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HomeAircraftHelicopterPainting › A question for the paint sprayers...
02-07-2008 11:53 PM  10 years agoPost 21
bigdad390

rrVeteran

East. Liverpool, Ohio

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Sounds like fisheye, use a fisheye eliminator or clean off all oils, including finger prints from your canopy.

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02-08-2008 12:07 AM  10 years agoPost 22
ferincr

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From Argentina now in Costa Rica

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Well, definitely fish eyes, funny thing is the primer goes well and then the color is the one giving me problems, anyway I bought a degreaser and paper towels they told to wipe in one direction only too, so I'll try that tomorrow after I finish sanding all the paint off and start from scratch.
I asked for an additive for the paint but it seems like they don't have such a thing here.
The scary part is that they also said that the clear coat is even more difficult and if I get fish eyes on it it's going to be a mess since if I sand it I'll ruin the color too
We'll see what happens if I ever make it to that point

Intelligence chases me, but I'm a lot faster! Fernando

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02-08-2008 12:19 AM  10 years agoPost 23
bigdad390

rrVeteran

East. Liverpool, Ohio

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use a fisheye Eliminator!!!!

https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishProdu...96-297480fe6be5

http://www.sherwin-automotive.com/p...uct=9836&cat=50

http://www.pivco.net/Merchant2/merc...egory_Code=cata

etc,,

Cause: Fisheyes are caused by spraying paint or topcoat over surfaces which have oil, wax, silicone and/or grease contamination. They can also be caused when thinner/reducer is used in place of a solvent cleaner or when paint is sprayed over previously repaired areas containing “fisheye eliminator” additive.

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02-08-2008 12:34 AM  10 years agoPost 24
Mike0251

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Hills of the Blue Ridge VA

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You do not have to sand all the paint off if you do not want to (weight). Just a nice even sanding to provide the bite for the next layer of paint. I also would not use paper towels as it can leave much lint. I use a small hand towel, like the ones that find their way into your suitcase from your latest buisness travel motel stay...I didn't say that...lol. Wet the towel, but not overly so, and just give the thing a good wiping, leaving a wet film as you go. Let it dry thoroughly (10 min). Also, most guns with just a 0-1/2 trigger pull will just pass air and not paint, right before you begin to spray, let the air hit the surface for any last second particles that may have settled. Its winter, so static is high, and this can attrach things to your canopy. Nice even light coats, light. Let the coats build the color. Always move the gun, never pause. I did this in my workshop in one evening with paint I had laying around. Good luck to you. I love to paint!
Edit-Well, winter here anyway...lol. When your color or colors are done, PM me about the clear coat if you would like.
Edit2-You do know, that your main color will give off diferent hues based upon your ground coat color. So, if your shooting your color over a gray primer, that will tend to dull it out some. If you paint the entire canopy in white (what I did) then your colors tend to be more vibrant. And so on, over gold, silver, and black. they all do interesting things to the colors. I could go on and on about this, I'll shut up for now.
Mike

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02-08-2008 01:30 AM  10 years agoPost 25
bagobitz

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saddleworth,lancs,UK

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The one thing that nobody's mentioned....contaminated air!!!!

diaphragm-type compressors are oil-free but the vast majority that are used for(spraygun-type) spraying are piston-type and will carry over oil and water vapours. That's why sprayshop pressure-regulators normally incorporate an oil and water separator.

I've always used PANEL WIPE(a spirit specially formulated for the job)
on industrial paper-towel...rags are a definite NO..I have also used WHITE toilet-roll sucsessfully. if any dust is seen after cleaning with panel-wipe, a light stroke with a tack-rag is all that's needed.

As others stated, a full strip is not needed...if your primer coat was sound, the contaminant is likely on it's surface,so flat back to primer, clean off with spirit-wipe/panel wipe (from auto paint factors) turn pad frequently,re-wipe till paper doesn't pick up dirt/sanding residue.

As others have stated, it's better to seal surface with light, dryish "dust" coats of colour,until the whole surface is covered..you should then be able to hang a wet coat on with impunity.

I'll also second GLOVES (nitrile/vinyl/latex...personal preference)

skin contamination is a notorious cause of fisheyes(aka CISSING)

as is contaminated air and new sprayguns have been known to have oil internally, so it's always worth flushing the airways as well as the fluid passages,before use.

