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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterRadio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt › new spartan gyro finally arrived.....thanks royal mail!
08-03-2007 11:07 PM  13 years ago
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raptorheli2

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rip off britain and no changing it

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new spartan gyro finally arrived.....thanks royal mail!
well after an anxious 5 day wait with royal snail on strike most of this week i finally got my spartan gyro.

i have taken some pics of it next to my 611 sensor for a guide on it's size. it must be a good 3-4 times lighter than a 611 sensor and smaller as you can see. i will hopefully get a chance to fly it over weekend weather permitting and all going well will be buying more. ohhh i love a new gyro

anyone else got one of these yet?


www.waterfoothelis.com
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08-04-2007 06:48 AM  13 years ago
DOKEY

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Northamptonshire UK

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anyone else got one of these yet?
Andy at http://www.realraptors.co.uk has one to try out, and I'm off soon to hopefully install it and give it a whirl.
Very much looking forward to see what this little package has to offer!
I will report back later, to let you know what we think.

Paul, sorry I did not reply to your PM, computer was playing up.
Ryan.
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08-04-2007 10:52 AM  13 years ago
Autoeject

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Ashtabula, OH, USA

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I take it that the strike is over? I'm awaiting a delivery, too. I'm anxious to get it installed before IRCHA.Mark Webber
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08-04-2007 11:01 AM  13 years ago
9387ASH

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UK

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Strike is ongoing.. different areas different days.. becoming a Royal Pain in the A$$ !
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08-04-2007 11:07 AM  13 years ago
Autoeject

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As if regular postal delays weren't enoughMark Webber
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08-04-2007 12:19 PM  13 years ago
Barney

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Inverness Scotland

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There is a lot of miss-information being circulated by RM about this dispute...

At least the Posties have had the guts to stand up against Alan Leighton, Crozier etc as they are the ones who have been systematically destroying Royal Mail to line there own pockets...
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08-04-2007 06:07 PM  13 years ago
Autoeject

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I'm sure that we don't know the half of it. Like most entities these days, executives seem at a loss to properly manage thier companies. Lining their own pockets while destroying the company that allowed them to do so seems prevelant. The end result is that they can no longer line their pockets. Or end up in prison.

That said, my parcel arrived today I can't believe how small this gyro is. Thanks, Royal Mail!
Mark Webber
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08-04-2007 08:55 PM  13 years ago
9387ASH

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UK

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HMG have also got a part to play in it. One of the problems is that all the services that the Post Office used to provide have been withdrawn by HMG or are forcing people to use online facilities( TV Licence, Car Tax, Pension etc etc). Govt departments are now using couriers for their own mail instead of Royal mail.

Other services are now allowed to do mail but obviously they can pick and choose the more lucrative areas.... RM are legally obliged to do all the non-lucrative areas, so with all the cuts and same overheads something has to go..... thats what Royal mail are fighting. To keep the post offices open.... etc
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08-04-2007 10:52 PM  13 years ago
Barney

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Inverness Scotland

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I must admit it's kinda heartning that a few of you realise whats happening. cheers Tony/Mark..

The government appointed regulator needs to take a 'Reality pill'

Maybe I wasn't smart enough to get a real good Job but have always worked hard for what I do get..

Iv'e been a frontline (letters) delivery postman for 21 years and do actually care about my customers and take pride on the service I try and provide... and so do 99% of my collegues contary to what you might think. We are in no way perfect but do try our best to deliver the important things in life. like Gyro's to raptorheli2

Let us know how that Gyro goes Paul...
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08-04-2007 10:55 PM  13 years ago
z11355

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New England

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can we get back to talking helis and heli bits and not what a crappy country you folks live in?
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08-04-2007 11:06 PM  13 years ago
Maxists The Baddist

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North America

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Hey! That's the country that responsible for Doctor Who. That's a good show.
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08-04-2007 11:09 PM  13 years ago
9387ASH

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UK

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I must admit that RM has in the past had a bad track record but recently they have been superb !

When I ship ebay items out, 99% of the time they have arrived next day. That to me is impressive !
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08-04-2007 11:58 PM  13 years ago
Barney

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Inverness Scotland

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Remember a while back Tony..

I said for UK stuff try RM standard parcel for reasonable cost and service..you can also ask for insurance for the contents seperately Gets deliverd by RM letters...and unlike ParcelForce we don't use Regions Perfect for E-bay stuff

Back on Topic though...I know raptorheli struggled to get his 720's to work out for him and decided on the 611's so the Spartan will be an interesting comparision.

Me I'm very happy with both my 720's at present..nice consistant piro rate when it's blowing ( I fly at 700'ASL on the top of an unsheltered hill).

At 3DM I listened to a talk by Colin Mill (Mr CSM) who demonstrated using his test rigs how Gyro's worked etc..

One thing became clear from his talks is that Servo performance is currently behind Gyro performance in that the current offerings although very fast are lacking in torque and blowback is becoming a problem in extreme situations..

He pointed out a marked improvement can be made by fitting longer tailblade bolts...as they acted as a counter balance assisting the servo's performance..

Unfortunately the development costs of producing a suitably fast AND powerfull servo was prohibitively expensive for CSM to pursue and had to be shelved and reckoned the way forward was moving to HV (7.2v) servo's to maximise performance in the not to distant future. Very informative talk from a smart fellow.
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08-05-2007 05:33 PM  13 years ago
raptorheli2

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rip off britain and no changing it

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little update for you barney.

yes i had as much luck as the lucky rabbits foot gave to the rabbit with 720's and subsequently went to 611's as mentioned.

the spartan gyro uses a similar mounting method to the csm as you can see from the pictures. it turned out for my application (trex nitro, not tried synergys yet) it was far too soft so i'm using a single 0.5mm pad that you can get from csm. you would be aswell epoxy the gyro on as this stuff is hard but it works for me on this heli.

