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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterAlignT-REX 700N › Trex700 maidened. Detailed review.
08-24-2008 08:37 AM  12 years ago
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glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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Trex700 maidened. Detailed review.
If you have already flown your 700, no need to read this post because you know what I’m talking about. (Please skip to “Emotional Issues” and “Mechanical / Setup issues”)

If you have not flown a 700, or are thinking of getting into a 700 and want an analytical review of how it flies form an average pilot, I will try to provide you with some useful information to help you make up your mind. This is the best I can do without actually handing you the transmitter.

First the setup:

Hardware:
Trex700 N, YS91, Hatory SB19, 8717, radix 710 standard, K&S tail blades, 611, Curtis ATG active mode, AR7000 running TP2100 lipo direct. Paddles=Thunder Tiger Red.

Setup:
Pitch +-12 stock head no mods
Gain at 37 (on the Gyro). Mode=3D.

My other 90
Raptor 90 SE lightened. Radix Stickbangers, K&S tail blades, 611, ATG, OS91 SZH w/MP2, CSM Carbsmart, Futaba 9451 running 6v NIMH direct. Paddles = CY Stubz 4mm Paddles - YEI-YB-P484

Setup:
Pitch +-12. with GForce Mixing arms.
Gain at 38 (on the Gyro) mode=3D

At this point, might I suggest that you grab a beverage and sit back this is going to take a while…

Disclamer

Realize that the only thing I have to compare with this heli is My Raptor 90 and my trex 600 so this is my only point of view based on my experiences with these machines. Also I am not a great pilot, but I get around and can do the basic 3D stuff and get low on the deck from time to time. I think I represent the average flyer with 2 years of experience.

At the bench

1. Used the tuning settings recommended with the YS. Pretty much flew this +- 2 clicks all day.
2. Heli was noticeably lighter than my Raptor 90 (empty tank)
3. Made sure throttle geometry was correct and swash was level with swash leveling tool.
4. replaced the align tail blades with K&S paddles.

Trim and Blade tracking

No trim was required, that’s right, none. Blades tracked perfectly. I did use a swash plate leveling tool during setup. Highly recommend it. Track was perfect for all 4 flights.

Tail

Tail was SOLID. No drifting or twitching. Seemed to have good authority. I’m running the 611 with K&S plastic tail blades. It did feel soft when changing directions, so I made a mental note to check binding and moved on.

Cyclic/Collective speed:

I did not expect a night and day difference between the 700N and raptor 90 honestly. My R90 is FAST on the collective. The first collective pumps proved that this heli feels SO much lighter and more aggressive in the air than my Raptor 90 and my Trex 600. I attribute most of the available power to the YS and the light weight airframe. The YS 91 with Hatory SB19 exhibited much more torque than my OS SZH w/carbsmart out of the box. I think the tuning out of the box with the YS is a lot easier. The key is “out of the box”. The OS SZH can be tuned to produce as much power but requires much more fiddling. The YS with factory needles has more power than I’ve ever experienced on any heli. It’s running so rich, that I have to keep the RPMs up at idle. (Even with the Idle set on the lean side).

Tracking and stability

Moving on to some basic circuits, nose in and tail in circles and figure eights and transitions in between. Trying to test tracking through backward/forward transitions. Feels smooth and solid. In comparison to the Vibe90 which I did test fly, it is no where near the Vibe FYI. But for what it is, it’s good. Heli goes where you point it and stays there with minimal correction. My corrections were MUCH more visible than my Raptor. I think this is due to my 8717 being so fast. The transitions did tend to float a little so I had to actually compensate with collective input. My Raptor 90 transitions much more “linearly” and with more momentum. I suspect this is due to the weight of the Raptor.

High speed Big Sky:

On to some high speed stall turns and big loops. Again WOW it was noticeably faster in the air than my Raptor90 and covers ground quick. Again the good tracking helps as I dont have to correct much. Tail held solid. Trying to throw some combinations in there with that kind of speed and it was time to change underwear.
Simply amazing.