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02-08-2008 01:43 AM  10 years agoPost 26
ferincr

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From Argentina now in Costa Rica

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Thanks Mike I might take your offer to PM you if I ever make it to the clear coat.
The reason I'm sanding it off is weight, but I ran out of skin in my fingers (that two part primer is hard!!!)
As far as contaminated air, I did put a water separator at the bottom of the gun, I don't know if this would also take care of any oil particles or should I get anything different for that.
There is not fish eye eliminator here, I asked today at the shop. Anyway we'll see how it goes next time being more careful about fingers and wiping. It can't be that difficult!!!
Thanks all,
I'll keep you posted about the progress (if there is any...)

Intelligence chases me, but I'm a lot faster! Fernando

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02-08-2008 02:02 AM  10 years agoPost 27
nappyroots2182

rrElite Veteran

Moline, il

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get an adhesion promotor and also a flex additive. the promotor will help paint stick reducing chances of fish eyes. flex will keep paint flexible to resist cracking from taking the canopyon and off. i work in a body shop and paint all my canopies there. ive even had very nice results on plastic canopies. id wet sand the canopy with your degreaser to really help get it clean with about 400grit

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02-08-2008 02:34 AM  10 years agoPost 28
bagobitz

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saddleworth,lancs,UK

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With 2-pack I would first degrease the fibreglass thoroughly with spirit-wipe then cleaan in washing-up liquid and hot water, using a scotchbrite abrasive pad (the reason being that fibreglass is normally laid-up in a mould coated with wax or silicone release-agent)

It is imperative that all traces of release-agent are eliminated, both inside and outside,as handling can transfer it around.

Scotchbrite comes in several grades and the "ultrafine" will sand to about 1,000 grit standard..a good moulding will be satin-smooth and matt after this is used.

after primer/filler application, Iflat with 220,open-coat production paper (DRY) then scotchbrite, tack/blow offf, then colour coat.

gave up wet-sanding 15-20 years ago,likewise, if a random orbital sander won't get in, it's the minimum of hand-rubbing and use scotchbrite for any awkward corners,contours or edges.

got fed-up with drying-off and blowing-out crevices,not to mention the edges always seemed to rub bare with wet-sanding.

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02-08-2008 04:26 AM  10 years agoPost 29
lfalsetto

rrKey Veteran

COLORADO

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I have also seen this when the gun is cleaned. Contaminate will get in the gun, if you clean the gun on a dirty/oily table and set your rag on the table you may contaminate the inside of teh cup.

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02-08-2008 04:41 AM  10 years agoPost 30
tadawson

rrElite Veteran

Lewisville, TX

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Also make sure that your air hose has never been run in any environment that could have gotten oil in it. I have specific, separate hoses for clean and fog-oiled air - to the point of using different size fittings so I can't screw up and mix them . . . never had a problem.

- Tim

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02-08-2008 10:09 AM  10 years agoPost 31
Mike0251

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Hills of the Blue Ridge VA

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Plenty of good advice here for sure. Your fingers should not be sore! Wet sand with a 320 grit, move to 400, and then 600. 320 will cut right thru that urethane primer. Don't push hard, let the paper do the work. When I mentioned a white base coat, thats how I got my pin stripes too...I did not paint the pins (striping tape). And although I mentioned I shot the paint in one evening, I neglected to mention there was another evening dedicated to taping, masking, etc..lol. Paint is the easy part, prep is the time. If you using a gravity gun your pressure should be around 45psi, much much less if HVLP (10psi). Thats at the gun, not back at the compressor 20 feet down the hose or so too. To check your system, put a piece of paper up against something and pull the trigger on the gun (no paint) and let it rip for 30 seconds or so...any crap hit the paper? If so, you found a source of contamination. I run an oil/water separator and two filters on a dedicated second hose just for painting from the compressor. Hope to hear of some good results!

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02-09-2008 10:50 PM  10 years agoPost 32
ferincr

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From Argentina now in Costa Rica

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Well...
Thank you all one more time.
I managed to get fish eye reducer today as well as water based degreaser so I managed to paint my first canopy!!!

If it wasn't so bad I would post pics, but after the ones that have been posted here mine is quite pathetic, anyway, if it last more than a couple of weekends I'd be surprised at the rate I've been crashing lately...

So, this is the starting point hopefully I'll improve with more experience.
The worse part was that since I had to sand a lot (and few times) the prep work wasn't the best, so I need to improve there.
But then again thanks for all the tips, they helped a lot.
Fernando

Intelligence chases me, but I'm a lot faster! Fernando

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