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HomeAircraftHelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsOther › Is it worth it?
10-23-2009 12:47 PM  8 years agoPost 81
Jeff polisena

rrElite Veteran

westpalmbeachflorida usa

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Go getem Ron

I stole it ,flew it and gave it back ;)

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10-23-2009 03:11 PM  8 years agoPost 82
Chris Bergen

rrElite Veteran

cassopolis, MI USA

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Unless you've actually flown a well setup FBL system, you would not understand. I've flown both ways, and I can guarantee anyone that has at least tried a well setup system, would NEVER consider going without one, period.
I'm sorry, but I can make the SAME argument!!

Unless you have flown with a PROPER and WELL setup FBL W/O Electronics, You would not understand.

Maybe I'm being a little argumentative here, but you are making a BLANK statement without trying ALL the possibilities.

YOU haven't flown MY Gasser, nor Heli-cuz's helicopter, so MAYBE you will be surprised at the difference.

Open your minds to the possibility!!

Chris D. Bergen

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10-23-2009 03:18 PM  8 years agoPost 83
Jeff polisena

rrElite Veteran

westpalmbeachflorida usa

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I have to agree with both sides I think we are looking at two totally different ways of flying FBL . If you do a tic toc or a piro flip with a properly set up mechanical FBL it is not the same as doing a tic toc or piro flip with a properly set up electronic FBL . Yes both will do some tricks the same I think the argument is vague .The only way to settle is VIDEOS

I stole it ,flew it and gave it back ;)

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10-23-2009 03:40 PM  8 years agoPost 84
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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Videos may show both types DOING those manuevres, but will it show the ease, or the work that it may take to accomplish the manuevre?

Only fingers on sticks can tell that.

I've been argued to about the benefits of CCPM for years, over my single servo setup. When I bring up the point about interactions, and how it CAN input movements to the controls, I've been told guys just FLY through it in most cases. OK, that tells me they are FLYING the helicopter, making whatever stick inputs are needed to fly the helicopter.

By saying that I tend to push slightly forward on the stick, and I do mean slightly, just adding a little pressure on the stick, that means I am flying the helicopter, making whatever inputs are necessary to tell the helicopter what "I" want it to do.

What I DON'T want is a gyro making inputs that I can "feel" or see in the helicopter, which was the case on the few systems that I have tried and flown. And is why I don't like CCPM, I can FEEL the interactions. Maybe not all of electronic FBL systems are like this, maybe it was the setup, and if it's totally invisible to the feel of the heli, I might be more convinced. And maybe I would just get used to it, just like you get used to the HH tail gyros...

I'm open to the possibility that it may be better with electronics, but I haven't felt it yet.

Chris D. Bergen

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10-23-2009 04:29 PM  8 years agoPost 85
Jeff polisena

rrElite Veteran

westpalmbeachflorida usa

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I would say you haven't flown a properly set up FBL . If correct you dont have any feeling of loss of control and that tingly drop in stomach oh **** feeling . I dont like that either and I have to tell you it does take some work to get rite just as (mechanical) MFBL.I just dont think I could fly as hard as I do with (mechanical) MFBL when I had MFBL heli I flew like crap so would not know what to expect now .You fly mine and I fly yours will only tell

I stole it ,flew it and gave it back ;)

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10-23-2009 04:51 PM  8 years agoPost 86
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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DEAL!!

Now I just have to figure out when I can get to Florida...

Mulberry is comng up pretty quick, I'll see what I can do.

Chris D. Bergen

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10-23-2009 05:02 PM  8 years agoPost 87
Jeff polisena

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westpalmbeachflorida usa

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I would like to make it also went before and had great time

I stole it ,flew it and gave it back ;)

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10-23-2009 08:37 PM  8 years agoPost 88
Al Austria

rrElite Veteran

Gainesville, FL

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I'm sorry, but I can make the SAME argument!!

Unless you have flown with a PROPER and WELL setup FBL W/O Electronics, You would not understand.

Maybe I'm being a little argumentative here, but you are making a BLANK statement without trying ALL the possibilities.
Chris, you are beating a dead horse. For the record, the best naked FBL setup Ive flown was in fact very flyable, I could actually do FFF all the way up to pirouetting tic-tics. But the fact still stands, the machine I flew did NOT exhibit any flying characteristics that could deem it as preferable over even a standard flybarred setup, other than a slight increase in power.

Fly what you like. I'd much rather fly a helicopter that does not pitch up into a loop BY ITSELF and will actually hold it's attitude.

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10-23-2009 08:49 PM  8 years agoPost 89
BobOD

rrElite Veteran

New York- USA

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Try the GyroBot

Hey Chris,

I'll send you a GyroBot 700 system to try if you will post the results. This is the same offer I made to ErichF who reported his results over on HF. I can send the unit out to you tomorrow. Just let me know.

BTW, I'm not trying to sway anyone in any direction. Just trying to add to the overall knowledge base.

Danny
I'll take one.

Team POP Secret

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10-23-2009 09:13 PM  8 years agoPost 90
Chris Bergen

rrElite Veteran

cassopolis, MI USA

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Chris, you are beating a dead horse
Nah, I don't believe that.

