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Blade CP Pro › Medusa out of business?? What about our tail motors???
04-07-2010 09:24 AM  8 years agoPost 121
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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Hi tutelar
Great to see you here again! I have not been following this thread or I would have kept you updated about this tail motor. zguy has been testing (and I mean TESTING) his Hyperion for nearly 4 months now. He had good results with his set-up until about 2 weeks ago. His Hyperion tail motor failed in flight and he crashed his blade. He will not replace the Hyperion with another Hyperion. He's less impressed now than he was in the beginning of the test. My Hyperion failed months ago and I replaced it with a Tower Hobbies 'ammo' bl inrunner (I believe 4100kv). I like this motor better than the Hyperion but the shaft is about 1 mm too long and should be ground down to avoid being bent in a crash. I believe though that until another motor as good as the discontinued 'Medusa' comes along, the ammo motor might be the next best thing. I'm giving zguy a spare ammo tail motor to test as soon as I see him (maybe this weekend upcoming). Now for the good news: It is rumored that 'Neu Motors' will be repairing 'Medusa' motors and will be coming up with their version of a new bl inrunner tail motor soon. That might rival the now unavailable Medusa.

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04-07-2010 03:28 PM  8 years agoPost 122
ejc347

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Brookville, Ohio USA

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Hey hey. too bad about the hyperions. Sorry i suggested, mine is still working ok tho, but i hate it cause with the prop im using the shaft is too short. Yea i heard about the 12mm Neu motors about a month ago. I even saw a picture and write up, i think it was at Helifreak. Ill see if i can find something. Im about to give up on this thing though. About fed up with it. It now has a BL main and tail, CC tb 9 tail a phoenix 10 main, gy401, autorotation main gear, yeadda yadda yadda and i think it performed better when it was completely stock. Aerobatics are COMPLETLY oout of the question. Any kind of sudden even semi-sudden collective changes and the tail kicks out pretty bad. So when ever you try a flip or roll, u better be ready to battle the tail. So, im still debating on whether i want to get the rz350(park 370 too weak) and the new 12mm from neu as well as a better radio (flying with the stocker, might be part of the problem) and see if i can get this thing solid, or give up.

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04-07-2010 11:15 PM  8 years agoPost 123
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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Somethings wrong ejc.... The stuff you have on that bird is good stuff and flips and rolls should not affect the tail. Is the gyro gain adjusted to the max?

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04-08-2010 12:15 AM  8 years agoPost 124
tutelar-rc

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Nobleton, Ontario - Canada

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Oh well -- serves me right for not asking you first. I kind of thought that since this post was still relatively new (November) that the info was still current.

I have 3 new 5300kV Hyperions. I will report back how well I make out with them (hopefully with some video). I may get lucky, similar to my success with that other BL motor.

At least, I will get some personal experience with some higher kV motors to determine what I want to purchase next time.

BTW, I have attached the link for the Hyperion BL motor performance data - shows why 4100kV is recommended (only motor recommended for use outside of a ducted fan).
http://media.hyperion.hk/dn/motor/y12/Y12LTestData.pdf

Happy Flying!

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04-08-2010 01:09 AM  8 years agoPost 125
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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Well we can at least rest assured that if you test the 5300 kv motor, we'll all get an accurate report. My guess all along has been that the higher kv tail motor might take too long to get up to speed and also that it might not have the torque of the 4100 kv motor. The shaft on the Hyperion is quite short and you may want to use it as a 'pusher' instead of a 'puller'. If I recall, that was the way you set yours up anyway. Can't wait to hear the results of your tests.

