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09-20-2009 07:46 AM  11 years ago
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solo

rrApprentice

San Antonio Tx, USA

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phasing ?
How do you determine if you need a phasing adjustment?
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09-20-2009 11:36 AM  11 years ago
stanc

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Conroe, TX

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Are you asking if your if your head needs to be phased to start with or if your current phasing needs adjusting? One or both of these questions have been asked here many times, but here is a simple check.

Line up one blade with the boom and give Elevator InPut, if the blade doesn't more the phasing is right. The blade should move with Aileron InPut. With a blade at 90° from the boom and with Aileron InPut the blades should not move but will move with Elevator InPut.
A easy way to get it close is to have the the Blade Grip Balls on the swash line up with the Elevator Link Ball, with that Blade lined up with the boom. If your heli is one with a One Servo swash like a Raptor lets say, all four Blade Grip Balls would line up with all four servo Links with one Blade lined up with the Boom. That is if you have a Two Bladed or Four Bladed Head.

If the above doesn't show the correct results, then you need to rotate the Follower one way or the other until you get the right blade movement.
Stan
2- Logo 500
Ion X2
eAvro90
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09-20-2009 01:15 PM  11 years ago
doorman

rrProfessor

Sherwood, Arkansas

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Easy Info.....
stanc that was about the simplest explanation I have read about phasing.... Very nice....
That one makes it to the "files"!!!! Thanks for sharing your info....

Stan
AMA 2918-Team Spin Blades,,Castle Creations, Unique Aircraft
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09-20-2009 09:39 PM  11 years ago
stanc

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Conroe, TX

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Thanks Stan, I appreciate the compliment.Stan
2- Logo 500
Ion X2
eAvro90
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09-21-2009 01:18 AM  11 years ago
vermonster

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GOOSE GREEN,VT USA

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Easy Info.....

stanc that was about the simplest explanation I have read about phasing.... Very nice....
That one makes it to the "files"!!!! Thanks for sharing your info....

Stan
Perfect Stan...........
AMA#922194 IRCHA#3613
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09-21-2009 04:33 AM  11 years ago
solo

rrApprentice

San Antonio Tx, USA

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Cool!!! performed the check all is OK!! Thanks.
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09-21-2009 04:27 PM  11 years ago
Joel Rosenzweig

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Marlborough, MA - USA

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All of that information is correct for setting the phasing statically on the bench. It is still possible that you need to make an adjustment once you actually fly the helicopter. If you give a pure elevator input to the heli, the heli should rotate exactly forward or backward. If it rotates off-center (or flys off to the left or right), then you would need to adjust the phasing slightly to correct for this. Adjust the swash-lock a little bit to make the correction until the heli moves straight.

That's it!

Joel-
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09-21-2009 11:22 PM  11 years ago
flynbryan

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Long Island N.Y.

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I work in a machine shop and I thought of devising a precision tool that would position a blade perfectly over the tail boom. Just thinking that the more accurate your initial setup is the better. Even if you have to make an adjustment, It should be very minor. What do you guys think? Is it worth the time for a 5 blade set up?
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09-21-2009 11:28 PM  11 years ago
Joel Rosenzweig

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Marlborough, MA - USA

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I think you can eye-ball it pretty well. There is no harm in using a tool of course. But it would be different for many helicopters due to the various types of tail booms (some are fuselages, some are metal booms) and different blade grips or blades (depending on how you make the tool.

I'm not saying you shouldn't do it. It's just that the eye-ball alignment gets you 99% of the way there.

Joel-
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09-22-2009 03:23 AM  11 years ago
solo

rrApprentice

San Antonio Tx, USA

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Helitronix

So if you flying straight FFF and the heli wants to tilt to the right ever so slightly how do you no if its a phasing or trim problem. I eye balled my swash and it looks even from the front and sides but in FFF I get a very slight roll to the right. Should I just trim it to the left some?
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09-22-2009 03:46 AM  11 years ago
Joel Rosenzweig

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Marlborough, MA - USA

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If it travels off to the right when you are giving it a pure forward elevator command, then yes, you could adjust the phasing to correct this. If it's rolling to the right without your elevator input, then it is not a phasing problem. Instead, it would indicate that your swash plate isn't level and is out of trim.

Joel-
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09-22-2009 01:05 PM  11 years ago
Phoenix NOTAR

rrApprentice

Tallahassee, Florida USA

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In my opinion, if the helicopter is only rolling slightly in fast forward flight, it is more likley that it is a rotor dynamic type issue (loosing or gaining lift due to airspeed) then a phasing issue. A phasing issue should be able to be seen in a hover with small command inputs.

Just my 2 cents,

Sandy
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09-22-2009 01:13 PM  11 years ago
greenboot

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Marblehead, OH

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It seems logical the heli would roll right when in FFF because the left side rotor is advancing therefore creating more lift. The right side rotor is retreating and has less net airspeed and less lift. The opposite is true in backwards flight.Tom
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09-22-2009 01:47 PM  11 years ago
Joel Rosenzweig

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Marlborough, MA - USA

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I think the issue with the rolling off to one side in FFF is a tangent to the issue of phasing. If the phasing is off, then the heli will tend to roll in that direction as you input elevator. It's equivalent to pushing the stick in the wrong direction. That said, we're only talking about a "phasing" problem if this symptom shows up while hovering. You don't need to be moving forward at all in order to see if the phasing is adjusted properly. If the symptom does not show up while hovering, then the phasing is properly adjusted.

To see if the phasing is adjusted properly, you would simply hover the machine and input a pure forward elevator command. If it tilts in any direction other than dead ahead, then you need to adjust the phasing. If the phasing is off, and you continue to fly forward, you'll have both a roll induced by the off center elevator command (because it's phased wrong) and the issue noted by Sandy and Greenboot.

Of course, this all assumes a trim swashplate to begin with. Start with the heli hovering properly, then do the phasing test. If the heli is already rolling off to one side or the other before you start the test, the results are going to be hard to read.

Joel-
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09-22-2009 01:47 PM  11 years ago
heliwreckr

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Battle Creek, Taxigan

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One other thing to consider:

Are you absolutely certain you're not moving the aileron when you're moving the elevator or vice versa

Muscle memory can play tricks with your hands

paul
It's not crashed 'til it hits the ground
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09-22-2009 03:54 PM  11 years ago
greenboot

rrVeteran

Marblehead, OH

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It is probably best to check phasing on the ground and be done with it.

Once you start flying, there are so many other things like turbulance, ground effect, tail thrust, etc that will confuse the issue.
Tom
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