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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterAerial Photography and Video › QUESTION TO ALL AP GASSER OPERATORS
04-26-2009 10:29 AM  10 years ago
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jnfarin

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ITALY

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QUESTION TO ALL AP GASSER OPERATORS
Hello.
I've still many trouble on my GSR that is 12kg (26,5 pound) heavy ready to fly...
Could you tell what is the weight of your gasser ship + camera mount + fuel (READY TO OPERATE).
MANY THANKS!
Diego
VARIO Benzin Acrobatic + Airfoil PRO1 + DJI XP3.1
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04-26-2009 04:07 PM  10 years ago
wjw

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Cape Coral, Florida usa

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Bergen EB gasser (G-26 with 810 V blades)
HCS Mark 4 with electronics and batteries
Sony HC-5
Fueled AUW of 25lbs 2oz
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04-26-2009 04:25 PM  10 years ago
windy62

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Jnfarin, What altitude above sea level are you flying?windy62
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04-26-2009 04:57 PM  10 years ago
AllJeep

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East Coast

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...

Sorry edit
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04-26-2009 06:14 PM  10 years ago
jnfarin

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hello wjw, hello windy!
I fly from 0 to 1000 m ... it depends by job demand.
The problem isn't carburation or engine throuble.....the problem is still the main gear: JR has released a new type of main gear (was in black derlin 88T and now is white nylon I suppose) but it continues to strip!
I've the bigger bell-clutch to improve low temperature and more transmission torque.....I think the problem is in the weight (my ship is critical) and temperature that occours to melt the main gear through teh pinion heat.
To wjw: could you tell me about your main gear?
Material/color, Z, ext. diameter, and the thickness,
also the teeth number of engine pinion.
Many thanks and excuse me for the bad writing!
Diego
VARIO Benzin Acrobatic + Airfoil PRO1 + DJI XP3.1
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04-26-2009 06:35 PM  10 years ago
CKY

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Sunshine Coast, BC, Canada

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Just a guess but the bigger clutch bell doesn't allow for any slippage?? Going back to the smaller clutch may be an answer.

Slip before strip...

May have to replace the clutch linings on a regular basis though.
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04-26-2009 07:03 PM  10 years ago
jnfarin

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The small clutch bell was very hot.....the new bigger one runs cooler.
If the clutch-pinion is hot...it transmits the heat to the main teeth...and so.....
Also it could be that using the small clutch bell...it slipped and it became hotter and so it had stripped/melted the maingear teeth!
Other data on gasser AP weight?
VARIO Benzin Acrobatic + Airfoil PRO1 + DJI XP3.1
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04-26-2009 07:34 PM  10 years ago
Helicek

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istanbul - turkey

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Hi Diego,
when the main gear stripped what was your main rotor rpm? Are you limited to lower rpm for that large rotor diameter?
Ahmet
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04-26-2009 09:50 PM  10 years ago
wjw

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Cape Coral, Florida usa

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Bergen only offers one gear ratio for the EB, I think (if I counted correctly) the pinion is 14 and the main gear is 89.
When I first started flying the Bergen gassers I stripped about 5 or 6 main gears in less than 8 weeks.
For the Bergens I found 2 things that cause this problem.
If the gear mesh is not correct it can strip a main gear in the first flight. The gear mesh must have a SMALL amount of back lash.
If the engine is not tuned properly, too rich or too lean, it strip a main gear.
On my EB I now have about 20 hours of flight with the same main gear.
On my other Bergen gasser (710'S) I have about 9 hours of flight time ( I don't use it as much)
I just sold my X-cell gasser and it has the same main gear for a couple years now, I do not know how many hours, but I know it's a lot.
Make sure your engine is tuned 100% and your mesh is correct and I bet that will solve your problem.
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04-26-2009 10:15 PM  10 years ago
iflybyu77

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Fort Wayne, IN

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As I recall, a slipping clutch due to too low of headspeed can present issues as well. Again, if the clutch gets hot, the pinion gets hot -> the main gear gets hot. There are probably a number of different issues that could cause it of course, and I'm just offering a possibility. High loads can exacerbate each of the noted problems even more of course, as the resultant torque exerted on the drive train increases.
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04-26-2009 11:22 PM  10 years ago
Rappy 60

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Paris, France

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Bergen only offers one gear ratio for the EB, I think (if I counted correctly) the pinion is 14 and the main gear is 89.
No, they have several different gear ratio's using different pinions. Clutch problems will strip main gears.

