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HomeAircraftHelicopterAerial Photography and Video › Maxi Joker 2 Advice
03-07-2008 07:42 AM  10 years agoPost 1
LTP

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Miami, FL

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I know this has been discussed before but I recently had a bad crash with my gasser and I'm considering going electric. If I do I need to lift about 10lbs total payload. Can a Joker 2 handle those types of payloads and still give me more than 10 min worth of flight times. If anybody is lifting this much can you also let me know what setup you are using? Thanks and I appreciate in advance any input you may have.

Luis

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03-07-2008 05:07 PM  10 years agoPost 2
flyboy

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North America

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IMHO, 8lbs max and 8 minuets with out abusing your battery/s.
This is just my opinion some others might differ.
FB

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03-07-2008 05:56 PM  10 years agoPost 3
rroback

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Irvine (UCI), Ca

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I'd agree with FB on this one. You might be able to squeeze out 10, but what are you carrying that weighs 10 lbs? auw of 20lbs seems to be the safe max.

Rhett..... I can't fly, but the Profi sure can.

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03-08-2008 08:27 PM  10 years agoPost 4
snurre

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Sweden, Stockholm

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I do not yet have experience of my own, but Minicopter, the manufacturer, recommends max payload 4kg : approx 9lbs.
Then you should use the Plettenberg motor option.

I have ordered a MJ2 to carry a FlyPod rig and a Nikon 300D. Most likely there will be a Garmin GPS attached to the camera with some cablage. I expect this combination to arrive at max recommended weight.

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03-08-2008 08:44 PM  10 years agoPost 5
rroback

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Irvine (UCI), Ca

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I'm not sure the pletti is the best motor. I used it for a while, then switched to an actro 32-4, and my flight time went up ( at the same headspeed of course). I wish I still had it, so I can run a new series of tests. the pletti might potentially have less vibration, but I just remember it coming down quite warm. Perhaps things change when running 10s, vs my setup of 12s.

Rhett..... I can't fly, but the Profi sure can.

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03-08-2008 08:59 PM  10 years agoPost 6
snurre

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Sweden, Stockholm

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Hi rroback,
Do you experience vibrations induced by your present motor?
What headspeed and gear ratio are you using?

As for the heat of the Plettenberg, well, again, I do not have this particular experience, but Minicopter recommends 10S and if you run it on 12S I suppose you did alter the original gear ratio, otherwise I would expect the ESC and motor to work less effecient.

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03-08-2008 09:02 PM  10 years agoPost 7
rroback

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Irvine (UCI), Ca

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well, it's been a while since I had the pletti. I was using the smallest pinion you could get back then (which was 14t I think). It would likely work much better if I had one of the currently available 12t pinions, although I'm not sure the pletti likes spinning that fast. I have some vibes I'm slowly hunting down, not tremendous, but more then there should be. I've balanced the actro can, and spun it up in my hand, and it seems to be smooth.

Rhett..... I can't fly, but the Profi sure can.

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03-08-2008 09:45 PM  10 years agoPost 8
ehx

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Northern Minnesota

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"Ten pounds for ten minutes" is reasonable for the Maxi Joker. The most important component will be the battery. At this payload and flight duration you will want a larger battery then is typically used. For an electric, the battery is really the engine. Either motor, the Pletti or Actro 32-4, will have no problem if fed enough power. I've done lifting tests with payloads up to 7kg (15+ pounds). Not that I would routinely fly at that weight, but the tests show where the weak points of your system are.

While "ten pounds for ten minutes" is doable with the Maxi, I wouldn't really recommend trying it as your first electric setup since you are pushing the limits and everything needs to be fine tuned. Battery costs usually scare most people off, but if the $ don't bother you and you set the power system up right you will be OK.

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03-08-2008 11:06 PM  10 years agoPost 9
rroback

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Irvine (UCI), Ca

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I'd agree I could go longer, if I put in a bigger battery. Most people run 10s, 8000mah packs, which gives you about 40v*8amp= 320 watt hours. I'm running 12s, 5000 mah packs---- 48*5= 240 watt hours. if I ran close to 6, or 7,000 mah packs, I could hit 10 minutes, no problemo. I do 8 minutes, and take 3000mah out, max.

Rhett..... I can't fly, but the Profi sure can.

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03-09-2008 12:08 AM  10 years agoPost 10
ehx

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Northern Minnesota

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The ballpark battery size would be 10S, 10 Amp or the equivalent at 12S, 14S, ... whatever is the best match for your motor/ESC/gearing.

It's very important not to go cheap here. You need a high quality ~25C battery. Lesser batteries won't do it. At least not for very long.

