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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Why dont they have this yet
06-19-2009 12:03 AM  11 years ago
VooDooX

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San Francisco Bay Area CA, US (San Mateo)

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Carbsmart type devices do it so well anyway
HAHAHAHAH

you still have to tune your engine FIRST i meant something that does it all for you senses that engine needs break in and does rich runs adjusts for OPTIMUM performance at all times instantly because its part of the engine and also since electronic those changes can be made almost instantly instead of a few second delay were talking serious power increase also 3d people will be all over it
Velocity 50 "99.9999999999999% of an atom is empty space." also 01001000 01001001
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06-19-2009 12:22 AM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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Um they don't even have that on full size engines.
still need to be tuned and maintained.
there is no magic tuning needle even with fuel injections.

Good luck inventing the engine that needs no tuning.

mechanics the world over would make sure that never happened they would be out of a job.
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06-19-2009 12:25 AM  11 years ago
VooDooX

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so your saying a car engine you have to set everything when you buy it? does a pilot need to go to each engine and set a needle on his 747 for humidity and temp? do you need to retune your lawn mower every day? no you just turn the key this does exist already on full scale i mean a system so you can "set it and forget it!" (yes i watch too many late night infomercials)Velocity 50 "99.9999999999999% of an atom is empty space." also 01001000 01001001
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06-19-2009 12:57 AM  11 years ago
TaleGunner

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Deer Park WA

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Um they don't even have that on full size engines.
still need to be tuned and maintained.
there is no magic tuning needle even with fuel injections
All new engines have a computer that monitors everything and adjusts injector timing, fuel flow, ect. even break in is in the computer.

all fuel ans oil injected 2 stroke outboard engine will inject a higher oil content until enough hours are on the engine then the computer adjusts the oil content to meet epa standards.

I still however do not see this being something reasonable to do with a carburated engine
CRASH! GLUE! REPEAT!
Spectra-G, Ion X-2
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06-19-2009 01:05 AM  11 years ago
airdodger

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Johnston USA

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Yes you can set and forget, like a lawnmower or your car, but you have to settle for a modicum of performance. Don't the Evo engines have a limiter on the needle for the range it is supposed to run in. People even burn out electrics. The engines just don't need large adjustments unless you have drastic changes. Even Formula1 cars burn up engines and they have the most sophisticated engine montitoring in the world.Chris
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06-19-2009 01:45 AM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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well ive been racing cars and motorcycles for the last 30 years. and even on DFI FI systems on our 8 second stangs we still had to baseline and tune then the DFI would take over. same on our motorcycles even now in the FI days I spent hours tuning my GSXR-1000's Powercommander on my laptop to get the most ideal tune.

You will never do away with initial tuning is my point.

and yes when you buy a car some tech at the factory made sure it was running right and made sure the right curves were set in the onboard computers.

and yes as said above thats fine for grandma and granpa puttering around in a camry.
but high performance engines require constant tuning and tinkering.

stock is never the most effective power tune.
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06-19-2009 04:03 PM  11 years ago
w.pasman

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Netherlands

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I agree that for newcomers to nitro engines learning to tune is hard. $70 might be a cheap way out for these, well assuming it's plug and play.
However IMHO in most cases running hot has nothing to do with needle settings, but on an air leak somewhere. Electronics is then going to do more bad than good. It's like a governor: it just hides the problem until it's too late
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06-19-2009 06:05 PM  11 years ago
KC

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WA

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The best EFI available is called a Kontronik Jive

Seriously.....esc 400.00....good motor 200.00.....10s battery for 50-90 size 400.00...charger and balancer 250.00

No tuning ever again...I have thousands of hours on nitro helis...even then, I still was tuning them all the time. Nitro is also hydroscopic, so in our climate a motor needs to be completely cleaned out or flown once a week during the winter....got better things to do when the weather is bad outside.

turbines have too short a time between overhaul for frequent flying. cool motors though.

