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09-15-2009 01:39 AM  11 years ago
Yug

rrMaster

UK. Herts

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The horizontal fin is advantageous for certain flight profiles but for purist 3D can be detremental in the way it interacts with the rotor wash. Nuff said.Vegetable rights and Peace
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09-15-2009 02:08 AM  11 years ago
RotorTech321

rrApprentice

Scranton, PA. USA

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none at all.
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09-15-2009 02:23 AM  11 years ago
bstock

rrKey Veteran

Easton, MD.

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It is cool to see some smart and experianced people in this thread.

uh60-pilot/ Kenny has a good point... and I didn't take it that he was trying to be demeaning.

I remember back when there were a lot more experianced pilots who used to contribute here quite a bit more - but then some of what Kenny was mentioning started coming about more - and these old school guys seemed to sit back. Probably don't want the hastle of having to prove themselves even more sometimes, and I don't blame them... but I miss them!!

I am not bashing either (truly)... but I miss those old school guys!! I would rather have more of those guys who have elected to be on the sidelines now... jump back in. We need their expertise!!

"Thanks" to those that do stay in the game!!
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09-15-2009 03:08 AM  11 years ago
jschenck

rrProfessor

La Vista, NE.

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So bottom line -

Solid tail fins helps fast nose first flight.

Tail fin delete/open fins help flipping and piro maneuvers.

Now I'm pretty sure you want tail fin delete on tail first flying, slow or fast.
True ?
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09-15-2009 03:38 AM  11 years ago
fran

rrVeteran

HONEA PATH, SOUTH CAROLINA

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Well said Dr. Ben...from and old FAI pilot of over 25 years.
I remember taking days/weeks to set-up two competition (FAI-F3C) heli's and there are, as you know; tricks and small things that can be done with the Horz and Vert fins, that will make or break and perfect manuever.....

I notice some times that maybe us older (flying wise) should get more involved and try not to worry too much about being challenged when we do offer advise.

Just a thought.
FRAN SR. ( FAI-F3C)
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09-15-2009 03:47 AM  11 years ago
UH-60PILOT

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Pyeongtaek, South Korea

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Hey guys, I fly 3D as well so don't misunderstand where I'm coming from. It has just been my experience (and I have flown all over the world) that the types that are attracted to helis for 3D ar not real interested in how it works other than what it takes to set it up if that. I've tweaked on more guys machines who can fly circles around me and when I'm done they always say "wow, it flies much easier now".... and I think to myself; "this is real basic set up knowledge".

I guess I may sound a little put off by the whole younger crowd but I certainly feel my expertise is less desired or appreciated than in years past. I've been flying R/C helis for 30 years and by the time I was 15 years old I had adults calling and asking to pay me to help them set up their machines and teach them to fly. Now when I tell guys who are learning to fly that yes, you can learn with a mechanical gyro (if they find one that still works) and the younger guys come on and bash me saying you can't learn unless you have a heading hold gyro. I didn't even fly with a gyro until I had been flying for three years.

I guess it's very similar to a WW II fighter pilot who had unbelievable flying skills and the modern fighters who see the enemy on radar and press a button. It's just a totally different mentality and like I said at the end of my first post "Just my opinion on what is going on here".
Kenny Thompson
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09-15-2009 03:47 AM  11 years ago
fran

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HONEA PATH, SOUTH CAROLINA

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Actually on the tail first 3D manuevers...
The tail fin close would hamper your flight and your opened (skeleton fin) would be better...in truth (3D) the tail fin acts more like a stinger...to prevent the T/R from striking the ground.
FRAN SR. ( FAI-F3C)
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09-15-2009 03:50 AM  11 years ago
rupps5

rrApprentice

columbus ohio

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hmmmmm interesting stuff.

I might try using the extra boom clamp I have with a horizontal fin on it and adjust it back and forth on the boom. Maybe that would get rid of the pitchyness in fff and be able to keep my paddles in the the 3d back hole.

thanks for the ideas guys, learn something new here everyday.
Jeff
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09-15-2009 03:50 AM  11 years ago
fran

rrVeteran

HONEA PATH, SOUTH CAROLINA

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AMEN on your comments on the HH gyros.
Remember when the JMW's were the best to get and how you had to set them up on stick priority (gain high at neutral and almost 0 at full deflection)!! Not to mention "c" cell batteries!!
FRAN SR. ( FAI-F3C)
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09-15-2009 03:52 AM  11 years ago
fran

rrVeteran

HONEA PATH, SOUTH CAROLINA

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The stingers I'm reffering to were like the UH1D's I flew in VietNam
added as an aftermarke so to speak (1967-68-69)
FRAN SR. ( FAI-F3C)
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09-15-2009 03:55 AM  11 years ago
UH-60PILOT

rrVeteran

Pyeongtaek, South Korea

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fran
Remember when the JMW's were the best to get and how you had to set them up on stick priority (gain high at neutral and almost 0 at full deflection)!! Not to mention "c" cell batteries!!
Yeap, remember what Curtis Youngblood could do with a helicopter that had a JMW in it. It was unbelievable to see the cutting edge stuff he did that turned into what we know as 3D today. Those were the days. I feel like an old fart now.
Kenny Thompson
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09-15-2009 03:59 AM  11 years ago
UH-60PILOT

rrVeteran

Pyeongtaek, South Korea

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fran

Wow! You flew Hueys in Nam? I learned to fly in the Huey! What a great machine that thing was.
Kenny Thompson
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09-15-2009 04:03 AM  11 years ago
fran

rrVeteran

HONEA PATH, SOUTH CAROLINA

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Yeah I was reading your bio...I spent some time in Alabama myself.
Lost my commercial license due to insulin pump (diabettes caused by Agent Orange Poisoning)....I'll have to PM you sometime and we could trade some stories...
FRAN SR. ( FAI-F3C)
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