Low on the Deck Smackdown

Overall this heli reminds me of the Bobby Watts Stratus flight videos in terms of quickness and smackness. The head on the 700 just feels a lot stiffer than the Raptor. No wobbles on the head when doing quick stops. The Raptor 90 is a bit wobbly on really quick stops, like from a tail slide. Usually if I put fresh dampners on my my Raptor it helps the problem but does not go away completely. So we’ll see how these dampners hold up. The stops are a LOT crisper than my Raptor 90. It gives me more confidence when flying low on the deck. Keep in mind also that I’m running standard radix on my 700 vs. Stick Banger Radix on my Raptor. The raptor tends to mask a lot of my corrections and the stops feel softer so in that way it feels smoother and has more momentum. Something I miss a bit on the 700N to be honest. To each his own.
Anyway the smack is what this heli was designed for. It really is fun to just get down and try some stops and combinations, fast tick tocks, throw in a 4 point, kick it up on a knife edge and piroflip out, and do some rainbows with stops in the middle. Great fun and great confidence through the moves.

Consistency

I flew 4 times today. Each flight only got better as the engine was getting tuned. No real difference in feel between the flights. Everything was real predictable. No leaning out or weird noises.

Overall

The heli is quick and light, crisp and accurate. It does not have the momentum that I feel on my Raptor 90 and you have to be much more solid on the sticks to make it look smooth or the heli will tend to float out of the transitions. In that sense my flying on the 700 looks more “nervous” than my Raptor 90. There is a tradeoff between smoothness and quickness and for the most part I think the Trex is biased toward the quickness at least with my current setup which I feel is what most people are running. You have to be more “on” the heli on the big sky fast moving things because realize things will happen a LOT quicker and you don’t have the momentum to rely on like you do with heavier machines. A lot of people at the field was surprised that I was doing a little Smack as my style is usually smoother, but the Trex really does entice you to try the smack more often

Mechanical / Setup issues
1. I found that my tail servo was binding against the servo horn so a little trimming and the binding was gone.
2. IMPORTANT: The tail boom was not pushed all the way in to the main body. A few taps with a rubber screwdriver to the back fixed it. I was about ½ inch out. I had to readjust my tail control rod lengths too off course. All of this seemed to fix my tail softness problem.
3. The bolts that keep my boom braces on unscrewed! Please use RED LOCKTITE on these.
4. Fuel tank foams like crazy. Not sure how I can fix this. I did NOT dial indicate the fan. But does not seem to affect the motor.. so far.
5. The Front A-Arms are slightly down angled so the swash can be level. But that’s life. Others have opted to trim it. Not sure the pro-s and cons of each method but I did not notice any problems in flight as the flight.
6. I do not have a remote glow setup and no switch, so I have to remove the canopy every time I start the heli. A pain. I would recommend installing a remove glow OR getting a glow driver long enough to fit in the hole of the canopy.

Emotional issues:
Holey F&c* this thing is BAD ASS! Seriously with the crash cost of the 700 so close to the 600, other than fuel consumption, there is really no need to keep the 600 around.
That said, my Raptor 90 is so tried and true and it too is very agressive, but not as agressive as the 700. Compared to the 700 it’s built like a tank and much more solid. I think overall the 700 will NOT crash well. The only way Im getting rid of my Raptor is if I swap it with a high end machine( MA or Vibe SG, Aurora).... which I might consider in the future.

At the end of the day, if I was starting from scratch looking for a cheap-to-crash but performs well machine, get the Trex700. If I were to decide between a Trex600 vs. a 700. Get the 700. You can not loose.