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04-08-2010 03:59 PM  8 years agoPost 126
ejc347

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Brookville, Ohio USA

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Hey bob, no matter where the delay and limit are on the gyro, no help. Im using the xtra 5th channel on the stock radio for the gain. I plug in the battery with the gain all the way up so it goes to HH mode. Then i take off a few times and flip the tail and i keep turning down the gain until the tail wag stops. I usually end up with the knob somewhere in the 55-60% range. Now like this it will hold its tail pretty well when its calm and im just hovering, but when i give it fast bounce in the air the tail kicks out everytime. Its like the speed cntrler/gyro are too slow to keep up. So, when i go into a flip, first positive pitch to start the roll, kicks tail out, after upside down, alot of negative pitch kicks tail out again. At this point im usually freakin cause its hard for me to keep orientation of this little bugger with it kickin its tail everywhere. Yea, its probably me. I saw buildems or deisel racers, forgot which, and mine flys NOTHIN like this. Ill probably be getting a DX7, different tail prop, and neu motors and see what happens. Even if it gets no better than it is right now, its still fun to dart around when i get bored, little thing is pretty fast with a 2300 head speed. I just wont try anything crazy.

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04-10-2010 05:23 AM  8 years agoPost 127
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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ejc could you let us know what main motor you have and what pinion you are running? I like to have my gain turned up pretty high like 80% to 90%. I prefer some wag if the tail holds to no wag and a loose tail. Also the pitch range you are running could be affecting the way the tail holds. Too much pitch with too low a headspeed could be a factor as well. There is probably an answer to why the tail won't hold. You need a good battery at least 900-1200 mAh at around 30C. I use 10t pinions on all of my blades. I run 3030 or 3020 props on the tails & the limit and delay turned all the way up.

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04-11-2010 02:38 PM  8 years agoPost 128
tutelar-rc

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Nobleton, Ontario - Canada

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Quick update -- 5300kV is WAAAY too high. Motor overheats with the normal prop and blows the tail out with a small enough prop to prevent overheating.

Interesting that the tail blows out with reduced pitch, not increased pitch. This means that the motor will not slow down fast enough, and putting hard (or soft) brake on the ESC makes no difference.

I guess I will try Bob Who's recommended tail motor now...

Happy Flying!

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04-11-2010 03:09 PM  8 years agoPost 129
BOB WHO?

rrKey Veteran

Downey, Ca.

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Hi tutelar
Since Medusa is out of the RC business, my friend Rob and I are having trouble finding an adequate replacement. I was using a Tower Ammo 12x30 4110kv motor with pretty good luck until the tail shaft (which is too long) bent in a crash. Yesterday I gave Rob one of these Ammo motors (new) that I had as a spare and he's having trouble getting the tail to hold. I am still using one the Feigao tail motors that you recommended several years ago on one of my blades and it still works fine. Now for the good news: Neu Motors is going to introduce a 12x30 inrunner like the Medusa very soon. I understand it may be available within a month or so. It should be as good as the Medusa since it is made by Steve Neu. We'll see.

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04-11-2010 06:46 PM  8 years agoPost 130
ejc347

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Brookville, Ohio USA

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Hey hey. Well, im using the Eflite park 370 with an 8 tooth pinion. My head speed is 1850 on normal and 2300 in idle up. +/- 11 degrees of pitch. Stock cp pro 2 tail rotor (changing to one of your recomendations. Usually yes, at around 55 percent gain, there is a tad bit of wag, and the tail holds in a hover with no breeze, but thats it. Any more gain and as soon as i lift off the tail starts to wag quite bad, usually 90-120 degrees back and forth. I use the stock battery, was using a thunder power 910mah 16c but the balance lead is not safe to use anymore. Its down right now, broken main frame and FINALLY broke a carbon blade. Strong little buggers. But, my plans are to switch to neu motors, rz350 (maybe, might try 10 tooth pinion on eflite 370 first)and the new 12 for the tail. Gonna switch to next size up phoenix for the main (mine has a 10 amp), switch tail rotors, GET A FREAKIN DSM RADIO, still using stock and my other radio is an original 6exa so its about time. Gonna get a couple higher c rating lipos from hobbycity, probably around 1000mah. Also switch out servos for hs65s probably. Just gonna take a while, tryin to get my fiberglass buggy done so im kinda splitting extra funds between that and my copter and planks. Thanks for the help Bob!!

