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HomeOff Topics › HELP needed: 3D Plank
03-05-2008 11:50 PM  10 years agoPost 1
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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I've been test running some different props on my new Great Planes "Reactor 46 ARF".......
I have yet to see even 13,000 rpm on the ground even with the smallest prop!!!

The motor is a Magnum XLS-46(ABC) with OS #A3(HOT) plug and Byron 15% nitro with 18% oil(castor/syn mix).

The motor was broken in about 8 months ago and flown a few times on a trainer... I don't recall ever putting a tach to it though... It then sat for the last 7 months stored SEALED with PLENTY of after run oil.

I could only get 11,300 rpm with a Zinger Pro 12x4 prop, and 12,500 with a 11x5...

According to the Magnum manual, I should be getting between 13 and 16,000 rpm on the ground and the motor redlines at 17,500

The main needle is open one turn exactly to get max rpm on the ground.
Transition is fast and smooth, and the motor sounds good at full throttle.

I am getting dirty looking oil coming out of the muffler kind of like when you break in a new motor, only this motor was already run for almost a gallon of fuel. The manual suggests half a gallon of break in time....

Piston and cylinder wall are spotless. Plug looks brand new.

Am I seeing my rear bearing failing or is the motor just not broken in fully?? I am so lost here. The motor was mounted upright int he trainer, and is now almost fully inverted in the Reactor... don't know if that has anything to do with it or not.. I also have video of the motor running if anyone would like to hear it. The bearings "feel" silky smooth when turning the crankshaft, but you can hear a tiny bit of noise while rotating it... It is not the sound of the carb because I made sure to have the carb open while turning the crankshaft.

I plan to run Byron 15% nitro with only 16% oil while flying 3D...but I doubt the 2% less oil is going to bring my static rpm's up to what I am expecting to see... I want this motor to get 15,000 rpm on the ground with a large diameter, small pitch, prop. My prop of choice is the 11x5 or 12x4

I don't know what the problem is here...
Anyone see something I am missing?? Or should I just throw $20 worth of bearings in the motor and try it again?

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-05-2008 11:57 PM  10 years agoPost 2
phattalon

rrApprentice

Anderson, Indiana

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I run 30% cool power in my .46 and .50 with a apc 12.25x3.75 prob on the .46 and a 13x4 narrow on my .50. Try the 30% heli fuel and 12.25x3.75 prob and see what you get with the magnum.

Jason Russell

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03-06-2008 12:09 AM  10 years agoPost 3
ZXXflyer

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stone mountain, georgia, US

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But the motor is ABC AND the manual says no more than 15% nitro?

I personally won't run a non-ringed motor without at least a little castor in the fuel.. as for the 12.25x3.75, well that's not gunna bring my rpm up any signifigant ammount...

this motor needs to get enough rpm while "static" on the ground to be at peak HP/Torque...

I was holding the plane vertical in my hands, at full throttle, and the plane didn't have any climb "pull" when I let go of it... It will definately hover at full power, but will not climb much.

I can't help but feel that the dirty colored oil coming out of the exhaust is somehow related to the lack of rpm....

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-06-2008 07:02 AM  10 years agoPost 4
mbrewer

rrApprentice

Corpus Christi, TX

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try an apc or one of them black Evo scimitar props. I have a os46ax w/apc 11x6 on a 4.9 lb plane and it hovers a little above half throttle.

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03-06-2008 07:22 AM  10 years agoPost 5
ZXXflyer

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stone mountain, georgia, US

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This is a 6 pound plane....

even if I had gone with mini servos instead of standard, it would have only shaved 3 ounces off total weight...

The battery pack is 6V(5 cells) so that costs an extra ounce..

The finished weight of the plane is supposed to be 5.2-6.2 pounds

The only way to have come in at 5 pounds would be to go brushless instead of nitro..

But I have seen crazy video of this plane performing with nitro 2 and 4 stroke motors...

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-06-2008 07:35 AM  10 years agoPost 6
nivlek

rrProfessor

Norfolk England

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The 12.25x3.75 won't increase your rpm , but it will increase your static thrust . I have a fun fly model , weighing around 6 pounds , fitted with an OS 50SX . I run it on straight fuel , with no headshim . On a 11 x 7 I didn't have enough power to prophang even on full throttle . I changed to the 12.25x3.75 , had no change in rpm but can now prophang at half stick and accelerate rapidly away vertically .

At the end of the day , it gets dark .

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03-07-2008 12:08 AM  10 years agoPost 7
ZXXflyer

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stone mountain, georgia, US

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It seems the motor still needs some more break in time.....

Put a 10x6 prop on and the rpm's came up to almost 15K

AND

I am getting air bubbles in the fuel!

I now have to loace the air leak... theres only about 6 or 7 places it can be coming in.
I guess that's the price you sometimes pay when using a remote needle valve assembly..

Some more APC props are on the way from Tower Hobbies... I ordered the 12.25x3.75, a 11x4, and a 11.5x4

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-07-2008 02:12 AM  10 years agoPost 8
2LTime

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Walworth,NY

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Get one of the Tower .46 mufflers, adds about 1K for $15.

Jeff

If you can't learn to do it well, learn to enjoy doing it badly.

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03-07-2008 02:21 AM  10 years agoPost 9
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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So I've been told...

but it won't clear the fuselage.

