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HomeAircraftHelicopterThunder TigerRAPTOR 90 › raptor 90 3d vs t700
04-04-2009 07:27 AM  9 years agoPost 1
cd5

rrApprentice

penrith,Australia

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How do the 3d flight characteristics of an out of the box raptor 90 3d compare to the trex 700n.

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04-04-2009 10:00 AM  9 years agoPost 2
Wa11banger

rrElite Veteran

Huntsville, Al

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speaking from personal experience here.. I am no pro pilot. The guys at Bham were tossing their Raptor 90 around just as nice as any T700 I have ever seen fly. BUT!!!!

No comparison in my hands, night and day difference. First off none of my R90's can achieve the roll rate and pitch rate of my T700. I have been tweaking them for years. It was given to me straight out of the box on the T700.
All responses are quicker and tracking is a bit truer on the T700 That being said I dont fly them in circuits much, so tracking isnt very important except for large maneuvers.

I dont know what it is about the larger gear era that we are experiencing with the N9, T700 but when you bury the sticks and need recovery it seems to help alot. My R90's dont seem to recover from my poor flying skills as quickly as the T700 does.

The head geometry has to have something to do with the feel of being lighter, but my T700 is about 3/4 of a pound lighter than my R90. Another aspect of feeling lighter is the R90 has such a low CG relative to the center of the airframe and the T700 CG is much higher on the airframe.. Quick UK did a conversion for the R90 called the VMAX.. It raised the CG alot and as a result had faster cyclics all the way around as well as eCCPM.

Having both the T700 outperforms the R90 every time. But thats in an average Joes hands.. A pro makes any of them look great!

Rick

Proud member of the Quick UK, Duralite Flight Systems, V-Blade, & KBDD team

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04-04-2009 04:05 PM  9 years agoPost 3
BJames111

rrElite Veteran

San Diego, California

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Having both the T700 outperforms the R90 every time. But thats in an average Joes hands.. A pro makes any of them look great!
I'm sorry I just don't agree. I think the Raptor tracks much better, and settles into a hover much nicer. Also, there is zero interation to worry about.

The 700 is a nice machine, I just think that the Raptor is more refined.

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04-04-2009 05:35 PM  9 years agoPost 4
lugnutz

rrApprentice

trenton,nj

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they both are good machines,trex parts are cheaper and more readily available,they both fly very well with proper setup

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04-04-2009 07:37 PM  9 years agoPost 5
S Bell

rrApprentice

Nova Scotia Canada

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Rick,

Maybe you could ask one of those guys with the nice flying Raptors to tweak yours to the same standard? I know if you approached them correctly they'd likely let you have a pull on their machine. I find most differences are due to the configuartion and as you say different machines fly differenty out of the box. This is usually due to paddles, blades and setup selection for a specific aircraft. If they all flew and were built the same it'd be a pretty boring hobby. I've seen guys make setup complaints just as you have about several different brands as all modelers are not cut from the same cloth. Some people don't like 700 out of the box either and some will never notice. The Raptor 90 is out of the box a very civilized helicopter, the setup is what increases its control rates.

If you add a bunch of heavy bling and/or run extra stuff like sideframe stiffners etc the machine will feel heavier.

The reason the R90 tosses like any other 90 is setup and skill, both of which are something you can't buy but have to figure out. That said all you have to do is ask the right person at B-Ham or elsewhere for configuration advice.

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04-04-2009 11:35 PM  9 years agoPost 6
jschenck

rrProfessor

La Vista, NE.

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Have you stripped a main gear on your T700? Seems to be a pretty common issue. I suspect it's frame flex between the upper assembly and the lower frame assembly as it seems to happen when there is side load on the airframe, side tic-toc's. That wouldn't stop me from buying a T700 but just something to be aware of before making the decision, research it, ask questions. They do fly nice and look great. I do think that Mr. Bell has a point with the 'fastness' being the typical 120° swash uses 60% of servo travel. So if you want that reaction speed try setting up your Raptor to use shorter servo throws and use really powerful, accurate servos.

