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› Factory Electric 700
04-27-2010 06:16 PM  8 years agoPost 161
jphilli

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Atlanta, Ga.

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FYI the K brand Jive was also used in testing. They suffered from overamp cutoff at around 80 amps in governor mode, even though the one used was rated for up to 120 amps.
That doesn't sound right to me at all. I've logged my 120+ HV at over 120 amps and it comes down cool every time. The 100LV I have has seen over 120 amps as well and has never shut down.

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04-27-2010 06:36 PM  8 years agoPost 162
Ray Nemovi

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SAN DIEGO CA

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The Ice 160HV survives everything.

Ray N.

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04-27-2010 07:27 PM  8 years agoPost 163
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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What was the gove percentage? It should be at atleast 85% to be happy in high power situations.

I found that keeping the ESC cool is very important with the Jives. I got my Jive 80 HV to work quite well on 6s on my TREX 600 by making sure the gear ratio allows me to run at 85% or greater and be at my desired RPM. Im added a fan to the heat sink just to make sure everyting stays cool since its about to get really hot in florida

C

Xera Motors
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04-27-2010 07:52 PM  8 years agoPost 164
steph280

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Irvine, California

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The T-Rex 700E manual says to run the Jive at Mode 10 "KSA Mode" to prevent it from overamp cutoff. Mode 4 will trip the overamp cut off if pitch exceeds 12 degrees on this heli.

6s at 80amps compared to 12s at 80amps is 1900watts vs 3800 watts. Pretty big jump. What I learned is that what works on my 600 will not necessarily be the same on a 700.

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04-27-2010 09:16 PM  8 years agoPost 165
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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Well the 80HV is the same ESC I used on my 12 TREX 700 E... I run mine in mode 4 and have never had a thermal issue...then again Im not A.S. If your motor is shutting down a Jive 120 then the motor you guys have needs a little work or something is very wrong. What are the specs on the motor and has it been compared to others like the Xera, Pyro, Neu....

Just so you know Im pulling close to 200A peaks on my T600E depending on what I do.

Ive found if you can get the heat out the ESC keeps going and going.

C

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04-27-2010 09:53 PM  8 years agoPost 166
jphilli

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Atlanta, Ga.

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Sounds like the guys at align don't know jack about a Jive or are intentionally trying to discredit it. Or like Carlo implied, the motor they were using is garbage. Mine handles over 5000 watts on mode 4 and barely gets warm. To claim that the Jive 120+HV can't handle more than 3800 watts is 100% false.

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04-27-2010 09:58 PM  8 years agoPost 167
misskimo

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Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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Yeh! they dont know crap about electrics or motors, they design it the worse way , the trex 600 for ex when it came out, more escs blew in a year than any other ever

T

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04-27-2010 10:02 PM  8 years agoPost 168
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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Hello

Agreed.

I ran about 13.5 deg of pitch on my fbl 700 E and after the flight the xera and the ESC were bairly warm. I could go absolutly bonkers on the machine with no issues at all and no bogging at all.

There must be an issue.

C

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04-27-2010 10:03 PM  8 years agoPost 169
steph280

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Irvine, California

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Chill guys, I am just passing along information. I don't even own a Jive, yet.

By the way nowhere did I say Jive can't handle 3800 watts. I just said, the manual states you need to run in KSA Mode with this motor. Running on mode 4 will trigger cut off when blade pitch exceeds 12.

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04-27-2010 10:16 PM  8 years agoPost 170
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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KSA = Kontronik Special Application mode...ie to be run on certain motors like the Hacker Turbine motors. Page 20.

http://www.kontronik.com/images/sto..._2009_10_14.pdf

The align motor is your typical machine wound outrunner like the scorpion...well thats my guess. No special mode is required to run that motor.

If the ESC is cutting out at 12 deg of pitch then SOMETHING IS WRONG ON ALIGNS PART. The quesiton still remains, what is the throttle setting that the test pilots are using?

