessor

South of Boston

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piro stuff
Well...I tried slowing the sim down and still couldn't quite figure out the Stir

but I did make this one with my cheating method

this is with the Sim running at 1/2 speed(which I thought actually made it harder )

Watch at YouTube

piro funnels with reversals--

Watch at YouTube

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01-19-2010 12:19 AM  8 years agoPost 34
darksidedave

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niles,MI

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How do you get the recording off Phoenix and onto Utube?
Thanks..

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01-19-2010 02:22 PM  8 years agoPost 35
Jag72

rrProfessor

South of Boston

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Fraps...
you just use fraps to capture the flight into a video format...then load it onto youtube...

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01-19-2010 03:01 PM  8 years agoPost 36
Bundian

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Fort Lauderdale, FL USA

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Nice vids Jag, again, I take a complete different approach on the piro funnels ( I really need to install fraps now).

Is anyone doing piro globes??? I've figured them out but I would love to see other people doing it, not sure if my way is the correct one

Fly it like you stole it!!!

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01-19-2010 03:10 PM  8 years agoPost 37
Jag72

rrProfessor

South of Boston

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Piro funnels
As you can see I "cheat" on the piro funnels as well....Under the recommendation of my good buddy MrMel...I have started to concentrate on really learning the Stir for piro funnels...and I am Happy to say that I am very close to figuring out the stir for the piro funnels...and to be honest with you...it's MUCH better andm ore controlled that way..

I am starting to see that EVERYTHING piro related seems to involve the "Stir"...LOL..

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01-19-2010 04:29 PM  8 years agoPost 38
Bundian

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Fort Lauderdale, FL USA

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I am starting to see that EVERYTHING piro related seems to involve the "Stir"...LOL..

That's soo true, honestly I've tried your way just for the heck of it, but couldn't get anywhere, with the stir it's a lot less effort once you figure it out, much easier to time than the way you're doing it.

Fly it like you stole it!!!

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01-28-2010 04:45 PM  8 years agoPost 39
Rogman88

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West Monroe, LA

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I figured out where I was doing wrong!
What I was trying to do was consecutive piro flips but what was happening was that I was getting off axis ever so slightly and losing orientation/altitude. I've started pausing the "stir" when the heli is inverted or upright just enough to correct the collective/plane of the disc and now and getting the hang of "stirring". One day I hope to be able to grasp the off axis stirring required for piro tic tocs.

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02-18-2010 05:42 AM  8 years agoPost 40
Al Austria

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Gainesville, FL

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Here is a little stick cam action of a piro tic toc. I've never seen my fingers before so I thought this was pretty cool.

Watch at YouTube

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