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04-05-2009 03:32 AM  9 years agoPost 7
Wa11banger

rrElite Veteran

Huntsville, Al

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BJames111
I flew all day again today still tracks better than my R90's The interaction I have to agree with, but I havent seen an eCCPM system that you didnt have to tune that in. I dont mind tuning it and it dont take that long, less than one flight.

S Bell
Thanks for the advice but I am great friends with many of them and just about all of them have looked them over and even had quite a few pros throw both my R90's and my VMax conversion around with the greatest of ease. But if you read my post you will find I didnt say the Raptor couldnt do it! I said in my hands it cannot.
However, I was given all the benefits I talked about straight out of the box without any assistance or special measure with the T700. Overall out of the box it gave me some of that performance that I couldnt time right on my R90's. I flew them many years, been through all of the iterations. My 700 flys like what I have been looking for and that is what we are blessed with having all of these differing models on the market today.

sjchenck,

I haven't stripped the main yet, but that doesn't mean it wont happen. I keep a pretty good eye on it flight to flight but so far have not had any indictation of anything to worry about. I have been told it is a will or wont thing. Only time will tell on this airframe, we'll see and I will for sure report it if I do I dont play favorites except in trons and fuel. Airframes change so fast these days its time to try them all. Most of my R90's have been outfitted with 9451's on the cyclics and 94758's on the collective.

My T700 had 9451's all the way around till I had an elevator servo give me some trouble.. I am currently testing a set of Align 610's in it. So far, pretty good. Very fast, seems more than adequate for the job, and all I have to wait for is to see if they hold up. Time will tell. It had the reaction time on the 9451's and has it on the Aligns as well. Good info on the shorter throws.. I will definitely work that when I finish setting up my rebuild on the last R90.

Rick

Proud member of the Quick UK, Duralite Flight Systems, V-Blade, & KBDD team

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04-05-2009 06:23 AM  9 years agoPost 8
50feet

rrKey Veteran

Wilmington, Delaware

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Watch at YouTube

Youtube BigballVlogs

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04-05-2009 01:20 PM  9 years agoPost 9
vanchop

rrNovice

Gordon's Bay, South africa

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Raptor 90 / Trex 700
I have both - the raptor 90 3D has the V Max conversion on - I am finding it very hard to choose between the two. Not heavy into 3D - doing rolls, flips, walls, loops etc - just starting with inverted hovers. The Raptor also has the new 90 OS motor - more power than the one in the 700. Must say - both vey mush a pleasure to fly. Think at this stage I will say the Raptor is my favourite - lot heavier than the 700.

Ben

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04-05-2009 01:30 PM  9 years agoPost 10
Ben-T-Spindle

rrProfessor

Central Illinois

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The Trex is a good design but the parts quality is very low. That’s the main reason that I will probably not buy another Align product.

My Raptor is always ready to fly but my Trex always needs something – it’s just not as durable as the Raptor.

... BTS

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04-05-2009 02:56 PM  9 years agoPost 11
50feet

rrKey Veteran

Wilmington, Delaware

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+1
That’s the main reason that I will probably not but another Align produce.

Youtube BigballVlogs

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04-05-2009 03:33 PM  9 years agoPost 12
BJames111

rrElite Veteran

San Diego, California

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Colin, nice flight....(walks away shaking my head...LOL)

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04-05-2009 03:51 PM  9 years agoPost 13
leadlag

rrVeteran

Worthing UK

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Both have their pros and cons and you have top decide which are imporant to you.

Personally I would go for the Raptor 90 3D with 690 blades and Super Stubz paddles with no weights.Decent servos and and a good strong servo on the collective.

The 700 is lighter but the R90 will be more mechanically reliable and you will find that parts will not wear as fast and are far less likely to fail.Your machine has to inspire confidence and a unreliable machine does not do this. You will find parts prices slightly more expensive on the R90 and there are more of them hence a heavier heli.

