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Home✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-BladeOtherBrushless DD Tail w/ GY401 - Sweet! (Video)
04-06-2007 11:48 PM  13 years ago
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Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Brushless DD Tail w/ GY401 - Sweet! (Video)
I got tired of burning through brushed motors and repairing the carnage when they failed so I decided to give brushless a try and now couldn't be happier - The reliability & predictability has provided a huge boost to my confidence

I paid $49+Shipping for a Feigao 1208436L & CC TB-9 combo
Later replaced it with a Medusa 012-030-4000 (motor only) for $30+Hardware&Shipping

Tail Components:A good how-to article on going separates:
http://www.helihobby.com/html/separate_electronics.html


A few pics of the mounted motors and component layout

 
Mild 4 minute video: http://media.putfile.com/beachcp

Updates:
  • Using E-flite 18" Lightweight Servo Extension for tail wire which fits through the boom without need for cutting and soldering (only needs separated & staggered to fit)
  • Soldered the ESC power leads together to eliminate the power Y-harness
  • My AR6100 RX became faulty from all the abuse I put it through so I replaced it with an AR6200 which I'm using successfully w/o the satellite RX
Flights / Hours:Minutes / To Date: (Feigao)
208flts / 27h:44m / 06-24-07
(The Feigao burned up and I'm now using a Medusa - runs cooler - no flight records though)

May 2008 - After about a year of heavy use my Medusa tail motor gave out - Replaced with another Medusa tail motor for hopefully another good year

 
The rest of my current setup:Spektrum DX7 Tail Arming/Disabling Mixes:

    [PROG.MIX2] [PROG.MIX2] [PROG.MIX2]
    THRO> RUDD RUDD> RUDD AUX2> RUDD
    RATE: 0% or RATE: + 100% or RATE: + 100%
    - 100% 0% 0%
    SW:HOLD SW:HOLD SW:HOLD
    OFFSET: 0 OFFSET: -100 OFFSET: 0
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04-07-2007 12:30 AM  13 years ago
Gyronut

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Martinsville In.

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Thanx for the report.

I also am in serach of the perfect DD tail setup.
Rick
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04-07-2007 01:01 AM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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That is because the stock 3-in-1 gets in the way of a DD's true performance. A separate esc brings out its potential as well as the gyro's.Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 01:28 AM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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You're right about the 3-in-1 vs separates -

But I was using a GWS ICS-300Li ESC with EDP-50XC motor before and thought that was about as good as it gets - But I think this brushless setup seems even better
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04-07-2007 01:45 AM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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Well good find. In what areas is it better? I find my ICS50 powered DD tail very solid now. Holds well backwards or upwards.

The only thing that separates this from a belt tail is deceleration. It doesn't quite have that belt tail snap when you stop the tail.

Can you post of a video of quick tail moves and then stopping? I don't care much for piros since any tail can do that.
Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 02:34 AM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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What stands out the most is the absolute stillness of the tail and the smoothness of control - The GY401 is a good deal responsible for the nice feel though after being used to the G90 -

I just flew 2 more packs and with the first got a little wag coming out of a wild piro-flip but dialed the gain down a hair and haven't seen a wag since - Second pack I managed to get wild and blow it out but it recovered immediately where the brushed setup would let an extra piro escape before gaining full recovery -

I'll see what I can do about getting some stops and punches etc on video to share.
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04-07-2007 02:41 AM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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Oh a flip would be nice too.Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 03:11 AM  13 years ago
Hodakaguy

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Kennewick WA

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Glad to hear that it worked out so well. I'll have to take a look at it, may want to do the same with mine :-) Couldn't find my pitch gauge so hopefully tommorow I will find it and get my brushless setup up and going.

Thanks for the help today.

Hodakaguy
"We can't risk another full frontal assault..........That Rabbit is Dynamite!"
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04-07-2007 03:42 AM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Maybe I'll let you try mine out - We could do a head-to-head comparison of brushed vs brushless -

I just flew another pack to really test out the stops and punches -

50% gyro gain - 100% ATV -

Pirouetting right is faster rate but slower stops as it's the motor powering the piro and up to the torque to stop it (takes about 90°-120° to come to a stop) -

Pirouetting left is slower but stops are immediate as the torque powers the piro and the motor stops it pretty quick without a lot of bounce

Punches were like held in a vice - I had +/-9° to start then bumped it up to +/-10° or so and it still held firm.
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04-07-2007 05:01 AM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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Yup, characteristics of a motor tail. Can stop better coming off a left turn because of the motor's power. Slower stops coming off a right turn because prop merely decelerates. Unlike a driven tail where pitch goes into reverse.