1. the gyro is similar to a 720 to setup as everything is done by toggle gain and moving rudder left or right.

2. the stops are not quite as crisp as i want and is like every 720 i've had out the box, this obviously can be tweaked with the software.

3.the piro consistancy is up there with the 720, i tried a few high speed rippers while starting heli on its side and trying both directions and it was good doing this and a marked improvemnt on my current 611's and as good as my 720's were previously. i managed a couple piro walls of death and general flying in roughly 20mph winds doing things that would normally upset my 611 and it was fine altough there is a fine line between wagging and piros being good gain wise.

4. i have fed back a couple of things i think would improve the gyro as has dokey so a firmware update (come to that in a minute) will fix this and is being worked on just now.

5.dokey has said to me he needed more deadband. i think thats likely because he's been used to 720's where as i'm used to 611's. i felt it was fine but i also noticed a difference going from 720-611 so i'm not surprised but then again thats what the software is for if you so desire. it feels exactly like a 611 while in the air and holding power is as you would expect.

6.on the trex nitro i found it liked a shorter servo arm to get the gain up. this was fed back to spartan but i suspect it might be different on another heli as even my 611 is down at 25% to stop wag. thats a powerful tail alright but need to try and get the gain up a little so different blades would probably help.

7.firmware, spartan will release the firmware on their website so we can apply it which is a major benefit for me as it's not always ideal sending gyros back to factory to be updated.

8.there will be a programming card released so the gro can be adjusted at field without the need for a pc.

there is a few more things in the pipe line for the gyro that have not been done yet with any other gyro so stay tuned.

i'm sure dokey will fill in what he found soon but at the moment i'm very happy with mine and more to come.

cheers

www.waterfoothelis.com
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08-05-2007 05:44 PM  13 years ago
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Interesting observations, RaptorHeli. I've wondered if perhaps the foam wasn't too soft on the 720 I had as well. I don't fly that heli often but I though perhaps I should switch it to Zeal tape. Perhaps I'll try this with the ds760. I'm sure Spartan will address this right off if it is the matter.Mark Webber
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08-05-2007 05:48 PM  13 years ago
raptorheli2

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rip off britain and no changing it

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i don't have any 720's left now but i tried all types of foam, hence i have 3 packets of csm foams sitting spare so i could mess about with it on the 760ds

have you flown the gyro yet?

cheers

www.waterfoothelis.com
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08-05-2007 07:10 PM  13 years ago
Barney

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Inverness Scotland

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What I'm not keen about with the current tapes is the thickness which successfully eliminates motor/mechanics vibs is counter productive in that it is like mounting the Gyro on a floppy wobbling tower..

A quick way to experiment with mountings is to use a thin velcro strap over the gyro to adjust the downward tension on the pads and if necessary wedge some EPP foam on the sides of the gyro. (use some double sided sellotape to attach) between the frames to eliminate any wobbling...

I like to mount my 720's fairly firmly i.e so it minimises the Gyro Wobble as it seems Rotor Vibration is the culprit at high collective cyclic inputs and sudden changes in direction. This type of wobble can become exagerated the further the Gyro is from the mainshaft

In my experience Motor vibration is usually caused by an excessively rich mid range engine mixture.. small side to side wag that goes away under power.
The motor almost gurgling very slightly at hover and at lower headspeed but then it disapears when moving up to Idle 2.. i.e the carburation setting is varying depending on the particuliar Motor RPM you are using...e.g Normal, Idle 1, Idle 2

If you go too hard you will get vibration drift which is like a steady drift one way...

Mountings are just all part of fun!..

Me for for the 600N..With the 720 gyro, 13mm horn, 70% gain (DX7) Gyro in standard settings, standard mounting with a 'Postie' Rubber band on the canopy posts and threaded down through the frames and back up over the Gyro for security and to limit excessive side to side movement works pretty good

Going by your pics I take it the Spartan Gyro is one piece design? no box of tricks to get broken
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08-05-2007 07:17 PM  13 years ago
raptorheli2

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rip off britain and no changing it

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alright brian, yeah it's one piece and it's smaller than a 720

it's funny how some gyros you need to mess about with mounts. why is it the 401/601/611's 99% of the time work on the stock mounting systems and the rest don't?

i was getting quite bad tail kick trying big ben/pitch pumps with the spartan gyro on the stock mount. i switched it to the stuff on it now and it's perfect. i should say the mount is not final yet and what one will work best is still being decided so when it's released people will have a lick and stick mount solution for the most part.

as you said if you get a steady drift it would indicate the mount is too hard. i.e swap the foam for something a little thicker.

cheers

www.waterfoothelis.com
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08-05-2007 07:42 PM  13 years ago
Autoeject

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Ashtabula, OH, USA

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No, I haven't gotten to fly the production unit yet. Raining today...and that's a good thing It should be ready for IRCHA, however.

I did get to try the prototype on for a bit but I can't remember what tape I used then.
Mark Webber
wai-rc.com
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08-05-2007 08:54 PM  13 years ago
Angelos

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nr Oxford, OX11, UK

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Going by your pics I take it the Spartan Gyro is one piece design? no box of tricks to get broken.
I have just added a photo on our website that shows the other end of the wire harness. Also the user guide is now available to download.

-Angelos
Spartan RC R&D
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HomeRC & Power✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterRadio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt › new spartan gyro finally arrived.....thanks royal mail!
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