The R90 mechanical mixing is superior to any e-ccpm system. No interaction issues so it will fly straighter and truer and the swash plate is supported and fours sides rather than 3 . Its true you can mix and dial out the interaction on e-ccpm but you will never get the accuracy of mechanical ccpm set up. M-CCPM although makes the heli heavier and ups the part count.

The machine wont make you a better pilot. Only practise does that.

Alan Szabo Raptor 90 did not hang abou and seemed to fly ok.

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04-09-2009 07:12 AM  9 years agoPost 14
mchammer

rrElite Veteran

California,USA

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I own and fly both but have to say the rex700 runs circles around the 90se, even with all of the new 3d mods, all day long. Its not a fair comparison in my opinion. The 700 is way lighter. I think alot of the parts on the raptor are overpriced. I still like flying the raptor none the less.Quality wise they are about the same, both have good and bad points.

Peace Through Superior Firepower!!!

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04-09-2009 09:54 AM  9 years agoPost 15
leadlag

rrVeteran

Worthing UK

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"Quality wise they are about the same"

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04-09-2009 02:27 PM  9 years agoPost 16
BJames111

rrElite Veteran

San Diego, California

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I own and fly both but have to say the rex700 runs circles around the 90se, even with all of the new 3d mods, all day long. Its not a fair comparison in my opinion. The 700 is way lighter. I think alot of the parts on the raptor are overpriced. I still like flying the raptor none the less.Quality wise they are about the same, both have good and bad points.
I highly disagree. Yes the 700 is lighter, but to me, it feels overly "airy", and not controlled. The Raptor flies "locked in and very true" How you can say that the parts are over priced is beyond me...LOL..The 700 parts are just super cheap! and keep in mind you get what you pay for...

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04-09-2009 05:12 PM  9 years agoPost 17
Ben-T-Spindle

rrProfessor

Central Illinois

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"Quality wise they are about the same"
LOL

.

... BTS

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04-09-2009 05:33 PM  9 years agoPost 18
Raffy

rrElite Veteran

Chicago, Illinois

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Lighter or not, if you have the Top End engine and Electronics installed in the heli, you can achieve flying any heli like a pro.

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04-09-2009 07:03 PM  9 years agoPost 19
Kinger

rrElite Veteran

Granville, OH

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Different strokes for different folks.........

Having owned and flown both I can say each one has things I like and things I'm not so fond of. Raptor wins in the quality of plastics and tolerances department hands down. 700 wins in terms of the cost of most replacement parts and their overall availability.

For in flight feel, it just depends on what you want your helicopter to feel like in flight. As Brian pointed out earlier, the 700 has a more "airy" feel to it and through certain maneuvers (especially on windy days) it takes a bit more work at the sticks to get the heli to lock in. On the other hand, the 700 feels more powerful overall due to the fact that it is so much lighter than the Raptor.

In terms of tracking, I actually prefer the 700 to the Raptor in fast forward flight. This was a shock when I first flew the machine because I always throught the Raptor felt better through big fast stuff than other heli's I had flown at the time. I was also surprised by the fact that I wasn't able to easily discern any noticeable interaction issues with the eCCPM layout. Keep in mind that I'm not an FAI pilot and I'm not that great of a 3D pilot either so for me to say I don't notice anything doesn't mean that somebody else wouldn't either.

Currently I'm flying the 700 and while I enjoy flying it VERY much, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase another R90 tomorrow. After flying the R90 for a few seasons I wanted to try something different and the 700 maintained (and in some cases exceeded) the cheap ownership costs of the Raptor and was simple to work on just like the Raptor was. (Two major points points in my decision making criteria as to what other machine I'd like to own.........)

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04-10-2009 08:14 AM  9 years agoPost 20
cd5

rrApprentice

penrith,Australia

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Thanx for the great replies. I guess my next question is how does the new raptor 90 3d feel and fly compared to the older r90 and the se. It seems every one agrees the se is heavy, but the new 3d has done away with some weight, And i beleieve the geometry in the head has changed in the arms on the 3d head.So how big are the improvements built into the 3d kit.
Thanx

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