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Home✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-Elec-Helicopters New or Limited ActivityE-Sky › Xtreme Parts for BeltCPv2 and other mods? Recomendations?
09-18-2009 07:03 PM  11 years ago
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mgjones

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Seattle, WA - USA

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Xtreme Parts for BeltCPv2 and other mods? Recomendations?
I'm currently getting things set back up after the last crash (replacement of the boom, feathering shaft, blades, bushings... etc), and practicing on the sim while waiting for parts - I'm currently fighting that "if I fly I'm gonna crash and break something" fear..hoping the sim will help there a bit.

In the meantime I've been contemplating/researching some upgrades for my BeltCPv2.

1) I am considering doing the DTS mod. Not because I will be able to tell the difference at this point in my piloting abilities, but simply because it makes good mechanical engineering sense (the Engineer buried deep in my subconscious is basically geeking out on the idea )

2) I am considering replacing the stock esky flybar holder and mixing arms with this one:

http://www.miracle-mart.com/store/i...roducts_id=3015

and possibly the control ring

http://www.miracle-mart.com/store/i...roducts_id=3014

and even real turnbuckles:

http://www.miracle-mart.com/store/i...roducts_id=1550

I have no real concerns about the dts mod.. everyone writing about it seems to think it's a big improvement.

The concern is the head stuff.

If I'm going to go all metal eventually would it be better to just go for it, or replace the "critical" bits first.

The CPv2 has a mostly metal swash already. The flybar holder breaks if you breathe on it.. So I was going to start with that.

The real question is:

I can't seem to find a comprehensive list of pieces for the Xtreme Production head pieces and am wondering if I can get the remaining pices (center hub, etc), or am I throwing money away getting the flybar holder that's may not be compatible with anything else when I'll just have to buy a full head later?

Recommendations? Thoughts?

Thanks all!

- Michael

EDIT: PS.. By the way this is all somewhat hypothetical at this point.. Except maybe the DTS mod... I'm probably going to wait until I can at least hover with confidence before doing any SIGNIFICANT rebuilds..
First Heli - ESky BeltCP v2 2.4G
The addiction begins!
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09-18-2009 07:18 PM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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DTS mod looks interesting me. I'm not a fan all the extra links and the complications of push/pull.

As for the head, Xtreme doesn't offer a full head. So yes, you'd be piecing the rest of the head together from other vendors like CNCCopter or Esky, or Microheli. All somewhat expensive for what you are getting. Especially compared to the CopterX clone. But that's a different head style that some people don't really care for.

I think the best cure for your fly holder cracking is less crashing. When it lets go, its saving something else. Might be interesting to note the head parts you typically replace in a crash. Then add metal flybar holder and see if you end up replacing more parts for simlar crashes. Things like bearings, or the plastic frame sides, etc might take the energy that the plastic fly bar holder was taking before.

I believe the old rule applies here, stay with plastic until you are crashing less often.
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09-18-2009 07:27 PM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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Just my experience on HBK with similar head. Well, it depends how you crash. I like this head style, but if you crash upside down, i.e. on a head and that's how I crash usually, then flybar holder usually bents in my case. I do not use Xtreme one, but I plan to. In this regard, metal ring may help to keep expensive part from benting. So, if you go with metal seesaw, get metal ring as well. I think it will help in protection.
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09-18-2009 07:35 PM  11 years ago
mgjones

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Damit Greg.. you're just too much the voice of reason
I think the best cure for your fly holder cracking is less crashing.
That would be the best case scenario wouldn't it? DOH!

The part about watching what breaks as you replace other head pieces is also a point already brought up by the Mechanical Engineer firmly implanted in the back of my brain. This also just brings me to the point of .. maybe I should just go full metal and be done with it..

Just kind of thinking out loud:

I would think that when the flybar is hit the flybar holder being metal would not torque the rest of the head drastically since most of the the impact force dissipated in the flybar itself. However, impacts to the main blades could be a different story. Currently in the right (or wrong?) situation the impact would be carried through the blade grip to the mixing arms.. the mixing arms then cracking, or breaking off their attachment point at the flybar holder.

Who knows.. I don't.. I'm not so sure I want to invest $30-$40 in parts that would just end up in a box when I upgrade the rest of the head.

Thanks,

-Michael
First Heli - ESky BeltCP v2 2.4G
The addiction begins!
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09-18-2009 09:55 PM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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This also just brings me to the point of .. maybe I should just go full metal and be done with it..
If Fender were here he'd say, metal bends plastic breaks. When you bend a metal part in a crash it may very hard to tell visually. But then you have vibration or tracking issue that you can't get rid of. Metal will definitely hold up better in a crash. But if you end up with an unsolvable head issue you might have to replace the entire head to determine if the cause. It maybe cheaper in the long run to get a little Eflight MSR, and work on getting your hovers stabilized before dropping a boat load on metal.