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03-09-2008 05:16 AM  10 years agoPost 11
BungeeMike

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Honolulu, Hawaii

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I just got my maxi v2 through field test and out making money (finally) I am running 10s tanics 8500 mah the new ones, Big blue pletti, poptart esc, 12 th pinion turning 1350 headspeed, gov mode. Payload weight is 9 lbs flight times 10 minutes mostly hover and it uses 4000 mah leaving plenty reserve. Temps on motor 125-130, esc 100, batt 104-108 F ambient temp 85-90 F Very pleased with its performance.
The intent was to run the esc as close to 100% as possible per other posts so as not to get the esc too hot. The new tanics are heavy more so than the TP. Talking with max amps to see about custom packs. In talking with others I think 12 would be the way to go but I have several sets of 10s so thats where I'm at. I will be testing up to 12 lbs payload this weekend. Pilots consensus is this wont be a problem as long as we dont have to auto it in.
My thoughts
Bungee

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03-09-2008 05:23 AM  10 years agoPost 12
kiwidave1

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Seattle, WA

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I know this isn't what Luis was asking, but I am thinking about going in the other direction and using FP 10S 3700 packs. 5 minute flight time but at $400 I could get 3 or 4 and have found that for most of my stuff more, shorter flights are a better combination. I am only doing photos but for up, shot and down 5 minutes is amble.

I am wondering how the less weight (10s 3700 V. 10S 7500mah) will effect flight times too?

I get 9 minutes with Tanic 10S5P 7500mAh 10-12C (old) carrying the pro mini, D80 and Tokina 12-24mm (heavy lens) and downlink camera etc. Don't know the weight but the setup is heavy. Normally put back in 5000-5700mah

Cheers!

David

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

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03-09-2008 03:12 PM  10 years agoPost 13
Seablade

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earth

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poptart ESC
Lol! as good a name as any for it. Once you've seen it LTP you'd understand!

"Vini, Vidi, Velcro"

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03-09-2008 04:48 PM  10 years agoPost 14
snurre

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Sweden, Stockholm

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Seablade,
What does LTP stand for?

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03-09-2008 04:55 PM  10 years agoPost 15
snurre

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Sweden, Stockholm

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Those of you running big packs, like 8000mAh and so, were there any challanges to accomodate the physical size of the packs onto the heli and with respect to the center of gravity?
Are you flying with or without the canopy?
Maybe you would have photos to share on your installations?

Initially I will be starting out small, with two 5S4500mAh serial connected Zippy-R packs. I am curious to see what flight time that will give me on my total setup.

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03-12-2008 12:29 PM  10 years agoPost 16
puneetp

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Bangalore, India

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( I am talking only wild theory , practical aspects you can refute or support )

Is there a way to get smaller pinion, using power jazz , run 15S pack. High voltage more efficient system. Estimate a 5000mah pack would do safely 10min - 10lb

Its not tried with MJ , but many will have in mind after power jazz is available with 15s support. Not sure if 32-4 will like that high rpm.

Machine over Gravity

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03-13-2008 03:13 PM  10 years agoPost 17
Seablade

rrKey Veteran

earth

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Seablade,
What does LTP stand for?
Sorry Snure, I haven't come back to the post until now.

You will have to ask "LTP" if he ever comes back to his own post!

"Vini, Vidi, Velcro"

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03-18-2008 06:34 AM  10 years agoPost 18
tribologist

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S.Windsor, Ct, USA

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Power requirement vs Payload for MaxiJoker 2
I'm looking at the possibility of using a Maxi Joker 2 for a UAV demo. It seem like the consensus is that 10kg/20lb is max safe take off weight. Is that a valid number?

What is the empty weight for a lean built Maxi Joker 2? Eg everything but the battery pack.

Is there any cells in this size range that allow discharge at 20-30C?

Does anyone have some estimate of power requirements as a function of take off weight? What is the best motor/blade/speed controller setup for a high lift, max efficiency application?

I would also like to hear from someone that would be willing to perform actual current measurements vs take off weight. I would like to get that measurements done before we are getting our system on order. If possible over the next week or so. I have no problems paying for it on a PO. Please send me a email if you are interested to:

jonssouj (curly A) Cox dot net

Ulf

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03-18-2008 07:30 AM  10 years agoPost 19
rroback

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Irvine (UCI), Ca

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The efficiency greatly depends on setup. 20lb is correct. I've a fan of my actro 32-4, 12s, 5000mah lipo's, powerjazz esc. everything is cool to the touch. take off weight does affect current, but I'd think between about 19-21lbs, there won't be a ton of difference. if you can get to say 17lbs, you'll gain some flight time, but it will also depend on how you fly.

Rhett..... I can't fly, but the Profi sure can.

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03-18-2008 02:37 PM  10 years agoPost 20
HawkEyeMedia

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Fort Worth, Texas

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At 20 lbs take off weight, my MJ2 will draw an average of 25 amps at 36 volts to hover. Actro 32-4, Jazz 55-10-32 ESC, 800mm blades turning 1250.

The heli weighs a little over 8 lbs, 7.5 lb payload, and 4 lbs of batteries. That's about 45 watts per pound. A rough estimate of the impact of payload would be to calculate the change in power required based on the change in weight. Sure you can get it to hover with a large payload, but the real test is going to be when you attempt to arrest a fast descent on a set of batteries that are nearly spent.

I've logged 50 amp peaks at near max collective, which is about the limit of the my ESC.

The MJ2's are pretty lean as is, I don't know how much you could trim off that would make much difference.

Mark LaBoyteaux
HawkEyeMedia.com

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