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04-22-2009 03:11 PM  10 years ago
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Henrik Engert

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Cedar Park, TX

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Freya interaction
I have a Freya with the SSZ-3 head. When I give full pitch I can see that the paddles move a tiny bit. It actually gives elevator. It's just at the very top of the pitch and the very bottom of the pitch. Anybody knows what could be going on?
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04-22-2009 03:17 PM  10 years ago
Tyler

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I might be wrong, but I would think that a freya might have phasing alignment issues more than cyclic interactions. Have you checked your phasing ring on the bench or done any test flying to see what it does in the air?

Tyler
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04-22-2009 03:26 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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I am also suspecting the phasing, and probably should have played around with it last night, but it was late...

It does not matter where the flybar is, the "interaction" is there all the time. It seems like the arms (on the washout) connected to the flybar cage are moving (makes sense since it's giving elevator input). Difficult to explain, but the arms seems to struggle the last bit when the washout travels up.
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04-22-2009 03:46 PM  10 years ago
Tyler

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It sounds like you are describing the arms/levers running out of travel and putting side load on the bolt and bearing as you reach the travel limits.

This might simply be a result of the freya geometry limits.

How much pitch are you pulling before this interaction comes into play? Then, how much is your final pitch including the interaction?

I always ran +10/-10 on my freya and xspecs. Today's trend it to shoot for +13.5/-13.5 or so. This is simply unreasonable with a Freya in my opinion.

Tyler
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04-22-2009 03:55 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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Sounds reasonable.

I think my max pitch range is +-10, but I would have to double check that when I get home.
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04-22-2009 04:23 PM  10 years ago
synodontis

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I have a Freya with the SSZ-3 head. When I give full pitch I can see that the paddles move a tiny bit. It actually gives elevator. It's just at the very top of the pitch and the very bottom of the pitch. Anybody knows what could be going on?
this is normal. If you don't want this get an Eagle 3 VPUS! Sorry, but that's life. This is an inherent feature of the geometrical arrangement of this particular implementation of mechanical mixing. You might be able to "mix" it out but I wouldn't know how....

The 135 SWM with 14 MZ should have no interaction too, so I've heard....
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04-22-2009 04:37 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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It's not a big deal really, just wanted to know if this was a common thing. It's a very small change on the paddles.Hirobo XSpec EVO
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04-22-2009 04:43 PM  10 years ago
Tyler

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Have you witnessed a problem in flight? I suspect that while the blades are loading the head, linkages, and servos you might not actually feel the interactions in flight.

Tyler
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04-22-2009 04:54 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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Cedar Park, TX

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I have not felt the interaction in flight. I guess if I do punch full pitch the helicopter does not go exactly straight up, but that might be a swash plate leveling issue, wind condition etc.

I will give it a test this weekend, now that I know what to look for.

Thanks guys.
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04-22-2009 05:11 PM  10 years ago
Dr.Ben

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The problem unequivocally exists in the model and, as mentioned earlier, is the reason for the development of the VPUS. It has NOTHING to do with phase adjustment as that affects cyclic to cyclic purity of control.

The simple solution to the problem is to use a linear pmix with half stick as the offset and mix it out. It takes a VERY small amount to remove it. It still won't be as pure as VPUS, but it'll be quite good.

Ben Minor
Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA
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04-22-2009 05:17 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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Thanks.

Never used mixes, but there is a first time for everything I guess

As a side note:

I noticed while changing the head block on my SSZ-3 head that one of the bolts that were holding one of the dampeners (Only one) in place was loose, this might be one reason for my vibrations that I have had on the helicopter.
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04-22-2009 05:35 PM  10 years ago
Dr.Ben

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That head arrangement is extremely sensitive to any loose bolts in the center block, be they associated with the dampers or the teeter. It could have indeed been causing that shake.

Let me know if you need help with the mixers. You probably don't realize how much you're correcting manually in flight versus mixing it out.

Ben
Peak Aircraft/Team Minicopter Team Futaba Team Kontronik USA
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04-22-2009 06:14 PM  10 years ago
Pappy35

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Memphis, TN

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What's VPUS and where can I buy one??

Al T
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04-22-2009 06:38 PM  10 years ago
Henrik Engert

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Cedar Park, TX

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VPUS is for the Eagle 3, unless you want to rebuild the Freya...

Quote from Hirobo's website:

"Eagle 3 WC uses a new system, Variable Pitch Up System (VPUS). There is a floating servo mount block on main frame. This block slightly moves. Therefore, elevator, aileron, and pitch control all have a linear movement. Also, swash plate can move up and down keeping the same angle."

This a picture of the VPUS system on an Eagle 3.

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