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07-20-2009 10:28 PM  12 years ago
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Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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HBK motor
Would you please share your experience about HBK motor.

I use JGF400DH on 10T pinion having governor on 2800HS with CC 25 ESC.
It is all fine except motor is quite hot at the end of flight. If I just lazily hover around I put back 1000mAh on 1500mAh pack. If I fly intensively 5 min (as in my last video but without crash) I put back 80%. ESC is warm. I contacted JGF about hot motor and they said that 10T is way too much. If I go 9T, there is no enough room for governor to maintain speed. JGF and CC advised totally reversed settings for ESC btw. So I set settings to default, i.e. in the middle of diametrally opposite recommendations. Anyway changing both ways did not help.

So, what's you experience with HBK motors?
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07-21-2009 12:07 AM  12 years ago
TJinGuy

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Socorro, NM - USA

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My King is as light as possible, about 490g in flight. I run the ESky 3900 motor on a 10T. Idle1 is about 85%-75%-85% throttle and idle2 is 100% flat. I am currently using a CC35 cause I have it laying around but I hate the POS. I am planning to put my extra Align 35G on it. I fly for 6min on 1300 packs and use just about half the pack in idle1 and 70% in idle2. Pack comes down lukewarm in idle1 and HOT in idle2. The motor gets hot I would guess but I don't really care, so never check.- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech
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07-21-2009 02:02 AM  12 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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Thanks for info. The only I wonder why do you think CC35 is POS? What don't you like in it? Governor is better then Align ESC, all features are there. Just wonder.

I had 3900 on mine a while back, but upgraded to JGF, because I did not have enough power to my liking. I do not remember if it was hot. Maybe it was.

For JGF I can also say, it cools down pretty fast.
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07-21-2009 04:33 AM  12 years ago
TJinGuy

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Socorro, NM - USA

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Soft start sucks, throttle is not very linear and bec totally sucks, add to that the fact that a CC35 costs $85 and it is a waste of money. It is not a bad esc but its' cost-to-performance ratio is a little off. There are just much better options out there, and for a lot less coin.

Now to my actual application, the bec is too weak for even the tiny little analog servos I run. My last flight was filled with little pulses. When I switched to 100% flat throttle, it stopped doing it. It will likely end up on the classifieds very soon.
- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech
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07-21-2009 11:43 AM  12 years ago
DougsRC

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Mass.

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In the past I have tried:
HDX300 - 3800 KV---- good little motor for the price--bogs easily in my experience.
HDX450-- I think it was 3550 KV--- the one I had got red hot I think I got I bad one.
Esky 3100 KV----not enough KV----choppy start-up.
Esky 3900 KV---- decent motor
Esky 3800 KV---- Barely gets warm in my experience, good power, pretty easy on batteries. The down side is the can diameter is 28 mm I believe where most motors recommended for the KING have a 26mm can.
So you have to Modify the frame some to get it to fit right or use an adapter plate.
You could probably get some insane power using a Scorpian motor or similar, I not sure how much power the kings airframe can really take, there got to be a limit
Heli-KV, from watching your video's , I wouldn't change a thing myself, you got a nice set-up working there.
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07-21-2009 01:22 PM  12 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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Thanks Doug for comprehensive info on motors. Much valuable. I will stick with your advise not to change anything at least for now. Maybe when I get a chance to measure temperature, it will be within range.

TJin, I use CC ESC and Jazz. I would disagree about soft start in CC ESC - it is nice, I like it even better then Jazz's one. With CC ESC, I wonder why not to use governor - it works fine. I tried running v-curves and 100% throttle and I did not like them in comparison with governor. I did not play much so far with 2.11 firmware version. I have some questions with it in whch I am not sure. Bec there is really not good, so I always use external one, even with Jazz to run on 6v. It is pricey for sure, but in comparison with Jazz, it is not.
Thanks anyway for your thoughts.
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07-21-2009 03:05 PM  12 years ago
TJinGuy

