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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterJR Heli Vibe 90/50, Sylphide 90, GSR260 › Just bought a Vibe 50 V3D. An odd question....
09-20-2009 04:30 AM  11 years ago
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Bonkers

rrApprentice

New York

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Just bought a Vibe 50 V3D. An odd question....
With the exception of my T-Rex, all of my helis have the tail rotor on the left side (i.e. if the nose of the heli is pointed to the left, the tail rotor is on the same side of the tail boom as you are).

For some reason, I'm used to viewing my helis this way. I'm comfortable with it. For some bizarre reason, I prefer to have the tail rotor on the left. I can't explain it, but I know that I definitely prefer to have rotors on the left.

So I'm wondering, is there any way for me to put the rotor for my new Vibe 50 3D on the left side of the heli? Any optional parts that can be used to accompish this? Or would I have to jury-rig the tail in order to do it?
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09-20-2009 08:10 AM  11 years ago
Spacey

rrVeteran

Pretoria, South Africa

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In my opinion, leave the tailrotor on the Vibe right where it is and get used to it. There's no mechanical/aerodynamical advantage to having the tail rotor on either side and all of the helis I've ever owned has it on the right looking from above from behind the heli.

It won't make much difference on how you orientate the heli while flying from what I can see.

Leave it as is, and fly! You'll get used to it in no time and in future you won't have a problem with either way it's located.
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09-20-2009 12:47 PM  11 years ago
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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We flip them for scale but other than that, I'd just leave it be.Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com
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09-21-2009 12:20 AM  11 years ago
Bonkers

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New York

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Barracuda,
How do you flip them? If it's an easy and inexpensive process that doesn't harm the heli in any way, I'd like to do it.

Again, it's not a crucial item. But when you're used to something, you have a tendency to not want to deviate from it.
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09-21-2009 03:05 AM  11 years ago
ch-47c

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san jose, ca

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I would leave it as is. When you are flying you don't think which way is the T/R rotating. JR did the homework already.

When designing the T/R system I think it does make a difference in which way it rotates. The T/R is more effective when it rotates up into the M/R downwash, not down with it. A tractor T/R is better than a pusher type. But this is figured into the final design. A belt drive is easier to change than a TT type.
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09-21-2009 05:34 AM  11 years ago
Bonkers

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New York

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I'm not talking about changing anything but the side of the heli on which the tail rotor resides.

As for "tractors" being better than "pushers", I'd imagine it's the other way around: "pushers" aren't wasting any of their thrust against the tail boom and tail fin the way "tractors" do. All of their thrust, it would seem, goes into countering the rotation caused by the main rotor. And when you want to rotate the heli in the way it naturally wants to go, then the tail rotor becomes a "tractor", but has help from the fact that the heli wants to go in that direction anyway. At least, that's how it would seem to me.

If I'm not mistaken, the JR Vibe 50 is a pusher design. The main blade rotates clockwise, and to keep the boom from rotating counterclockwise, the tail rotor must "push" the boom clockwise.
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09-22-2009 12:55 AM  11 years ago
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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I wouldn't do it to a 3D model to be honest.

CH thats true but for a very small flight regime. It matters a whole lot more to full scale than to us.
Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com
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09-22-2009 01:07 AM  11 years ago
ch-47c

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san jose, ca

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Yes pushers don't blow onto the fin and designers prefer pushers more due to this efficiency, but all helis generally use 10% of total power on tail rotor thrust. Tractors pull into "clean" air and use less induced power and have better tail rotor control. However it actually depends on which heli. Some pushers have a real control problem with tail rotor vortex ring state, vibratory airloads, turbulated inflow of air and higher induced power requirements. I guess those efficiencies aren't that important that Sikorsky thought a tractor would be better on the UH-60 for a wider CG envelope.

But we are talking about RC helis. With excess horsepower, modelling ratios different than full scale and less effected by outside factors, and HH gyros, I don't think it makes a difference. 3D fins have lightening cutouts and were made so to save weight and cutdown on weathervaning. Fins are for foward flight stability and tailstrike protection.
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09-22-2009 01:10 AM  11 years ago
ch-47c

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san jose, ca

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I don't have my Vibe in front of me, but I'm 99.99% sure it is a pusher as you say. I agree with you about the odd feeling of seeing the T/R on the right. I didn't like that RC helis had for the most part European rotating or CW rotation when viewed from above. Schluter had a heli that you could get to rotate either way by an upgrade. I think it was called the Futura.
If I'm not mistaken, the JR Vibe 50 is a pusher design. The main blade rotates clockwise, and to keep the boom from rotating counterclockwise, the tail rotor must "push" the boom clockwise.
I don't think that it "must" remain a pusher. Without adding a counter gear or convert to a belt drive, I guess you could flip the T/R over to the left by rotating the gearbox, change the direction of the blade grips and blades for disc rotation, and adjust the pitch slider. No? Yes? What do you think?