I guess I should to try it. The big difference will be in how it feels. No video can capture that. Thanks for the heads up.
Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 05:09 AM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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I thought it was acting a little odd with the G90 on the bench so I dug out my old 401 to try and it still seemed a little odd on the bench but better behaved than the G90 IMO - I was really afraid I was going to have to go back to the brushed setup until I could acquire some different components to try - So when I test hovered it I was really surprised that it not only worked at all but worked great -

I hadn't tried the GY401 since I was using a 3-in-1 which it didn't seem to get along with and the G90 did - I continued using the G90 with separates and never bothered trying the GY401 again until now -

I was perfectly happy with the brushed DD tail - The reason I tried brushless was for longer motor life as brushed mileage seems to vary - My last motor only gave 10 good flights then went to mush and failed
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04-07-2007 06:30 AM  13 years ago
eddo22

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moorpark, ca

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My Current Setup:
Stock BCPP Airframe/Head
Park370/4100kv/10T
TB-18 BL Main ESC
255mm V-Blades
Hornet Light Paddles
Feigao 1208436L/4122kv
EP3020 DD Prop
TB-9 BL Tail ESC
GY401/HH/DS
HS-55s
TP1320S3
DX7/AR6100
That is one hooked up micro...nice!
ed g
knight 3d carbon
dragonus sa
blade mcx
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04-07-2007 08:31 AM  13 years ago
LouInSD

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San Diego CA USA

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Sounds like a great setup. I just realized I have a spare Logictech 2100 sitting in the tool box waiting for the new Rex to get here. I think I'll try it out on my Blade.

Anyone tried a 2100 on a Blade? It automatically detects the servo so what if you're not using a servo?

IS there a thread around on how to setup the brushless and the seperate esc?
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04-07-2007 09:19 AM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 12:22 PM  13 years ago
vsnyder8

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Ft Wayne, IN

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First off, Great thread, Micro-Maniac it sounds like you have a really good setup, and I really appreciate your listing of parts with url's.

I have gone part way with bl main motor and esc after trading in my 4:1 for a 3:1. I now need to reconsider maybe going all the way with seperates, you sound like it was a good imporovement.

Could I talk you into taking some pics and posting them of your heli, so I could see how you mounted and ran your wires, this is such a small bird, placement is critical, and it sounds like you have yours done right.

Again, great thread, and nice diagram Gino
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04-07-2007 12:37 PM  13 years ago
Gino CP

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Philippines

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Ditching the 3-in-1 for a Telebee 6g gyro and GWS ICS50 esc does wonders for the DD tail. I can only imagine how better it is with the brushless tail.Turn on a dime. Flip like a quarter. Feel like a million bucks.
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04-07-2007 05:46 PM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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LouInSD
Here's a detailed article on going separates - It's the same with brushless -
http://www.helihobby.com/html/separate_electronics.html

vsnyder8
I'm using Spektrum gear and don't really have to worry about placement so the wiring and components under my canopy is just a big rat's nest - I will try to post pics though.
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04-08-2007 02:22 AM  13 years ago
Hodakaguy

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Kennewick WA

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Thanks for letting me try your cub, I'll have to look into a foamy for myself. I'll let you know how the Cp comes out.

Great flying on your CP!

Hodakaguy
"We can't risk another full frontal assault..........That Rabbit is Dynamite!"
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04-08-2007 02:51 AM  13 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Thanks for letting me fly your stock CP to remind me how horrible the stock tail is - I don't think I possess the skill to handle a stock CP anymore - Major contrast to my CP - You shoulda tried mine out - Woulda been like flying my cub compared to your CP -

And thanks for the prop swap - The little mounting screws that came in that 4530 adaptor set work on my Feigao motor better than the ones I got with it.
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04-08-2007 08:12 AM  13 years ago
tvr_vixen_2500

rrApprentice

Chicago IL USA

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Just on the hovering end it's amazing to be able to set the power and hover a full pack without touching the rudder channel. With the ducted tail it can Piro fairly quick fast enough to launch the battery off. I have learned not to do that this wasn't just the velcro the rubber bands snapped.

I'm glad someone besides me sees how good this set up really is.I still use the stock TX/RX and it's still stable as a granit slab. Oh before I forget my vid of the ducted tail was prebrushless post is 100% more solid.
Any landing you can walk away from is a good one!
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Home✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-BladeOtherBrushless DD Tail w/ GY401 - Sweet! (Video)
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