Will post an update after tomorrows flying sessions. Hope this helps.
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08-24-2008 08:43 AM  12 years ago
glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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Also a shout out to Derek for catching my tail issues.
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08-24-2008 10:53 AM  12 years ago
DJDAZ

rrVeteran

Perth Western Australia

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Thanks for the review and all the hard work. Appreciated and a good read
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08-24-2008 01:50 PM  12 years ago
snapshot

rrApprentice

Norwich, UK

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Good review, but I have to correct one thing!

There is only 1 A-Arm and it is at the front!

The others are bellcranks and look nothing like a letter "A"!

Trimming the link on this A-Arm puts all the other links into the correct position and correct setup will not induce geometry errors! Even if you shorten a link, it just means altering all the others.

Apart from that a good review.
T-Rex 700N, T-Rex 600N, T-Rex 600N Flybarless, T-Rex 500
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08-24-2008 03:49 PM  12 years ago
majestic12

rrApprentice

Avon, CO

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Trimming the link on this A-Arm puts all the other links into the correct position and correct setup will not induce geometry errors! Even if you shorten a link, it just means altering all the others.
very true!

A friend of mine just finished his 700 and he noticed something regarding this issue.

All of the link lengths as stated in the manual are diferent from the pictured lengths. It seems that the shorter pictured lengths(with exception of the bellcrank to swash rod!) work with an unaltered a-arm link while the stated lengths work perfect with the the trimmed a-arm link. Kind of a double typo? Wonder if Align had a bit of confusion on these lengths early on and that confusion found its way into the manual and no one caught it.

I'm happy as can be with mine trimmed and everything else perfect 90*. I also just got a cyclic ring for my tx and I can now get +/-13* and no binding with increased swash mix %. Couldn't be happier!

TREX 700N Flybarless
HF:STMPNGRND
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08-24-2008 06:59 PM  12 years ago
glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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Thanks for the error corrections guys. I have edited the post. I posted a bit late in the night I agree that both methods for the a-arms work, up to the builder which one is more appropriate. For me slightly lowering it seems to be fine but I havent flown it enough to really judge it. But yesterday fealt good. We'll see about today.

Off to the field for more testing!
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08-24-2008 07:33 PM  12 years ago
MrMel

rrProfessor

Gotland

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Nice review,

I would suggest you try a couple of CF blades instead of the K&B
plastic tails,

They are soft, and the stops with them will be soft too regardless (and inconsistent piro rate during high wind).
Ive tried numerous times since I really liked visually appealing of the the orange ones, but its no substitute for good CF blades on a .90
Gone fishing..or hunting..or something
My site: http://heli.dacsa.net - VBar videos and more
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08-26-2008 12:17 AM  12 years ago
Rockohaulic

rrElite Veteran - Canyon Country, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun - MyPosts All  Forum  Topic

Hey buddy - you do seem happy with it! Aren't you glad you got off your @ss and built it finally!
Mechanical / Setup issues
2. IMPORTANT: The tail boom was not pushed all the way in to the main body. A few taps with a rubber screwdriver to the back fixed it. I was about ½ inch out. I had to readjust my tail control rod lengths too off course. All of this seemed to fix my tail softness problem.
3. The bolts that keep my boom braces on unscrewed! Please use RED LOCKTITE on these.
4. Fuel tank foams like crazy. Not sure how I can fix this. I did NOT dial indicate the fan. But does not seem to affect the motor.. so far.
My experiences:

#2. I screwed up the "U-shaped" cut out area of the front of my boom when I installed it. And mine was not completely seated also, but only by about 1/8 inch. This allowed it to rotate in flight during a tail-first maneuver (when the pitch slider screw came loose and all hell broke loose). Anyway, to fix this, in addition to loosening the 4 bolts to slip the boom in, also loosen the 2 rear-most screws that hold the plastic boom mount assembly. This will allow you to insert the boom easily so that you do not screw up that U-shaped section of the boom.

#3. My boom brace bolts came loose too! And the one behind the pipe required me to remove my Hatori to tighten it! Definately use red loctite here!