Consider this....in a well cared for electric (don't run the batteries way down, don't overheat the batteries), the only thing that will require replacement every so often are the batteries....motors can go a hundred hours, escs will last years, same with chargers and balancers.

so that 6.00 a flight, comes down 2-3.00, less than nitro if you stick with it.

if you want plug and play, it doesnt get any easier.

sure you can't get lots of flights back to back unless you have lots of batteries and chargers but if you are a more experienced pilot, you realize that there is no rush, no requisite amount of flights per day that are necessary to learn anything or have fun....it doesn't get any more fun than having a helicopter that can fly 12-20 flights a day at a funfly while everyone else is tuning and watching
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06-19-2009 06:08 PM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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nice attempt at derailing a conversation into a E VS N war..

that has nothing to do with the question at hand.
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06-19-2009 07:10 PM  11 years ago
VooDooX

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NITRO>ELECVelocity 50 "99.9999999999999% of an atom is empty space." also 01001000 01001001
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06-19-2009 07:25 PM  11 years ago
DKNguyen

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Not for lack of tuning it ain't. Otherwise you wouldn't have started this thread O_O

BUt I thought one of the reasons Nitro guys always use is they like to tinker.
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06-19-2009 09:07 PM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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havign to check temps and adjust 1-2 clicks either way on the first flight of the day hardly constitutes tuning/tinkering.
E guys blow that way out of proportion.
with the carbsmart device it becomes a total non issue at all.
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06-19-2009 09:48 PM  11 years ago
KC

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WA

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no war...why would a guy want EFI unless he thinks that its'easier' like everyone else thinks of EFI until they have to work on one....

1-2 clicks?.....'carbsmart'?....ever go between 100 deg ambient and 50 deg in the same day?...thats more like 8 clicks on most 2 needle 50s....3 needle carbs are fairly common now and tuning those is harder than you forgot for most of these new guys

how about swapping out 15% for 30% and vice versa....doesnt provide the same power as being ran on only one....there are a lot of things good and bad about glow and electric...but the question was "how come there isnt an engine that will just do all the tuning stuff for us?"

its called an electric motor.

e-guys??? I said I have a fair amount of experience with glow....15 years, 3000 hours and change, many brands, 0-30%, pipes, mufflers, 30s, 46s, 50s, 60s, 80, 90s..........I'm into all kinds of stuff, its all interesting to me.

suggesting electrics has quite a bit to do with the question.....

the question was why hasn't this been done yet?....you're looking at the answer in my last post....it doesnt get any easier than that, theyre common now, and EFI would be the exotic.

an EFI OS 50 would probably cost 600.00....someone would make a knockoff 6 months later that costs 400.00.....its just too expensive too.

it won't work any better than carbs do now...yes the OS 140 'EFI' is a fine motor, but it isnt even EFI or whatever you want to call the concept of letting computer actively tune for you.....

I associate the guys who want this technology to the same crowd who must fly flybarless....learn how to tune, and learn how to fly.

that said I do not have anything against either technology....if EFI and vbar can be helpful, then use them....but thats a lot of money for fuel, plugs, driving to find experienced help, etc, etc
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06-19-2009 10:18 PM  11 years ago
USNAviationjay

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Houston Tx USA

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This is Texas.. we wake up and its 90 degrees.. so no I don't have to spend days tuning for drastic temp changes. 2-3 clicks either way and done.

and why on earth would anyone detune for 15% once set for 30.. having gone from 15-30 I can attest to the fact that 15% isn't even in the same zip code as 30% on a .50 at least.

The OP is a Nitro guy he even stated so.. so bringing E into the thread was not what ANY of us want to hear.
we are nitro guys and most of us tried E as well.

for me its just not economical to buy 4-6 200+ dollar batts + badass chargers to maintain the flight time I already get with a fleet of nitros.

Nitro supply is unlimited RX pack takes less than 15 mins to charge and with 3 or more nitro birds and a case or 2 of fuel thats ALOT more flights a day back to back.
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06-23-2009 05:43 PM  11 years ago
3dwanabe

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Huntersville, NC

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Why don't we have this yet?

Because it is not needed and would be very expensive. If you don't have the desire or ability to tune an engine properly, you should run an electric or maybe just flying a sim would be an excellent solution.

If really want a system that tunes your engine for you, step away from your keyboard and develop one.

Roy
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