Dale
Load "*",8,1
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04-26-2009 11:44 PM  10 years ago
jnfarin

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MAny thanks to everybody, thanks....I still waiting to know the weight of yours AP SHIP!!!!
In order:
- Ahmet, my standard rpm rotor is 1500 - 1550 , infact is the best I could find to have a smooth running...but I remember now that when the main gear stripped the main rotor was spooling up so I don't know? When I had the old little clutch bell I couldn't go in lower RPM because was slipping...but now I could try to do that since lower rpm appear to be smoother.....but a faster main rotor isn't more stable?
-tanks to wjw, so also you stripped so many main gear on bergen! I think we can't fly hoping that engine don't became rich or lean! ALso for me: I tuned the engine perfectly, it run very smooth and the gear mesh was every time controlled also during flight.......I think we are at limit conditions!
wjw, you stripped because you hasn't any mesh or too mesh on gear train?
-is like you're saing iflybyu77 .... to many variable .....if we are at the limit of the "application" ...so we can do 3 flight perfect...and then stripped the next...
-yes, Rappy, I know Bergen offer different ratio .... and also I could tell you that my new clutch bell is very large and run cooler than the original - one ...also the runout is very good!
VARIO Benzin Acrobatic + Airfoil PRO1 + DJI XP3.1
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04-27-2009 12:06 AM  10 years ago
oakley

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USA

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Bergen only offers one gear ratio for the EB, I think (if I counted correctly) the pinion is 14 and the main gear is 89.
Bergen does indeed have several different ratios.I have 2 different ratios on 2 of my Bergens.One ratio for swinging long blades (810's) and one for swinging short blades.(720's)
Admit nothing, deny everything and make counteraccusations
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04-27-2009 01:14 AM  10 years ago
windy62

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USA

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Is it possible the autorotation hub is slipping, then grabbing hard, taking out the main gear?

Especially since you noted it happened on spool up...
windy62
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04-27-2009 03:12 AM  10 years ago
wjw

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Cape Coral, Florida usa

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I will call Bergen in the morning, to get the correct info on the ratios as I am pretty sure the EB (Extended Boom for 810's) have only 1 ratio.
If I am wrong, I will state that as well. Would not be the first time
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04-27-2009 03:17 AM  10 years ago
Rappy 60

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pretty sure the EB (Extended Boom for 810's) have only 1 ratio.
Well that depends if you are running a gasser or a turbine.

jnfarin, make sure you don't have any grease or oil on the clutch lining, that will destroy your gear for sure.

Dale
Load "*",8,1
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04-27-2009 03:19 AM  10 years ago
oakley

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Well that depends if you are running a gasser or a turbine.
Exactly.
Admit nothing, deny everything and make counteraccusations
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04-27-2009 04:55 AM  10 years ago
aambrose

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Pana, IL

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Diego,
What's the difference in the clutch bells you're talking about? Are they larger diameter?

Does the hex starter shaft above the clutch bell pinion rotate freely? If this is not straight in the bearing, it will create heat and cause the transfer to the main gear.

BTW, what main gear are you using? Black or white? Which gear stripped (black or white)?

Thanks!

Tony
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04-27-2009 12:09 PM  10 years ago
nuguy

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New Zealand

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Bergen only offers one gear ratio for the EB, I think (if I counted correctly) the pinion is 14 and the main gear is 89.
I am pretty sure I am running a 12 tooth pinion on my EB.Gives me about 1400 on the head.Running 810 mah blades and carring around 4.5kg

Kevin
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04-27-2009 06:12 PM  10 years ago
oakley

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USA

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Bergen offers the following pinions: 10T, 11T, 12T, 13T, 14T and only one main gear that is 90tooth.

The ratios available on the Bergen gasser are:9.0 to 1 ,8.18 to 1,7.5 to 1,6.92 to 1,and 6.42 to 1.
Admit nothing, deny everything and make counteraccusations
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