#4. My fuel tank foams or what I like to describe as "looks like the perfect storm inside". And I DID dial indicate the fan. I understand this is a characteristic of the pressure system from the YS motor.
Saturday morning I flew my helicopter in my pajamas
How it got in my pajamas I'll never know
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08-26-2008 01:07 AM  12 years ago
glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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I have found the culprit of the foaming fuel tank. I do not think it is charasteristic of the YS. By getting your midrange just right, you will eliminate any foaming. I was foaming like a crazy dog until about a days worth of tuning with my midrange. To tune the YS for a close-to perfect midrange this is what I did. I found the only way to tune the YS is by sound and flying it around. You cant rely on temps.

Set needles at factory.

Hover and do some circuits.
Land. Let engine rev down.
Now throttle up. If the engine choaks and wants to die when throttling up, lean the idle. Keep doing this until the engine does not choak or die at spoolup.

Now bring it back up to a hover and it should sound smooth and produce smoke. If there is too little smoke or it sounds intermittent, ritchen the engine. Watch the tail, if the tail is twitching this is a sign of ritch midrange. Lean the midrange until the tail stops twitching.
Land. Let idle for a few seconds.

Now spool up again. If this time the engine surges up or revs up very quickly, your midrange is too lean, back it out one click at a time as this will become very sensitive at this point.

The high speed I found pretty much stays at break in settings as per instructions. I went about 3 clicks lean from factory. The important part is to shoot a few autos. If the motor hangs, ritchen the high speed until it doesnt hang anymore.

After doing all this, I got a nicely tuned engine with no foaming and i'm fogging up the entire field with smoke and still plenty of power.

Unlike the OS, the YS likes it ritcher and actually produces more power that way. Also unlike the OS, the needles actually make sence to me.
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08-26-2008 01:08 AM  12 years ago
glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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I did also hear that with the kasama header, it is much harder to find that perfect midrange.
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08-26-2008 03:51 AM  12 years ago
Ken Filloon

rrVeteran

Highland, Michigan

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A friend and I spent some time tuning our SR,s yesterday and found the best way to tune the mid is to put the heli in a sideways tic toc and beat the crap out of it. The power will drop off quickly if you do not have it set right. They ended up being close to 1.5 turns out running CP 30% fuel. This setting proved to produce the most power while really loading the head. The high speed needle is about 3/4 to 7/8 out. When tuned properly this motor pulls like no other and the back plate runs cool to the touch.
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08-26-2008 11:07 PM  12 years ago
glfloat

rrApprentice

Santa Monica California

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Good point, yes I did do some sideways tictocs while flyign around to load it up and see if it falls off. Sure enough my first try my tictocs were falling off. So leaning the midrange fixed that.
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08-27-2008 02:27 AM  12 years ago
inkspot1967

rrProfessor

Cranston Ri

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4. replaced the align tail blades with K&S paddles.
ok how did you put paddles on the tail......
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08-29-2008 07:15 AM  12 years ago
mchammer

rrElite Veteran

California,USA

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nice review!!! definitely get some carbon tail blades you will be glad you did.Peace Through Superior Firepower!!!
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08-04-2010 03:36 AM  10 years ago
rtdillon

rrApprentice

Huntsville, AL

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Pattles on the tail!?
That has to have some serious tail rates! ROFL.
No,No..The other left!
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08-06-2010 07:05 PM  10 years ago
Steve Cochrane

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Mount Dora,Florida

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I noticed the same when I switched from a Raptor 90 3D to a Trex 700,the trex is a nice machine and like you said has a lot of smack capabilities and is alot quicker.Thanks for the info and nice to here from some one who has flown both the Raptor vs. Trex.I still like both of them and will continue flying both of them.Steve Cochrane (Fullpitch)
T.O.R.C.H.S. Orlando Member
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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterAlignT-REX 700N › Trex700 maidened. Detailed review.
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