Bell Helicopters changed the early Hueys and Cobras which were pushers to tractors by flipping the tailrotor gearbox over for better control at some expense of other efficiencies..ie blowing into the vertical fin. The Marines wanted the pusher tailrotor back so Bell flipped it back and changed the tailrotor rotation direction so the foward blade rotates up into the main rotor downwash. By flipping the Vibe tail gearbox, the forward tail blade would descend into the main rotorwash, but it has excess power. I would be real interested in what you find out if you try it.
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09-22-2009 01:18 AM  11 years ago
ch-47c

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san jose, ca

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Barracuda I agree. I guess it would look cool like Jimi Hendrix playing a right-handed guitar upsidedown left-handed. Maybe Bonkers will start a trend.
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09-22-2009 01:23 AM  11 years ago
Ace Dude

rrProfessor

USA

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I don't see any point in switching it.  
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09-22-2009 12:06 PM  11 years ago
jsenicka

rrProfessor

Eagle River, WI

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Other than Miniature Aircraft, most out there are on the right anyway.
(Raptor, Vibe, TREX, etc). Not sure on Hirobo.
The Minair Fury Tempest FAI in on the right, and the Stratus and Fury are on the left.
Jim Senicka
Team Manager, GrandRC Flight Team
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09-22-2009 02:18 PM  11 years ago
Bonkers

rrApprentice

New York

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Ace, switching it to the left is for familiarity's sake. I'm used to flying helis with the tail rotor on the left. Your eyes get used to seeing a heli a certain way, and you'd prefer not to deviate from it.

Also, you have to remember: I was wondering if there was an easy way to move it to the left side. I wasn't looking to make major modifications to the heli in order to accomplish the change.
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09-22-2009 02:28 PM  11 years ago
Ace Dude

rrProfessor

USA

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In 14 years of flying the thought of which side the T/R is on has never even crossed my mind once.  
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09-22-2009 03:27 PM  11 years ago
fla heli boy

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cape coral, florida

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me neither after I figured out to fly the nose and not the tail. I started off that way, then my father convinced me to fly the nose and it was good after that. Yeah - I wouldn't think it would matter which side the tail was on. IMO
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09-22-2009 03:32 PM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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Um why are you watching the tail rotor anyway..

in short you bought the wrong heli if its such a big deal to you.
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09-22-2009 03:39 PM  11 years ago
Ace Dude

rrProfessor

USA

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I do know a guy who flies the tail (mode 2 TX) and hovering nose-out and when he moves the T/R stick on the TX to the left the tail (instead of the nose) goes to the left. He refuses to change. I haven't seen him in years so I don't know if he's still flying. His setup sure makes it impossible for anyone else to fly his heli.  
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09-22-2009 06:22 PM  11 years ago
rexxigpilot

rrProfessor

rexxig2@comcast.net

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With a clockwise rotating M/R the tail blades should be on the left of boom to be tractor in a non-piro, upright hover condition. This counteracts the tendency of the fuselage to rotate opposite the M/R. In reality, for 3D flying it doesn't matter which side the tail is on or if it rotates up toward the M/R or not. When we fly inverted the M/R thrust is reversed. Therefore, the direction of the tail rotation is not important. When you go from fast piro right to fast piro left you change from tractor to pusher or vice versa depending on how your particular heli is set up.
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09-22-2009 09:16 PM  11 years ago
Bonkers

rrApprentice

New York

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USNAviationjay,

No offense, but perhaps you should read the rest of this thread before commenting. If you do, you'll see that I wrote these two statements in previous responses:

"Again, it's not a crucial item."

and...

"I was wondering if there was an easy way to move it to the left side. I wasn't looking to make major modifications to the heli in order to accomplish the change."

To the average person, these statements would indicate that the position of the tail rotor is not a big deal to me (despite the fact that I prefer it on the left side) and that I was simply wondering if there was a simple, easy way to do it.
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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterJR Heli Vibe 90/50, Sylphide 90, GSR260 › Just bought a Vibe 50 V3D. An odd question....
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