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04-12-2010 03:45 AM  8 years agoPost 131
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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News about Rob's Ammo Bl tail motor and the trouble he was having: it was the prop installed the wrong way. All's well now with that motor and the heli, but he says "it's not a Medusa". So now we wait for the Neu version; the Neu Medusa so to speak.....

ecj first I recommend a good 20-30C battery like the one you mention from HobbyKing. You must have a fresh strong battery to power this system (around 900-1000 mAh). Next use either a 10t or 9t but preferably the 10t pinion. Now get rid of those carbon fiber blades, and use the cheap esky woodies of the Eflite stockers. If your servos work leave them installed. The pitch range is good, I'd leave it alone. Don't worry about the radio yet either or the esc(s) if they work, let's try to get this set-up to fly well and the tail to hold on hard collective moves. Did you mention what gyro you have? I have an old BCPP with the pro2 main motor and gws DD tail motor (both brushed) and a telebee HH gyro with a stock FM radio. Even the tail on this set-up holds just fine on flips and hard collective commands. Do you have a gy401 on this heli? If you do your tail should hold any maneuver. BTW I use either gws 3020 or 3030 props, both work fine on any DD motor even brushed.

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04-12-2010 03:25 PM  8 years agoPost 132
ejc347

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Brookville, Ohio USA

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Yea im using the GY401. Thats why im kinda bummed. Something is wrong or i have something set up wrong. Will the wood blades hold up to 2300 head speed? Will be switching to the woodies and the 10 tooth. For some reason, im thinking my tail motor/prop is the problem. Im gonna keep the hyperion for now and try those 2 props you mentioned. MaN, if i could get this things tail to hold i'd be exstatic. Thnaks again Bob, i'll try these things and let ya know. Happy hoverin'!!

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04-12-2010 03:42 PM  8 years agoPost 133
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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Yes the wood blades with your brushless (or event the Razor bl motor) on a 10t pinion will hold up fine. If any blade is damaged or defective don't use it anyway, but that combo works for me and many other guys. What prop are you using? I mentioned the props that most guys use. If your tail motor is not defective, this combination works.

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05-10-2010 09:37 PM  8 years agoPost 134
tutelar-rc

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Nobleton, Ontario - Canada

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Quick update on my tail motors -- the eFlite dd tail rotor for Blade CP Pro 2 (EFLH1324) provides acceptable performance with my high kV tail motor. Setting up the gyro was touchy (normal mode of increase gain until wag then back off does NOT work). I am using a GWS prop adapter and drilled out the prop to fit.

I am still happiest with my Feigao setup -- thanks BOBWHO? for the "spare" motors.

If I get a chance, I will post a couple of quick vids...

Happy Flying!

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05-11-2010 07:15 PM  8 years agoPost 135
sneu

rrApprentice

San Diego

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12mm motors here!
We finally got a batch of the new and improved 12mm motors. These are made by the same company that made the Medusa line. They are now making them for us(NeuMotors). We have stock of both the 4000 and 5300Kv versions. The improvements include larger bearings and shaft as well as cooling holes--and of course these are black

Check the http://www.neumotors.com web site --we will have them listed there soon!

Steve Neu

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05-13-2010 05:47 AM  8 years agoPost 136
tutelar-rc

rrKey Veteran

Nobleton, Ontario - Canada

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Nice!

Although, not sure what the shaft diameter really is:
- your picture in the above post says 5mm (0.1965 inches)
- the text beside the picture on the website says 2mm
- the text in the table on the website says 1.5mm

Of course, we have been using 1.5mm shafts with the available props.

And it appears that BP Hobbies (and several other retailers) has the Feigao 1208436L back in stock -- at considerably lower prices.

I would be interested in giving one a trial if the price was comparable to the Feigao...

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05-20-2010 01:48 PM  8 years agoPost 137
BOB WHO?

rrKey Veteran

Downey, Ca.

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Hi tutelar
My friend got the new Neu 12x30 and finds it to be as good or better than the Medusa. The shaft is 2mm so the props that we use need to be drilled out. He has some wag that he can't find a way to eliminate but he just got the motor so hopefully he'll find a fix for that. The tail held with 4-point tic tocs and fast tail first maneuvers as well as it ever has so he is pleased! I finally got to a level of skill where I put my Feigao powered tail in positions that it cannot hold so I will probably get one too. The Feigao tail holds in all but the most demanding maneuvers but it's has limits for sure. This Neu motor appears to be the best of the breed with a matching price tag.

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