The question asked here, "is it worth it?"

YOUR opinion based on YOUR experience, Yes.

MY opinion based on MY experience, No.

It's your blanket statement that presents the difficulty.

But, you guys are right. Fly what YOU like and enjoy it. I will continue to promote FBL noe as an alternative to an expensive electronic addition that MAY not be necessary.

The beauty of it is, you can try your heli without electronics, if you don't like it, THEN you can always buy and add the electronics to it later!!

Chris D. Bergen

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10-23-2009 11:41 PM  8 years agoPost 91
Jeff polisena

rrElite Veteran

westpalmbeachflorida usa

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YOUR opinion based on YOUR experience, Yes.

MY opinion based on MY experience, No.
OK so why cant you accept our opinions ? Now I know why you have been pinked 14 times almost 15 You are not going to get the yes your rite so horse is dead

I stole it ,flew it and gave it back ;)

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10-23-2009 11:59 PM  8 years agoPost 92
Wimbledon99

rrVeteran

UK

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The beauty of it is, you can try your heli without electronics, if you don't like it, THEN you can always buy and add the electronics to it later!!
I went straight for the vBar. Figured it was almost the cost of the repair without it

Can't we all just accept we are all individuals with our own preferences and leave it at that?

The fields would be boring if we all turned up with the same thing!

Is it worth it? ...... How long is a piece of string?

3D?? No - just another input error!!!

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10-24-2009 12:36 AM  8 years agoPost 93
wgeorge111

rrApprentice

West Palm Beach, Fl

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All I have to say to this post is I like flybarless. I do not think it is worth it on anything smaller than a 50 size or 600E size(my personal opinon from experience). If you really want to know "IS IT WORTH IT" go ahead and get a flybarless system and quit listening to all the bashers on this post and you will find out for yourself. You know what they say, "ONCE YOU GO FLYBARLESS YOU WON'T GO BACK!!!!"

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10-24-2009 12:39 AM  8 years agoPost 94
BobOD

rrElite Veteran

New York- USA

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One thing I think a lot of people here are missing is that the success without stabilization is more likely with a machine that is precision built. I would not expect someone to have as good a result with, oh say, a Trex 6/700 as Chris would with his Bergen. The gyro can help hide a little.

Having said that, apples to apples, superior mechanics AND a good gyro produce the best result. That's just my opinion of course...nothing more. My main reason is that I hate when the heli does anything different than I command it to. It may also be that I tend to like smaller birds as large flying sites are scarce in my parts. Gyros can do wonders on a 500 class but the mechanics on these small machines often have too much play to get all you can of it. Of course, I don't have that problem.

Team POP Secret

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10-24-2009 12:51 AM  8 years agoPost 95
wgeorge111

rrApprentice

West Palm Beach, Fl

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I would not make a blade 400 flybarless. I started with a blade 400 and it served its purpose and then I sold it. Once you fly a T-Rex 500 or bigger and better you will understand what I mean.

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10-24-2009 02:47 AM  8 years agoPost 96
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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I like the V-bar because my helicopter now flies precise like a pattern airplane. The only difference is that now I don't need a strip to land. I can just hover and land right in front of me.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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10-24-2009 03:35 AM  8 years agoPost 97
Ronald Thomas

rrMaster

Gainesville, Fl, USA

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My main reason is that I hate when the heli does anything different than I command it to.
That is the beauty of a 3 Axis system, that is exactly what it will do no matter what the size of the heli

Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!

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10-24-2009 04:26 AM  8 years agoPost 98
BobOD

rrElite Veteran

New York- USA

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I would not make a blade 400 flybarless.
I would, I'd use a baseball bat to remove it.
Sorry, I just couldn't resist.

Team POP Secret

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10-24-2009 02:02 PM  8 years agoPost 99
heli-cuzz

rrElite Veteran

Pittston, Pa. USA

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Cuzz

The next time you go out to fly, try these things: (and bring a camera )

(1) FFF into the wind.
(2) A full loop
(3) 4 point barrel rolls
(4) Fast backwards flying

Then if you ever come to FL. I will let you fly my Logo with stabilization, then you will be able to tell the difference.......Ron
LoL

I'll give it a go and post my results via youtube.
I never said I or anyone wouldn't feel the difference.
I'm sure its night and day between naked vs. covered up.
I'll take you up on the try a Logo 4 a flite with stab unit. Got a place in Vero. When I can make it down, I'll let ya know.

~Brian~

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10-24-2009 02:11 PM  8 years agoPost 100
ady

rrKey Veteran

norfolk england

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i fly a FBL no electronics , rex 600 , i also fly someones else`s v-bar with top of the range every thing fitted , mine does lots but is a nightmare ( but fun for me) to fly , and the v-bar one does it all the same but easier in mega winds , asap i`ll go v-bar or align FBL , like others have said , fun is the word , and at present i`m nearly killing it every few seconds , but thats fine by me for now , but after flying the v-bar , life would be easier , but can be set up to be just as much fun

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HomeAircraftHelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsOther › Is it worth it?
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