AND

their out of stock till late march.

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-07-2008 02:28 AM  10 years agoPost 10
shuttlepilot

rrElite Veteran

Mullins, South Carolina

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I have usually had the best results with a 11x6 prop on that size engine. Of course in flight you should run up more rpm. Does it say it should run 17,000 static? I never really worried about taching a 2 stroke plank engine.....but that's just me.

Gas is Great
Camper Fuel is Better!!
QWW Helis

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03-07-2008 02:32 AM  10 years agoPost 11
ZXXflyer

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stone mountain, georgia, US

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manual states 14-16K rpm static on the ground is preferred, and should be capable on 15% nitro with the props I have been testing...

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-08-2008 11:44 AM  10 years agoPost 12
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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SNEAKY Magnum

There is a VERY restrictive baffle installed in the stock muffler!
I have removed it and now the motor should turn up another thousand rpm or so.

I will add a picture of the baffle shortly.

Got a new o-ring on the main needle, so hopefully no more bubbles in the fuel.

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-08-2008 10:34 PM  10 years agoPost 13
ket

rrVeteran

ohio hill country

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up grade to the magnum 52fs big difference in power ..

needle O ring can be a pain. put something around threads so you dont scar up new O ring.. like a piece of tape..

I have always just run 15% on my 2stroke motors.. might not get the power that you get useing 20% or higher but engine will last longer.

as for 3D I would really recomend a nice 4stroke. like the magnume 52fs. its the torq that allows you to hover.. well thats what we do around here..

just my.02 worth,, which in Us funds will cost about .33

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03-08-2008 10:46 PM  10 years agoPost 14
ZXXflyer

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stone mountain, georgia, US

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I wish I could afford a four stroker to put on it!!!
But I already had the new Magnum 46 laying around......
I LOVE the way the a four stroke sounds.

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-08-2008 10:53 PM  10 years agoPost 15
Mutt

rrKey Veteran

M ca usa

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up grade to the magnum 52fs big difference in power ..
THe magnum 52fs is a sucky engine like the rest of them over weight under powered engines from them are. If your were going to go to a 4 stroke saito 72 or even a .82 would be good. the magnum 52 would be so under powered in that thing it wouldnt be funny quote from the manual on that plane.
Glow Engine: .46-.51cu in (7.8-8cc) 2-stroke OR .70 cu in (11.5cc)4-stroke
For the OP remove the baffle in the stock muffler try a 11x4 on it if you cant get the wanted power on a 12x4 or a 12.25x3.75.

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03-11-2008 01:10 AM  10 years agoPost 16
ket

rrVeteran

ohio hill country

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I have had real good luck with the magnum 52fs. I have put in on planks that would barely lift off ground with magnum 46 and had alot more power using the mag 52fs.. must be application that makes the difference.

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03-11-2008 01:46 AM  10 years agoPost 17
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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I did some more test running today.....

The motor picked up about 7-800 rpm without the baffle, and the exhaust tone didn't change very much at all.

There is finally clean oil coming out of the muffler. I guess the motor just needed another 20 minutes of break-in at full throttle.

The main needle is exactly one turn out and I am getting 15,500 rpm with an APC 10x6 prop. It pulls like **** at full throttle and the idle is so slow you can see the prop. Cylinder head temps at full throttle were about 240 degrees F. I'm still running the Byron 15% nitro 18% oil. I will be test running with 15% nitro 16% oil tomorrow, and the new APC props will be here Friday. I ordered 11x4, 11.5x4, and 12.25x3.75

The bubbles in the fuel line are not coming from the main needle like I thought.... I am getting foaming in the tank at 1/4 throttle. The tank in this plane is hard mounted in balsa.

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-11-2008 04:37 AM  10 years agoPost 18
shuttlepilot

rrElite Veteran

Mullins, South Carolina

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It's not a "real" fix, but you can put a drop or two of armor all in a gallon of fuel, and it won't foam. It really works. I have used it with my 46 and it worked really good. I know it's not a "fix" for vibrations in helis, but with the plank it should help.

Gas is Great
Camper Fuel is Better!!
QWW Helis

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03-11-2008 04:51 AM  10 years agoPost 19
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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Yeah... I learned the armorall trick a few monts ago from someone online. And yes it really does work. I have mounted a different prop and will see how the vibes are tomorrow. I actually used the armorall trick for a while in my hawk pro to fight the foaming tank...then I went to running a header tank.

I also intend to tinker with the idle needle adjustment to see if I can get the midrange to run smoother without leaning the idle too much....

Believer in Weston motors!

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03-13-2008 10:32 AM  10 years agoPost 20
ZXXflyer

rrKey Veteran

stone mountain, georgia, US

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Do any of yall have to balance your APC props???

If so, how much is an acceptable ammount of weight to add for balancing?

Two of my new APC props are WAY out of balance, and the third is PERFECT.

I painted an inch of paint on the tips of both propellors(front and back).... I then had to add a strip of 1/8" vinyl trim tape around the tips just under the paint line... Then the balance was good.

I've never had to paint more than half an inch on the tip of a propellor for balance... usually I can blance one with just a stripe of the trim tape around one tip.

Will post pics ASAP.....

Believer in Weston motors!

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