Have you thought about re-enforcing the plastic flybar holder? Maybe with the fiberglass and epoxy just to bring the strength up a bit. Might be a fun craft/engineering project.
I'm not so sure I want to invest $30-$40 in parts that would just end up in a box when I upgrade the rest of the head.
Agreed. Don't start down an upgrade path until you know where its going to end. Or you'll end up spending 3 or 4 times what it would have cost if a little more planning were involved. Please don't ask how my Trex 450s I could have purchased with the money that is in my HBK2. For sanity sake, I don't even know. But I'm going to guess its more than 2. I'd rather not do the math and post the results, as that would be a perminant record of my lack of forsight and stuborness

The Belt is a good heli for getting your hovers down. But its not the heli you want grow old with. Before you spend any large amount of money on the Belt remember that no matter what you do it, its not going to fly like a Trex, Mini Titan, etc. MT kit is only $115. CNCCopter head is $94
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09-19-2009 01:17 AM  11 years ago
shizack

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Aiken, SC USA

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If you don't mind Dremeling a couple of mm off of the top of the main shaft, you could go this route:
http://www.xheli.com/exi-31001a.html

I have this on my EXI and it is much higher quality than you'd think. I haven't "crash-tested" it yet, but it works wonderfully in flight. You would just need to keep using the Esky swashplate for compatibility.

For $10 more you can get the head and tail combo.
A soul in tension is learning to fly
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09-19-2009 01:26 AM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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My 2 cents about heads: if in hovering stage, I'd recommend to stay with overslung head if it is not much slopy.
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09-19-2009 02:00 AM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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Above recommendatons ^^^ come from my experience with different heads I have on different helis (2 overslung, 2 underslung). It is non-scientific and it is based mainly on feelings, but different helis fly way differently in my concrete helis. The only I can say, that in hovering in overslung head design, paddles go through not yet washed by main blades air. That's why I accurately said about hovering stage.
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09-19-2009 03:22 AM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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So a Trex with an underslung flybar should be easier to hover inverted? Revolectrix Beta Team
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09-19-2009 03:47 AM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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No Gregg. I cannot say this and I do not see this. Upright and inverted they fly the same as least at my level of flying. But I can say that correlation is positive, but as you know it does not mean that events are dependant. There maybe other factors, which I am not aware of. And as we discussed sometimes, CY does not know or does not want to speak of this either (remember that article?). Paddles is the only what I can figure out. In any case it seems reasonable that if paddles go through unwashed air it should be more precise at least not worse, is it? We are not talking of slopy heads.

Also in my experiements I saw that heli flying is quite dependent on how paddles and flybar are setup (not light or heavy paddles, but setup). After that I spent quite of time to make paddles right. It helps. Or maybe I started to fly better. Even small 4#3 is dependent. After making them right, it was better. But maybe I started to fly better and think that it is setup. Positive correlation does not mean dependancy.
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09-19-2009 04:07 AM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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I was just kidding I'm not sure the paddles care that much about clean or dirty air. Otherwise, we'd hear more about Trex being more stable upside down and Raves flying better right side up.

But since never hear that, I suspect that if the clean air helps, there other factors with impact the heli more. Such as the one you mentioned, proper alignment of the flybar paddles to each other and to the arms.
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09-19-2009 04:26 AM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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I agree with you. Most probably other factors are more influensive, but I just do not see them. Paddles factor are most visible, but for sure it does not mean the most influensive. From another view, washed air influences flight. It is seen, when heli jumps into it's own wash, let's say on tight flips or rapidly descending vertically. But that's different story.
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09-19-2009 05:00 AM  11 years ago
mgjones

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Seattle, WA - USA

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Just so I have it straight:

Overslung head is paddles over the blades.. Underslung is paddles under the blades?
First Heli - ESky BeltCP v2 2.4G
The addiction begins!
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09-19-2009 05:12 AM  11 years ago
Heli_KV

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That's correct. But just for the sake of clarity: Do not take my words for granted. It is my helis in my incarnation, with different heads which fly differently. It is just my experience in particular my helis. I cannot say that this is because of only head design. But that's what I see...

Oh and now I remember. It was long time ago, so I cannot quote, but I read, that on question is heli the same stable inverted as upright, I read that somebody answered, that inverted heli is more stable. Guess what heli the guy talked about... Trex. So somebody noticed similar.
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09-19-2009 05:33 AM  11 years ago
BOB WHO?

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Downey, Ca.

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Hey mgjones, I recommend flying the sim every day waiting for parts or not. I used my realflight in the beginning every day no matter what. Now I use the Phoenix instead; it's very much like the real thing. Heck, I still fly that sim every day. It really helps your basic skills or you can perfect a move by repetition.
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09-19-2009 07:48 AM  11 years ago
mgjones

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As I sit back here in the "choir loft" looking out over the "congregation"

I try to run the sim as much as possible whether waiting for parts or not.

The sim is helping me with the "fine motor" movements to keep a virtual heli in one place for longer periods of time - we'll see if that translates to the real thing when it's back on it's "skids".
First Heli - ESky BeltCP v2 2.4G
The addiction begins!
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09-19-2009 08:25 AM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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Hey Bob, why not host an Esky/Esky Alum Phoenix session?Revolectrix Beta Team
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09-25-2009 02:21 PM  11 years ago
mech50

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Rochester, NY USA

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Esky metal parts for belt
You might like this site EnjoyHobbies.biz for esky belt metal parts a large set for $29, free shipping on the parts
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09-25-2009 04:11 PM  11 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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Sounds like the cloned Esky stuff. Helidirect now carries it as well. Pretty good price too.

http://www.helidirect.com/precision...1v2-p-11352.hdx

Revolectrix Beta Team
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