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Socorro, NM - USA

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I am sure the firmware on the cc35 is old, but I have no way to update it. That may be why I have some issues with it. I am used to my Align 35A in terms of soft start and linear throttle, it is by far the best I have come across. Plus the bec in them is much stronger. I run bigger servos with a mini digital on the tail of my Rex and it never misses a beat, all for $50. To add to this, I also have a cc25 on my plane. Like the 35 the soft start sucks but I haven't played with it much more than a few flights on the King before moving it over. Then there is the CC85HV my roommate bought used. It came busted. Reading more it seems like a very common problem with those. So I have many reasons not to like CC and as such, enjoy other cheaper and better options like the HobbyWing 70HV on my 600, that is a nice piece. Governor works great, soft start is not as perfect as Align but nearly as good and the cost is about 2/3rds of a CC. Plus it is about 1/2 the physical size and they offer a lcd programmer with firmware update capability. Again I have my reasons.- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech
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07-21-2009 06:35 PM  12 years ago
juicedcbr600f2

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Parker, Colorado - USA

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im running the blade 400 stock motor on mine and love it... I also have the Xtreme Products Carbon frame though. Plenty of power and easy on the batteries cuz its not really working the motor too hard.

- justin
Justin Naekel - Parker, CO - USA
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07-25-2009 07:21 PM  12 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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Doug's got a good list there. I'll add my personal experiences based on my relatively heavy HBK2. I run the Xtreme CF frame, metal geared servos and 170 gram packs. A lighter HBK2 owner would do better to consider one of the lighter motor offerings like the Esky 3900.

Esky 3800 - Frame mod required as Doug described. No big deal, but it weakens the frame in an already weak area. You are better off to add the Park adapter which raises the motor.

I loved this motor in the King. It has a good amount of torque but is not hyper like some of the others. So if you load up the rotor, you'll see a larger imeadiate drop in headspeed, but the torque will keep it from bogging to badly. I retired mine on the King after 400 flights because I wanted a little more power.

Extreme 400x - The lightest and smalled of the bunch, this appears to very similar to the HDX 300 sized 3800. It's got a lot of pep, and makes the cyclic response very sharp. But it was far to easy to bog when the load was sustained. Also the motor was excessively loud, which can be a problem for backyard flying. Both of my motors were loud, so it seems more a design issue than a manufacturing anomoly. The Xtreme s main shaft is notorious for breaking. HD replaced mine free of charge after a mild crash. I didn't care for the lack of torque and the excessive noise so I moved on.

HDX 450 sized 3550 - More torque than the Extreme, but still far to easy to bog for a motor in the larger 450 catagory. This motor ran very quiet (quietest of the bunch) and very cool. However, it was not terribly efficient lowering my flight time by a minute. Mine died in flight after 170 flights.

After the HDX died, I put the Esky 3800 back in and was reminded why I liked it so much. But, just as before, I found I wanted a little more power. After trying all the cheap motor options, I decided to try a Scorpion. I narrowed it down to these 2.

2213-14 (330W, 3585Kv, 32A max)
2216-12 (375W, 3350Kv, 35A)

I opted for the 2216-12 which so far seems to be good fit for my needs and heli weight. Its not teribly loud. It does have plenty of torque, although I can bog it going to full collective. But as long as I apply a tiny bit if restraint when pushing on the collective, the heli climbs much faster than with any other motor I've tried. So far the efficiency seems pretty good. Though it doesn't feel as snappy as the Xtreme, its clear there is lots of power there when you take off in FFF. More than once, I was surprised how quicky it rocketed from one side of the field to the other.

I'm currently running it with a 12t and was tached right at 3000. So far the only stress casulity has been the tail shaft collar that keeps the pulley in the center. More on this later.
Revolectrix Beta Team
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07-25-2009 08:51 PM  12 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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Thanks Greg! Very nice and comprehensive review of HBK motors. Would be nice to hear more of your experience with Scorpion motor. Is it hot after flight?
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07-25-2009 09:26 PM  12 years ago
Gregor99

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Western Wa

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I haven't given it a good full workout yet. Maybe 10 or so flights. I'll have more to say when I get to 100+ flights. Motor temps have been 115f to 120f. Which is close too, but a tad hotter than the other motor I've run. But these temps occured when the ambient temps were were about 20 degrees f, above normal. Again, I need more time with the motor to get its typical temps, current draw and performance characteristics.Revolectrix Beta Team
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07-25-2009 09:33 PM  12 years ago
Gyronut

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Martinsville In.

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I ran my King with a JGF400DH on a 10t pinion with a Quark 33 esc and loved it.

I used a Mega 1350 battery and had lots of power for mild 3d.

Hoep you find the right combo for yours..
Rick
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07-26-2009 05:51 PM  12 years ago
Heli_KV

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Ottawa, Canada

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Gyronut, what's throttle curve, HS do you run? What's temp of motor after the flight, let's say at ambient 20C?
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