Xera Motors
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04-27-2010 10:43 PM  8 years agoPost 171
steph280

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Irvine, California

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Carlo, there is no need to prove or disprove anything here. We all know Kontronik have been doing this for a long time and they make excellent stuff. The message about running it on KSA mode is just a friendly reminder for those who chose to run Jive with this heli. To end up with a crash heli as result of cutoff would just suck, regardless of whose fault it is.

And when you say "No special mode is required to run that motor." is just being stubborn. You haven't tried this motor yet so how would you know? So what if the fault was Align's motor? The point they are trying to get across is crash prevention as result of ESC cut off when using this motor, not blaming Kontronik nor anybody else.

If you really want to find out what the test setup was and what throttle setting was used, you might want to check with Alan Szabo since I read he did most of the tests. But why bother, you think Align stuff are crap anyway.

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04-27-2010 10:52 PM  8 years agoPost 172
Eco8gator

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Palm Beach, FL

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Ill see for myself when my LHS gets one of these because I know there are a couple guys getting them locally.

I will personally make sure we take measurements on these motors and put up the results. If this motor is anything like the new Align outrunner it isnt anything special. Besides mass production does exactily lead a mfg to include a motor with some sort of crazy winding technique.

The bottom line is if Align is blowing up Jives in mode 4 then something is wrong.

And on another note, why the heck did Align not put an adjustable gear mesh option on this heli...

The last 3 helis Ive owned are Align. I fly a TREX 600 right now...well part of it is a TREX with a bunch of crazy upgrade that make it fly the way I want. I dont think they are crap, I just dont like crap information from respected Align sources.

C

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04-28-2010 02:26 AM  8 years agoPost 173
Chuck Bole

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Tulsa Ok. U.S.A.

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Shouldn't be too big a deal to make it adjustable. Why it's not is a different story. I'd like to try one out too..
I'll use my own power system thank you..
chuck

Team Synergy Field Representative / Thunder Power

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04-28-2010 03:05 AM  8 years agoPost 174
jphilli

rrKey Veteran

Atlanta, Ga.

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One thing I'd like to point out though is that although the 700E Alan was flying at Huntsville was fast and looked to fly great, it had some nasty gear noise going on. I'm interested to know if anyone else is seeing this with their kits.

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04-28-2010 08:45 PM  8 years agoPost 175
scott s.

rrElite Veteran

Orange, Ca.

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My opinion
Align seems to think the customer is dumb and can`t adjust a gear mesh so they make it fixed(I.E. 700N and 700E )

I`ve also heard that you can`t just buy a kit anymore, it will come with their servos, gyro, and electric motor no matter what kit you buy in any size.

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04-28-2010 09:06 PM  8 years agoPost 176
Mike Fortin

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Actually Align is now offering LE's without electronics.

If you heard any gear noise, it's due to the large Mod 1 gears which do make significantly more noise then stock gears.

Have Rotors, Will Fly!

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04-28-2010 09:39 PM  8 years agoPost 177
misskimo

rrElite Veteran

Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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naw! its something else like the material being used, like the rappy electric, man does it make some noise, A good nylon gear like MA gear , the noise if half is loud.

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04-28-2010 09:43 PM  8 years agoPost 178
Ray Nemovi

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SAN DIEGO CA

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Damn, the mod .7 gear works great for me with no noise.

Ray N.

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04-28-2010 09:56 PM  8 years agoPost 179
ChuckJrster

rrVeteran

West Monroe, LA - USA

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Yep, I've been using the stock gear with no problems as well.

Team Pilot for RCHeliWorkz

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04-29-2010 05:39 AM  8 years agoPost 180
Band1086

rrElite Veteran

Kennewick, Wa. USA

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I'm running a mod 1 gear with an MA pinion, and they are smooth and quiet. I also have an Ion and an Ion X2, their gear noise is significantly louder than my 700E with about the same amount of backlash.

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